Canada - Barry, 75, & Honey Sherman, 70, found dead, Toronto, 15 Dec 2017 #6

[Hazel]

We have discussed this, BS stopped it when he was accused of murdering the Winter father.

Could you please link where that was said? Is that on the lawsuits?

As far as BS giving them $$ and houses, etc., how can someone take away GIFTS?

Let's say your uncle deposits/transfers $$ to your bank account, or buys a house for you, how can he take it back?

If a GIFT, the house will be in your name, full paid for.

If a GIFT, once the $$ is deposited/transfered into your bank account, how can your uncle ask for it back?

IMPOSSIBLE, right? So that means all that was NOT a handout, was NOT a gift.

I fail to see the generosity, if all can be taken away at any point in time.
When I give someone a gift, it is for them to keep FOREVER, no strings attached, but that's just me and maybe that's why I'll never be a millionaire, let alone a billionaire. ALL JMHO

 

[human]

I see KW as an entitled BS’er who will never be happy no matter what. He should be happy that Honey and Barry were brutally murdered but it is still not enough.

I guess that his parents were focused on the mother’s illness instead of the children. And no one knew the children would need therapy to deal with it.

Them adopted out of the family and whatever else. Yes, he had tragic things.

If it is only about Barry being made accountable, then why the lawsuit still for money?

 

[human]

Could you please link where that was said? Is that on the lawsuits?

As far as BS giving them $$ and houses, etc., how can someone take away GIFTS?

Let's say your uncle deposits/transfers $$ to your bank account, or buys a house for you, how can he take it back?

If a GIFT, the house will be in your name, full paid for.

If a GIFT, once the $$ is deposited/transfered into your bank account, how can your uncle ask for it back?

IMPOSSIBLE, right? So that means all that was NOT a handout, was NOT a gift.

I fail to see the generosity, if all can be taken away at any point in time.
When I give someone a gift, it is for them to keep FOREVER, no strings attached, but that's just me and maybe that's why I'll never be a millionaire, let alone a billionaire. ALL JMHO

Don’t know where the reference is. Many people have brought it up on here many times,

As far as a gift, he gave them money of $20,000 a month but it sounds like,KW’s three homes that were taken back had a payment plan. KW got almost 8 mil he had to forfeit.

Is that bad? Having homes and money for businesses? I think we all know handing out money with no strings is not a wise decision. After all, Barry knew KW had drug issues. Working for something is always a better idea.

 

[human]

I am curoius. Do people think parents should give their kids everything with no stipulation? We helped our kids but they had to particpate as well. For imstance, we made the downpayment on cars, but they had to make payments and keep up their grades.

I do have to say when my son moved out, we found contracts we had made with him. My husband and I laughed and laughed. We hardly upheld any of the conditions for when my son did not hold up his end of the contract.

But we weren’t handing out millions to a drug user. Seriously,Dana was in jail for the possiblity of being a murderer. What would other people do?

Simply hand out millions and call it a day?

 

[JDG]

Could you please link where that was said? Is that on the lawsuits?

As far as BS giving them $$ and houses, etc., how can someone take away GIFTS?

Let's say your uncle deposits/transfers $$ to your bank account, or buys a house for you, how can he take it back?

If a GIFT, the house will be in your name, full paid for.

If a GIFT, once the $$ is deposited/transfered into your bank account, how can your uncle ask for it back?

IMPOSSIBLE, right? So that means all that was NOT a handout, was NOT a gift.

I fail to see the generosity, if all can be taken away at any point in time.
When I give someone a gift, it is for them to keep FOREVER, no strings attached, but that's just me and maybe that's why I'll never be a millionaire, let alone a billionaire. ALL JMHO

According to KW, he had to sign promissory notes. Not gifts, loans. BS set them up but was leaving himself an option if things went south. He knew he was dealing with people with drug problems.

It becomes very complicated.

 

[JDG]

Awh, I see! Are you thinking that they may have been murdered later in the evening, after returning home from dinner? That would put someone's alibi into question, wouldn't it?

I can't see it as a drive thru, pay cash at Tim Hortons kind of dinner, but dollars to donuts if they had a sweet little dinner date, the police know about it by now. If I had a gabillion dollars, I'd have a regular Wednesday night dinner date too.

I hope they did!

