Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #1

[Sarahlou]

Still thinking this is murder/suicide. I think he wanted it to look like they had both killed themselves. It's all very bizarre but I think this is most likely.

 

[otto]

THIS has been sticking with me since the "jackets" were first reported.

Also, they reported that Honey may have been killed elsewhere in the home. Wonder how they know it was only she who may have been killed elsewhere and not Barry as well. If the "evidence" is bodily fluids released after death, they had to have done DNA on that fluid to determine whose it was and that can't have happened as quickly as it was reported IMO.

There was staff in the home between the likely time of death and the discovery of the bodies. I'm sure they would have cleaned up anything that needed to be cleaned up, so information about bodily fluids from time of death would likely have to come from staff rather than DNA.

 

[Jasper52]

I'm of the belief this was a double homicide. Time will hopefully tell.

 

[otto]

Yes. And my next question was : WHY ? Why hang her body from the pool railing ? Something important here, imo.

They were in a half sitting position, hung from the pool railing, I'm guessing looking over the pool. It seems like there's some sort of odd message about looking out over the water, but perhaps that location was chosen because it was easiest for handing suicide, out of the way and the camera was disconnected.

 

[AzPistonsGirl]

There was staff in the home between the likely time of death and the discovery of the bodies. I'm sure they would have cleaned up anything that needed to be cleaned up, so information about bodily fluids from time of death would likely have to come from staff rather than DNA.

Well that'd make it even more unbelievable for anyone to assert that it was she who may have been killed elsewhere IF the theory is that there were fluids from said death elsewhere in the home and on her person when discovered and these 2 fluids match.

 

[Jasper52]

Well that'd make it even more unbelievable for anyone to assert that it was she who may have been killed elsewhere IF the theory is that there were fluids from said death elsewhere in the home and on her person when discovered and these 2 fluids match.

There were other rooms in the basement - she could have been killed in one of those rooms or the garage. IIRC, the staff never went downstairs that day.

 

[meanmaryjean]

I would say murdering someone by hanging them in a sitting position would be virtually impossible as all they would have to do is sit up and take the strain off the belt. They would have to physically hold them down which would cause secondary injuries that would be quite evident. If you are going to hang someone intentionally you have to get their feet off the ground. Anybody that is hanged from such a low bar has done it intentionally or accidentally. Thats just common sense.

BBM: The belt may have been applied while sitting - true - but then he/she/they were pushed off the edge is what I am imagining. The bar is low- true- but RIGHT next to the pool edge. Imagine yourself hanging by the neck, feet and lower body in the water, arms immobilized. how exactly are you going to 'just sit up? Or pull yourself onto the edge of the pool to get slack on the belt? I don't think it could be done by a contortionist, much less a 70 year old person.

I have no clue WHO is responsible for this right now, but my gosh, what horrible way to die!

 

[Tortoise]

Well that'd make it even more unbelievable for anyone to assert that it was she who may have been killed elsewhere IF the theory is that there were fluids from said death elsewhere in the home and on her person when discovered and these 2 fluids match.

If Honey was dragged from the scene of her death there could be a trail of evidence from wet/soiled clothing which would enable them to make a visual determination of this, particularly if there is evidence BS died by the pool.

 

[Snoop Sister]

Still thinking this is murder/suicide. I think he wanted it to look like they had both killed themselves. It's all very bizarre but I think this is most likely.

I tend to agree. Honey was obviously taking great care of herself ie physical trainer, looks to be an awesome dresser, and in my opinion she has had some plastics done. Perhaps, Barry was jealous or had some cognitive malfunctioning that just made him snap. Who knows....

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

Still thinking this is murder/suicide. I think he wanted it to look like they had both killed themselves. It's all very bizarre but I think this is most likely.

Agree. I doubt we'll ever know why he chose that location and method. People in that frame of mind do not think rationally.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

 

[Tortoise]

I don't know if this has already been posted. Could be for tax reasons.

"The couple died after listing their house for sale, part of a plan to move into a larger property; the Globe and Mail reports that a second Toronto house was recorded in Honey Sherman's name last year."

https://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo...spicious-deaths-of-billionaire-toronto-couple

 

[zencompass]

Most of the info on here so far is from unnamed sources and speculation. LE is perusing this case as a suspicious death. Very little info has been released by TPS.

Dear Tarika,

Exactly !

None of the following was from an official police statement:

1. Honey Sherman killed in a secondary area
2. Men's belts were used
3. Jackets pulled down onto their arms
4. Cameras in the pool area turned off

These have all been from a "source" in the newspapers.

All of the above points may or may not be true - depending on whether the source is viable and whether the source received incorrect information.

In fact, a "source" from the police apparently said they were looking at this as a "murder-suicide". This statement was in the newspaper before post mortem examinations were done.

Did one person have defense wounds and the other didn't? I think this could only have been verified during the post mortem examination.

Just my opinion.

 

[gdalton]

If she died in the dressing room then he could just take the elevator to the basement.Then he could go back the same way and get the jackets and belts.Just speculation.

We're not sure the elevator is actually there.
It shows up in the house plans...which means nothing...apparently construction problems galore...hence, 20 years of lawsuits against builders.
The RE listing mentions "Potential For Elevator".

 

[zencompass]

The children may have already hired a private investigator/forensics specialist to go over all of the evidence the police have found.

 

[liz b.]

They were in a half sitting position, hung from the pool railing, I'm guessing looking over the pool. It seems like there's some sort of odd message about looking out over the water, but perhaps that location was chosen because it was easiest for handing suicide, out of the way and the camera was disconnected.

Otto, Hard to figure out the belts being used ? If the belt was wrapped around someone's neck, how would whatever belt length was left fit around the railing, and be tied to keep it from slipping off ? Would there be enough belt length ? A necktie might have worked better ?

 

[JayFriend]

What kind of belt is long enough to go around a neck and a railing?

Until we see crime scene photos, which we won't, I would assume their necks and the railing would have been in one loop of the belts. For all we know, they may both have been strangled or subdued elsewhere, then attached to the railing. We will just have to wait for the police report, which may take some time.

 

[AzPistonsGirl]

maybe it was a belt from a men's robe.

 

[JayFriend]

Even with all the sources coming out it's still in the back of my mind that police said no forced entry but more importantly - they're not looking for any outstanding suspects.

That's the craziest part, unless the police are still sticking to the murder/suicide theory.

 

[liz b.]

They were in a half sitting position, hung from the pool railing, I'm guessing looking over the pool. It seems like there's some sort of odd message about looking out over the water, but perhaps that location was chosen because it was easiest for handing suicide, out of the way and the camera was disconnected.

And so Honey was dragged or lifted and carried to the pool area, after her death ? IDK about a murder suicide. Barry was smart enough to know LE would see that Honey had been killed elsewhere ? Curious to know if they had their cell phones near them ? If they had cell phones, were the phones located, and who was the last contact on each phone ?

 

[liz b.]

maybe it was a belt from a men's robe.

So two robe belts then ?