CANADA Canada - Audrey Gleave, 73, Ancaster ON, 30 Dec 2010 #8

[Deleted member 102539]

This sound might inspire awe or anger, but it is an attention getter..

Chevrolet Camaro ZL1 - Start Up Sound - YouTube

Thank you very much! I didn't get the full benefit of the sound and wanted to look/hear once more and then my computer hanged himself. Today is not my day (and yesterday wasn't also). :notgood:

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

To FromGermany:

A few weeks ago, MY computer committed suicide every six minutes! :floorlaugh: Things will get better!!

OK, back to my scenario:

AGREED - Perp 2 would/could be MK.

And.......perhaps AG was the one to crate the dogs because Perp 1 was "uncomfortable" around the dogs. Then AG welcomed Perp 1 into her home.

Maybe CF is young and close but how would CF gain access to AG's house without forced entry? Perp 1 knew the garage code. :drumroll:

Question:

Did Perp 1 confide in 'Aud'/'Bary' about his sexuality? I say YES more than likely. Or, she came right out and asked. And perhaps that's why she didn't want to attend the wedding. Perhaps AG had been through those types of charades herself years ago????????????????

Where did the CAKE end up? Do LE have it? Was it ever found? Did PK eat it whilst sitting on his car bumper waiting for police to show up? Was there ever really a cake?

:cake4u:

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

This sound might inspire awe or anger, but it is an attention getter..

Chevrolet Camaro ZL1 - Start Up Sound - YouTube

Apologies if this sounds like nitpicking (not my intention :blushing but in the video the guy is deliberately revving the car on start up in order to make it sound like this. Then, it drives away quite quietly.

There's no need to rev a car like that unless you're in a big hurry to get it in gear and get away!

My own humble and (perhaps) dumb thoughts.

:blushing: :twocents: :blushing:

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

This one is also idling quite loudly :blushing: BUT please notice:

1. When the driver opens the doors, the car BEEPS!

2. Also, once in the car there's a DING-DING-DING sound to tell the driver to put his seatbelts on.

AG's dogs would easily have heard the BEEPS to open the car doors!

[video=youtube;9iF6z-igsOk]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9iF6z-igsOk[/video]

When I arrive home in my 'Vette, my car also BEEPS when I lock the car doors and then our birds scream loudly!! (Mommy is home for treats). :biggrin: I suspect the neighbours can hear the BEEPing a bit. Not much though.

:twocents:

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Thank you very much! I didn't get the full benefit of the sound and wanted to look/hear once more and then my computer hanged himself. Today is not my day (and yesterday wasn't also). :notgood:

:seeya: This "computer disease" is going around. My husband's laptop just konked out and my laptop is lasting for only a few minutes!! UGH!!

It must be 'one of those days'!!

hdear: hdear: :bricks: :lol:

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

Ohhhhhhh, one more thing about Camaros! :rockon:

I wonder if AG had the automatic start on her car keys/car opener thing! It's really handy to get the car going in winter or rainy days. Once started, the car will start to warm up and defrost the windows. Or put the air conditioning on in summer.

I, sadly, don't have that on my car. :doh:

 

[dreamwatcher]

This whole hoopla made by det. s. hrab, about a sexual component, is to my mind way out there. He was known for sensationalism on his cases. He even arrested the wrong man.!! He was eventually replaced.
Since the primary investigation was so minimal, this case is now cold.
And it will be a miracle if it is ever solved.
I couldn't help but notice how quickly her possessions were thrown into dumpsters and taken away, how quickly things were settled with great dispatch. One would think that selling of a home where a murder has taken place would be difficult to sell on the market, but NO, luckily a couple who lived in the nhbd stepped in and bought it.

Apart from posters on Websleuth who keeps this unsolved murder fresh in the minds of those who read this site, the murder of Audrey Gleave is long forgotten.

Not one word by The Spec newspaper on the anniversaries of her death. No further appeals made by law enforcement. Not one offer of a reward - Nada.
The silence is deafening.

Keep up the great work. Perhaps law enforcement may be needled into doing more to solve this case.

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

This whole hoopla made by det. s. hrab, about a sexual component, is to my mind way out there. He was known for sensationalism on his cases. He even arrested the wrong man.!! He was eventually replaced.
Since the primary investigation was so minimal, this case is now cold.
And it will be a miracle if it is ever solved.
I couldn't help but notice how quickly her possessions were thrown into dumpsters and taken away, how quickly things were settled with great dispatch. One would think that selling of a home where a murder has taken place would be difficult to sell on the market, but NO, luckily a couple who lived in the nhbd stepped in and bought it.