He was a work a holic, probably grabbed something from the cafeteria or Honey brought something for the three of them to eat during the meeting.

Between his desire to work and being very frugal, I doubt they went out to dinner. Thats just something posted here.

TPS never mentioned 'dinner date'. Meeting with architect at Apotex, Honey left first, Barry came home later.

 

[chissus]

Could you please link where that was said? Is that on the lawsuits?

As far as BS giving them $$ and houses, etc., how can someone take away GIFTS?

Let's say your uncle deposits/transfers $$ to your bank account, or buys a house for you, how can he take it back?

If a GIFT, the house will be in your name, full paid for.

If a GIFT, once the $$ is deposited/transfered into your bank account, how can your uncle ask for it back?

IMPOSSIBLE, right? So that means all that was NOT a handout, was NOT a gift.

I fail to see the generosity, if all can be taken away at any point in time.
When I give someone a gift, it is for them to keep FOREVER, no strings attached, but that's just me and maybe that's why I'll never be a millionaire, let alone a billionaire. ALL JMHO

I think BS and HS took the money and the houses away because they wouldn't stay off drugs.

 

[canadiangirl]

Thank you, deugirtni! What I see is what appears to be a bruise on the top fleshy part of KW’s left hand between his thumb and forefinger. I imagine a belt wrapped tightly around the hand followed by strangulation of someone could cause such an injury, IMO.

KW is a site supervisor and IMO does not do the construction work but supervised the work of others in the trades and therefore an injury like the one I see IMO would be unlikely.

If the bruise was severe it may well take a long time to fully heal, especially on an older man, IMO.

I’ll go back to reading now as I don’t want my comments interpreted as derailing the discussion here. Thanks again for your response, deugirtni!

I hope Mr. and Mrs. Sherman’s murder will be solved soon and that their family finds answers that lead to peace and acceptance. IMO, none of them deserved the horror that they have experienced.

ALL MOO.

Good to see you!

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[Hazel]

I wondered about belts from robes that might be worn after exiting the pool.
I don't know anyone with an indoor pool.
I have been to a few gyms with an indoor pool and thick Terry cloth robes are readily available.
Maybe someone with an indoor pool could chime in on if they have robes near the pool to wear.

Has it ever been stated that men men's belts were leather or pant belts?

Is the tie on a robe even considered a "belt"?
MOO

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I'm still catching up, apologies if this has already been answered.
The following information comes from the Private Investigators, not the official TPS:

The ligature neck compression, sources say, was likely done by two men’s leather belts found at the scene wrapped around the necks of the victims.

They were found in a seated position at the side of a pool in a lower level of the house, with their legs facing away from the pool.

The belts were around the neck, with the end of the belt through the buckle and pulled tight. The free end of each belt was then looped or tied around a low railing that surrounds the pool.

Sources say a working theory of the private team probing the deaths is that the Shermans were strangled by the belts, then the belts were attached to the railing, holding them in a seated position.

https://www.thestar.com/news/canada...-honey-sherman-were-murdered-sources-say.html

 

[canadiangirl]

If he was he wouldn't care. He's not their killer.

How do you know this?

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[canadiangirl]

Respectfully, your assumption that I don't understand the trades is incorrect. I work in the construction field and have for much of my adult life.

Yes, of course anyone can get a bruise, but I simply made an observation about a specific person who inserted himself into a murder investigation and put himself in the spotlight as - IMO - a potential suspect. After seeing the camera zoom in on KW's hand, I found it to be an odd camera shot that I think would have been edited out if it had not had some meaning. Of course I could be wrong but it is just my opinion.

All MOO.

I can see the thought process behind that.... Especially with a camera zoom.


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[kay74]

How do you know this?

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I don't know what I all put in this post. I probably said because of all KW's blabbing and being right in your face, so to speak, I don't think a killer would be doing that. JMO

 

[Hazel]

Barry’s Mustang car was towed from the garage by LE. If he drove the Mustang to work as set out in the FE show, he could have arrived home and parked right in the garage. The access to the house from the garage is on the lower level, near the pool entrance. So BS may never have been upstairs after he got home. Jmo

It seems it was snowing the evening of December 13th, 2017

Search Results: December 13 , 2017 Toronto City
https://www.theweathernetwork.com/ca/weather/historical-weather/ontario/toronto

Max Temp: -6.6 °C

Min Temp: -13.1 °C

Mean Temp: -9.8 °C

Precip Accumulation: 0.2 mm ​

https://www.timeanddate.com/weather/canada/toronto/historic?month=12&year=2017​

 

[Doghairrules]

You're right, ruled is incorrect, however I disagree that LE's murder suicide theory was unfounded and rushed..

