Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #6

[musicaljoke]

RBBM

That 's what I want to know too; How could BS purchase Apotex without using ANY of the assets, goodwill, property of business of the Empire companies?

The shares in the Empire Companies were owned by Sherman and Ulster Limited (“S & U&#8221. In 1969, S & U, entered into a share swap with the shareholders of Vanguard Pharmacy, S & U’s largest customer. As a result of this transaction, Sherman & Joel Ulster no longer controlled S & U.

In 1974, Sherman founded Apotex.

https://www.canlii.org/en/on/onsc/d...TaGVybWFuIGFuZCB3aW50ZXIAAAAAAQ&resultIndex=2

 

[Bluehorse]

Sphinx "Pamela, you make a very good point. What if Barry really did kill Lou ?"

Louis Winter COD was from an aneurism, so I do not think that BS could have had anything to do with his death. Brian aneurisms are a common COD and surely an autopsy would have been performed. My mother came from a family of seven and two of her siblings died of aneurisms when they were in their early forties. They both had young families.

ETA: When BS received the call LW has passed, he was told it was a probable aneurism.

Just bouncing off your post, a 'bleeding event' or 'brain bleed' (an aneurysm), can also be the result of taking too much blood thinner, such as Plavix. I know because my mother had one (not fatal but she was immediately taken off blood thinner). Not that I think Barry's uncle was murdered but it is an interesting thought given the relatively rare event of death at 41.

 

[human]

There have been some quotes in news articles that said that Barry used his charitable donations as a way to wield power. They are also tax deductible against your taxable income. Do the calculations and see for yourself how much he really gave.

https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/20...etimes-used-to-wield-political-influence.html

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/chrts-gvng/dnrs/svngs/clmng1b2-eng.html

As far as BS giving the W children money ? If you read just the actual court document Winter v. Sherman, 2017 ONSC 5492 (CanLII) you will see that BS did NOT inform the children of thier options to work for the company or inform them of the option to purchase shares.

https://www.canlii.org/en/on/onsc/d...TaGVybWFuIGFuZCB3aW50ZXIAAAAAAQ&resultIndex=2

He also did not give them money as outlined in other cases,he lent them money as proved here in Mintz & Partners Limited v. Winter, 2013 ONSC 354 (CanLII)

https://www.canlii.org/en/on/onsc/d...TaGVybWFuIGFuZCBXaW50ZXIAAAAAAQ&resultIndex=1

I'd posted something regarding KW's commenting on news articles on December 20th. They have now been removed. I saved a partial copy .

EVERYTHING is IMO

How old were the children that he would have to inform at the time?

 

[Grey-St]

Not necessarily. Lawyer could have approached the Winter kids with the prospect of a billion dollar lawsuit on contingency which would give the law firm a huge chunk of that, 30-40%. It would have had to be based on contingency because there is no way the kids could have afforded such an expensive lawsuit.

I don't hear anything from KW about how it caused him any anguish at all to sue BS. Just listen to the vitriol, his accusations that BS asked him to murder HS (which polygraphs indicate are a lie.) That is not anguish, that is hate.

I think the OP means the anguish came from their findings about the original clause, not that sueing BS necessarily caused them anguish (although, evidently, it probably did). I also think that the law firm working on contingency also shows their commitment to and deep belief in KW's case.

I also do agree though, that KW is full of hate today.

 

[Grey-St]

I don’t disagree with you, but shouldn’t Royal Trust have had an obligation to inform the children of the agreement about the company and, indeed, serve the children’s best interest?

Short answer, yes.

 

[human]

Oh, I'm sure he had receipts and wrote it all off to save taxes.

He could have saved taxes by buying personal jets and racehorses and sport’s teams.

 

[Researchnut]

RBBM

That 's what I want to know too; How could BS purchase Apotex without using ANY of the assets, goodwill, property of business of the Empire companies?

This is exaclty my point. In order to purchase Empire in the first place, BS had to borrow money from his mother. It's highly suspect that he didn't use money from the sale of Empire to fund APOTEX. I'd love a week to go over his finacial statments between the sale of Empire and the purchase of APOTEX.

One of the main reasons that the Winter kids lost in court was that BS " did not own or use any of the assets, goodwill, property of business of the Empire companies" to fund APOTEX.

IMO no way and no how did he not use the proceeds of that sale.

 

[kay74]

Look at all of the children of ultra rich that lose their wealth. For instance, some of the heirs of the Johnson and Johnson fortune. Many examples.

Barry bought a company that was not doing well.

It was his skill and brains that made it work.

Yeah and the Johnson & Johnson kids had their own parents. Not the same situation at all.

 

[AllyJane]

I'm not so sure the adoptive family was bad at all. KW hates them but he seems to blame everyone (adoptive parents, BS/HS, Royal Trust) but himself, he's not exactly objective.

Sounds like KW hates everyone. He needs to take accountability for his contribution to his current situation and past life choices. Yes he may have had some bumps along the way, but he seems to carry around bitterness and wears it like a badge. I thought forgiveness was part of the 12 step program but I am not 100% sure.

 

[Grey-St]

LW died of an aneuryism. KW has been proven a liar. KW was 4 at the time of his dad's death so I think it is all about the money for him. KW, even though adopted to a wealthy family, is not happy with his life and wants someone to pay. I am not sure why after last night's show, anyone can trust anything KW has to say about BS.

There's so much I don't believe! Preposterous was a great word for it. I also see validity in his desire to seek some sort of justice. The two can exist.

 

[PaulR]

There's so much I don't believe! Preposterous was a great word for it. I also see validity in his desire to seek some sort of justice. The two can exist.