Apart from posters on Websleuth who keeps this unsolved murder fresh in the minds of those who read this site, the murder of Audrey Gleave is long forgotten.

Not one word by The Spec newspaper on the anniversaries of her death. No further appeals made by law enforcement. Not one offer of a reward - Nada.
The silence is deafening.

Keep up the great work. Perhaps law enforcement may be needled into doing more to solve this case.

"the murder of Audrey Gleave is long forgotten."



This depresses me greatly. I've often wondered WHY I stick with it. No one is listening.......just the few of us here.

Maybe it's time to call it a day.

:no: :runaway: :no:

 

[Deleted member 102539]

This whole hoopla made by det. s. hrab, ..........................................................................
After all, the pants were ripped.
Apart from posters on Websleuth who keeps this unsolved murder fresh in the minds of those who read this site, the murder of Audrey Gleave is long forgotten.

Not one word by The Spec newspaper on the anniversaries of her death. No further appeals made by law enforcement. Not one offer of a reward - Nada.
The silence is deafening.

Keep up the great work. Perhaps law enforcement may be needled into doing more to solve this case.

I don't understand, why only a few people worry about the enlightenment. Friends, neighbours, ex-family members - nobody helps. What's the reason?? Is inexplicable to me.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

To FromGermany:

A few weeks ago, MY computer committed suicide every six minutes! :floorlaugh: Things will get better!!
I like this expression!!
OK, back to my scenario:

AGREED - Perp 2 would/could be MK.

And.......perhaps AG was the one to crate the dogs because Perp 1 was "uncomfortable" around the dogs. Then AG welcomed Perp 1 into her home. Yes, is my thought.

Maybe CF is young and close but how would CF gain access to AG's house without forced entry? Perp 1 knew the garage code. :drumroll:
Yes, noone but perp 1.
Question:

Did Perp 1 confide in 'Aud'/'Bary' about his sexuality? I say YES more than likely. Or, she came right out and asked. And perhaps that's why she didn't want to attend the wedding. Perhaps AG had been through those types of charades herself years ago???????????????? Yes, good idea, could be!

Where did the CAKE end up? Do LE have it? Was it ever found? Did PK eat it whilst sitting on his car bumper waiting for police to show up? Was there ever really a cake? Yes, I think there was really a cake, otherwise his story wouldn't have fit.

:cake4u:

Stone, I noted some answers down. (Websleuths program says: my text is to short, therefore I'm writing this .......... )

 

[dreamwatcher]

Yes, it can be depressing at times, and at times it can be a lonely road writing about the murder of Audrey Gleave, I know that I have made very few posts on her case.

However, you would be surprised as to the number of folks who read websleuth, so I am hoping that perhaps a journalist will read your thread on Audrey and bring it back to their readers.

I am sticking to my guns lol when I say that Audrey knew her killer.
She may even of had an appointment to meet him in her garage - someone whom her "coffee friends" knew nothing about, and she let him in.

I think the meeting was to be of a business nature - perhaps she gave investments of money to this individual and did not receive the returns as promised, and he killed her, rather than being exposed.

Murdering of an old woman, often involves money (Greed) - not lust - no sexual overtones, just rage, hatred and yes, even fear of her.

And we do know that Audrey could be someone that no one would like to contend with, if she became upset. She demanded loyalty and honesty, and god help the person who double crossed her or took her for a fool.

I think someone whom she knew for a long time and whom she trusted gave him money for investment, and for some reason the investment went out the window. When she met him in the garage she was prepared to either to get her dividends or her cash back - as well as some kind of slip for tax purposes.

Note the time of year - near the end of the tax year, which would mean income for the year ending to claim on her taxes, and I think there is a section where you can deduct part of your investment, and there are different types of deductions for seniors as opposed to non-seniors.
That is why she had the meeting with him - and he couldn't produce.

Just my humble opinion.
PS Pant seams will rip when body gases in death build up. In this case, they ripped down the side of her pants. just my thoughts .....

 

[deputydawg2]

Take heart, folks! Thanks to some priceless help from my treasured friends, I think together we made a breakthrough yesterday!

This snake-infested rabbit hole is deep, with many side tunnels, but dimly I see a light :candle: and behind it Audrey is beckoning to me, "come on, old gal, come on..."

I want so much to share what we've learned with all of you who have hung on so long, but before I can do that I must investigate thoroughly some possible connections and then put it all into words and form which are permissible. I'll do my best to try to do that as quickly as possible.