""A police source confirmed to the Star that an early working theory for investigators was that the deaths were a case of murder-suicide. =

https://www.thestar.com/news/crime/...ut-the-deaths-of-barry-and-honey-sherman.html

Of course you are free to disagree, but the fact that LE has now determined it was a double murder speaks for itself, IMO.

 

[Grey-St]

Yes, I know. Maybe the killer didn't come to the house until soon before Barry arrived. I just can't make sense of the method of killing. And I'm not so sure if we can make a lot of LE's "targeted" comment.

I suspect LE had reason to say what they did re: targeted. Also, maybe the killer(s) didn't have access to a gun, or if they tried to acquire one, that would be risky as then that's one person out there that knows a piece of the puzzle. Maybe they didn't have access to a gun that couldn't be traced to them? Or maybe they didn't have access to a gun that wasn't used in another crime, that could lead to them?

Either way it looks targeted to me, and there's a level of thought and organization to it.

 

[brightii]

I thought the same, that going public was therapeutic for him, part of the grieving process. Seems to me that BW has been suffering for many years -- he couldn't believe that BS would lie to him!! He admired him, and as he said in the FE episode, he even saw BS as a father figure. The betrayal hurt him deeply, and will take many, many years for him to heal (if ever).

I can imagine him talking about what BS did to him and his brothers over and over with some people, and now he saw the opportunity to tell his story to the whole world.
That must have taken a lot of weight off him

He is not hurting for the full grown man he is now. He is hurting for the little boy he once was, for all 4 little boys, that he couldn't protect then.
:cow:
Disclaimer: All just my humble opinion, I don't know any of these people, I'm just an observant websleuth.

Oh my goodness, Hazel. I can tell by your post that you are a very compassionate person but IMO your compassion in this case is misplaced. When I recall the FE interview with KW it is so disturbing that all I feel about him is a genuine terror. He demonstrated no empathy for the Sherman victims or their family who just lost their parents/grandparents/siblings etc. in the most horrific circumstances and went so far as to reveal in graphic detail how he fantasized about decapitating BS and watching his severed head roll down the driveway at Apotex. How much more gruesome must the imagery get before one realizes that KW’s thinking is seriously disordered and his demeanour is threatening?

Would you want to be in his company? Would you trust such a character? KW had so many opportunities in his life to make something of himself even if his cousin BS had not been so supportive of him and his brothers. IMO, KW will focus all of his time and energies on ruminating endlessly about perceived slights, rejections, injustices by BS and likely many others who failed in his mind to indulge his sense of entitlement.

I have experience with people very much like KW and trust me, it’s very challenging to say the least to have someone like him in one’s life. KW will blame everyone but himself for his misery and will not accept responsibility for his actions to improve his life and his prospects. It is simply so much easier to blame others for his woes and I’ll bet BS and HS were/are not the only family members that distanced themselves from KW. If the man has any conscience whatsoever he is a master at hiding it.

ALL MOO

 

[Peace777]

I'm really surprised there are so many here who think KW didn't do it.

I don't think I've read a justification for that thinking, except allusions to his lack of intelligence. I never thought it took intelligence to murder. Just a pair of gloves and a balaclava maybe. Mind, it would have got quite sweaty after a 3 hour wait, unless he was waiting outside in the bushes.

Has TPS named KW as a Person Of Interest yet? I thought we can't be discussing anyone in particular until they were named a POI in the case?

 

[Tortoise]

Has TPS named KW as a Person Of Interest yet? I thought we can't be discussing anyone in particular until they were named a POI in the case?

They haven't said anything about suspects but KW named himself as a suspect. Linked a few days ago. Something like "I am a suspect and I have to be careful what I say."

 

[brightii]

I can see the thought process behind that.... Especially with a camera zoom.


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Good to see you as well, canadian girl! Always nice to reacquaint with friends! 😁

All MOO

 

[brightii]

I’m using my phone and when I’m on this site all the text is now in bold. Is this just my phone or are others noticing this change, too?

All MOO