And KW did not want justice. He wanted "revenge", that is his word from an interview: https://torontolife.com/from-the-archives/barry-sherman-bitter-pill-from-the-archives/

 

[human]

But see, that's what I find is strange in all of this. Bankrolling failing businesses, hemorrhaging money, etc. As someone stated previously, it's almost as though he had an inability to be emotionally attached or invested in anything, mentoring anyone or offering his business insight into how to make this a more successful venture. Just a strange component from my observations. JMO.

He gave people money to do their dreams. Would his interfering be welcome? I have noticed people do not like advice. They want to do things their own way.

 

[AllyJane]

If the boys had been brought up by their bio parents they would have been part of their father's business and would have succeeded. Instead they were cheated out of a loving family and brought up by two people who did not love them and lanquished. For a kid to have to leave home at 15 yrs. old says it all. People on here who disagree, came from loving homes, do NOT understand. It's so easy to judge when you have not been in this situation.

How do you know they would have succeeded? They were given $15 million from BS to do what they wanted and I am not sure any are huge financial successes. I know people who left home at 16 with nothing and became very successful. And leaving home was the issue with the adoptive family who was wealthy. And there were 4 orphans that were adopted together. Not sure they all left at that age or we can honestly say they were unloved.

Statistics show that a second-generationbusiness has only a 53 percent chance ofsurviving 10 years, and a third-generationbusiness less than 32 percent,according to the Institute for FamilyOwnedBusiness. That means that nearlyhalf of all companies passed downfrom parent to child end up failing withina decade.

 

[human]

Sounds like KW hates everyone. He needs to take accountability for his contribution to his current situation and past life choices. Yes he may have had some bumps along the way, but he seems to carry around bitterness and wears it like a badge. I thought forgiveness was part of the 12 step program but I am not 100% sure.

Someone on WS has information on Injustice Collectors. He is not on this thread. KW sure fits the Injustice Collector. Many murderers are Injustice Collectors.

 

[Quinnergirl]

You said Barry looked out for Barry, implying that's the only person he looked out for. People who only care about themselves generally don't cut eight figure checks to charity.

For what it's worth, I believe HS was the driving force behind the charitable actions of the Sherman Foundation. Her parents were Holocaust survivors and were likely dependent at one time on the charitable deeds of others. Barry's charity seemed to centre around people he liked (eg. FD). JMO

 

[AllyJane]

There's so much I don't believe! Preposterous was a great word for it. I also see validity in his desire to seek some sort of justice. The two can exist.

Seeking justice is one thing. Seeking revenge is a bit different. KW seemed to sway to the latter on last night's episode. Wonder why they didn't interview any of the other brothers (I know Dana had passed away) about the circumstances around this deal? I can understand that they didn't want to be part of it but are they supporting KW's ongoing legal efforts?

 

[Grey-St]

I'm not sure anyone would buy a business where the children of the original founders had an implicit right to work at the company and could purchase part of the business after meeting certain criteria. Does anyone here want to be KW's manager and business partner, because that's exactly what the agreement was supposed to indicate.

FYI, remember that the stipulation about working for the company and being able to buy part of it was not the wish of Lou or Beverly Winter. It was the request of Royal Trust:

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/rep...family-feud-comes-to-the-fore/article1069800/

We don't know what Lou Winter would have wanted.

KW today? Probably not. But he was just a child when that happened. I would like to think that there are many folks out there, both business savvy and with human decency, that would have seen value and validity in that agreement.

Also I can only assume that Lou and Beverly would hold the best interests of their children to heart.

 

[Crosby87]

Not according to the court documents. They lost because BS didn't use ANY money, assets etc. from the sale of Empire to start APOTEX which IMO is highly suspect. This was stated in the court documents.

This is very interesting IMO https://www.lexology.com/library/detail.aspx?g=d086014b-9790-40c5-9ec4-668d534b3f24

It talks about BS resisting the producing of financial documents and then produced limited versions. If you have nothing to hide why not freely share?

ALL IMO

Also ,we do still use the term wack-wacked. It may not be used in all circles.It's street language maybe picked up from movies but still used. Depends on who you know . Just some of our organized crime families this list is missing many of them and we also have organized street gangs https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_criminal_enterprises,_gangs_and_syndicates#Canada

RBBM

I'm surprised BS was allowed to get away with this nonsense. It doesn't seem fair or right for that to happen in a Court of Law imo

 

[minorone]

Just bouncing off your post, a 'bleeding event' or 'brain bleed' (an aneurysm), can also be the result of taking too much blood thinner, such as Plavix. I know because my mother had one (not fatal but she was immediately taken off blood thinner). Not that I think Barry's uncle was murdered but it is an interesting thought given the relatively rare event of death at 41.

Louis Winter passed November 5, 1965; my aunt and uncle both suffered fatal aneurysm's in the 60's as well. Plavis was introduced and produced in 1997, so it would not have been a drug available to BS or LW at the time of his death.

My uncle's aneurysm's happened at work & was immediately fatal. My aunt suffered severe headaches over a lengthy period of time. My aunt was admitted to a psychiatric institute as they considered her to be mentally unstable & a hypochondriac. The autopsy revealed that she had suffered numerous minor strokes before she succumbed to the fatal one. My aunt may have taken pain medication, but I do not recall my uncle being on any meds.

 

[Pamela_Brewer]

Lou Winter died of an aneurysm. Very sudden, no warning and at 41, it was no doubt autopsied for COD

Sherman's dad died 8 years before Lou Winter, so 1957?
Which would have made BS
25?
I'm just trying to figure out how old BS was when his own dad, died, when his uncle died and when the nephew Dana died.

* not accusing him of killing anyone, I'm just curious as to a timeline there.
MOO


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