Yes, I know there may be dead ends ahead, and possibly another fruitless endeavor, but I don't think so this time.

I can say this much now: The key is the first question that should be asked in a murder case, "Who benefited?". Next is: In what way did that person or group benefit?

You good people all know part(s) of the answers to those questions.

Success or failure, I promise to let you all know how this turns out.
dd2

 

[Chorley8]

This whole hoopla made by det. s. hrab, about a sexual component, is to my mind way out there. He was known for sensationalism on his cases. He even arrested the wrong man.!! He was eventually replaced.
Since the primary investigation was so minimal, this case is now cold.
And it will be a miracle if it is ever solved.
I couldn't help but notice how quickly her possessions were thrown into dumpsters and taken away, how quickly things were settled with great dispatch. One would think that selling of a home where a murder has taken place would be difficult to sell on the market, but NO, luckily a couple who lived in the nhbd stepped in and bought it.

Apart from posters on Websleuth who keeps this unsolved murder fresh in the minds of those who read this site, the murder of Audrey Gleave is long forgotten.

Not one word by The Spec newspaper on the anniversaries of her death. No further appeals made by law enforcement. Not one offer of a reward - Nada.
The silence is deafening.

Keep up the great work. Perhaps law enforcement may be needled into doing more to solve this case.

Ok same compliment a great post. I think as many of us as possible should call in with queries or comments to Hamilton. They are for sure trying to squash the case I think but that doesn't mean nobody bristles at that in LE. Lots of good coppers beside the dross and the corrupted by time or something from the outside!

IMO solvable case.

 

[dreamwatcher]

Gases do build up when the body fluids gather in the abdomen upon death. I will have to look it up, but there is a time line. Depending upon the temperature of her garage.

Here again, PK noticed that her pants were ripped at the side. The above could very well explain it. Perhaps that was the sexual component det h was speaking about.

PK never said anything more ie; he did not say that her breasts were exposed etc.,, which could be considered a sexual component.
By all accounts she was fully dressed with her winter jacket on as usual.
He was a witness, and he answered websleuth members questions honestly, I believe.

I don't know what constitutes a trophy - there was word that a small hatchet? was found in the ditch. This could have been left by Audrey or PK when gardening in the fall imo. I think at one point it was implied that the killer took this hatchet from the garage and dropped it in the ditch.
I don`t consider this as fact - so ......

PK did not find her dismembered in any way. In fact, upon discovery he thought she slipped and fell.

Yet det H gathers the press right outside her residence, and says this is the most horrible and vicious crime I have ever come across, or something to that effect. Then he says there is a sexual component to it - then the press picks up on this and calls it a sexual murder......

So, I will take the word of the first witness, one who discovered her in the garage. The one who called 911 - and that is PK, In fact, PK was asked by the 911 dispatch to return to the garage and see if he could detect a pulse.
Now, why would that even be asked of him, if she was dismembered or terribly butchered. No - he returned and felt for a pulse as was requested of him by 911.

I think PK gave honest and forthright answers. No way would he lie on the internet, especially since he was one of the suspects, since he was the person who discovered her. No way would he come onto websleuth and answer questions if he was guilty of this crime.

Hamilton cops probably have their hands full, and it is easier to let Audrey`s case lay to rest, after all she was on old woman, somewhat eccentric and they don`t have any family members calling them up on a regular basis screaming for answers.

That`s part of the problem.
JMO of course.

 

[Chorley8]

I think PK gave honest and forthright answers. No way would he lie on the internet, especially since he was one of the suspects, since he was the person who discovered her. No way would he come onto websleuth and answer questions if he was guilty of this crime.

This from DW

Well it depends he might or he might not depending on how egoistic, triumphalist, overbearing - I don't know much about the guy and you are quite possibly right in your assessment. I lack data on just about everyone involved in the case.

If you look at the posts that brought him here he sounds anxious almost like looking for help from a friend asks "what should be expect next?" from LE says he loves us (note I have never seen this attitude on a crime forum before at least not at first) tries to be helpful not such much in solving the crime but in pleasing, placating I might almost say staving off....."us". Absolutely in media says best 'not to look into it" advised thinking of Audrey as she was alive, slight gesture to wishing to know who did it but really not much. Posts on weird business FB Happy New Year sorry just strange strange strange. Not very freaked out. Young guy has he known a lot of people who get murdered? Would be should be BIG in mind days following. Maybe afraid of LE and trying to put on 'business as normal" face.

Says posts on WS have been close to the truth to me it appears to me THAT that brought him on NO indication it is any inclination to solve the crime.

That I think is the mystery. What were the truths and they would have to be unpublished truths that he knows about but either held back or was advised by LE to hold back but that posters here were close to? I mean at the point of commencement here.

 

[Chorley8]

Hamilton cops probably have their hands full, and it is easier to let Audrey`s case lay to rest, after all she was on old woman, somewhat eccentric and they don`t have any family members calling them up on a regular basis screaming for answers.

DW post

Hamilton has a surprisingly low homicide rate and there is absolutely no excuse or reason for Audrey's case to go on any back burner. There would be endless alcohol induced domestic squabbles and minor drug stuff but this is murder and SUPPOSEDLY the would have no confidence the killer would not strike again.

But there seems to be a strange feeling that the killer is not going to strike again. Why?

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Yes, it can be depressing ....................

I think the meeting was to be of a business nature - perhaps she gave investments of money to this individual and did not receive the returns as promised, and he killed her, rather than being exposed.
.....................................................................................
I think someone whom she knew for a long time and whom she trusted gave him money for investment, and for some reason the investment went out the window. When she met him in the garage she was prepared to either to get her dividends or her cash back - as well as some kind of slip for tax purposes.
Note the time of year - near the end of the tax year, which would mean income for the year ending to claim on her taxes, and I think there is a section where you can deduct part of your investment, and there are different types of deductions for seniors as opposed to non-seniors.
That is why she had the meeting with him - and he couldn't produce.

Just my humble opinion.
PS Pant ............................................

Very interesting and already posted a few times - but how do you get it??

 

[No_Stone_Unturned]

:bang: I'm soooooooooooooo confused I could call it quits.

Here's how I read the latest posts:

- PK would never lie on the internet even though his polygraph was "inconsistent" :bang:

- Hamilton cops are busy, incompetent and possibly one of them did lie about it being the most horrific crime seen in years :bang:

- and now after all these people (PK, LV, JV, LF & family, etc.) the killer is a member of the BRIDGE group :bang:

- after all the work about cars and horses and SV and SL and a connection now it's none of those :bang:

All I can say is this - perhaps the person(s) in the bridge group should be told to Hamilton LE.

hwow: :chillout: hwow:




:cheers:

 

[Chorley8]

:bang: I'm soooooooooooooo confused I could call it quits.

Here's how I read the latest posts:

- PK would never lie on the internet even though his polygraph was "inconsistent" :bang:

- Hamilton cops are busy, incompetent and possibly one of them did lie about it being the most horrific crime seen in years :bang:

- and now after all these people (PK, LV, JV, LF & family, etc.) the killer is a member of the BRIDGE group :bang:

- after all the work about cars and horses and SV and SL and a connection now it's none of those :bang:

All I can say is this - perhaps the person(s) in the bridge group should be told to Hamilton LE.

hwow: :chillout: hwow:

Sorry No Stone not trying to drive you crazy perhaps I should do as I have been doing and let those who are exploring the horse car etc. angle keep working on it in peace! It is true we have way too many suspects. But t is always possible it is "something else" as in solved Baby Hope case LE on the case for decades was CERTAIN it was parents never suspected the cousin charged.

 

[dreamwatcher]

No Stone, you are doing a great job - you and a few others have come up with fresh thoughts and theories about Audrey's death.

I just think it was financial, and by someone that she knew - and not someone in her bridge club. It is, perhaps, too late - re financial - as everything has been closed.

Yes, PK is an odd duck. I think somewhere between PK's version and det. H (as to sexual component lies the truth) PK was dispassionate about the whole thing - very true. And yes, he was concerned about him being a suspect and turned to websleuth to find out "what's next".

I also noted that he attempted to control or correct the info on this site, Which brings me to - Was this his motive for being on this site, or was he genuinely worried about being a suspect and what could happen next. Obviously, he went onto the internet searching for information on Audrey's death.

The statements that he made about the condition of the body etc., the request made by 911 to go back and take her, pulse can all be checked out by law enforcement. -- and law enforcement do read social websites - and no doubt websleuth would be checked from time to time. He is bright enough not to lie about that imo.

I have been led to believe that law enforcement has some forensic evidence - is it dna?
Does anyone know if cops said that they have forensic evidence (which could be a number of things) and not necessarily dna.

I can't help but wonder why this case has been left sitting in limbo, and especially, if one says that the crime rate is very low in Hamilton.

DW