CANADA Canada - Ben Tyner, 32, cowboy, horse returned w/o him, Merritt, British Columbia, 26 Jan 2019 - #2

[Trudie]

I would be surprised if RCMP would cover the cost of an audit - not likely. It would be up to the owners to pay for it.

I agree. But I think the owner would be willing to assist in the investigation, no matter the cost.

 

[MistyWaters]

@otto I wanted to touch in this again. Assuming an audit was requested immediately, it should be complete by this time. Do you agree? I don’t mean a 20 year audit, more like 2017 forward. Tysm

On your theory, who are you referring to that would’ve immediately request this audit? A company’s financial records are audited annually at each year end. That’s a responsibility of the owners, not the employees. I’m not quite following, are you suggesting you think NR is in financial difficulty and nobody was able to determine the reason prior to the hiring of Ben?

 

[Trudie]

I would be surprised if RCMP would cover the cost of an audit - not likely. It would be up to the owners to pay for it.

Actually the normal accounting firm for the owner would have the info readily available, imo. Where I live, the State police would order a forensic audit.

 

[MistyWaters]

Actually the normal accounting firm for the owner would have the info readily available, imo. Where I live, the State police would order a forensic audit.

Yes here too but first there must be evidence of fraudulent activity associated with a company, which is also a crime of course. But we don’t have any reason to suspect Ben was murdered for that reason, other than guessing, is that correct? The owners of the company surely must know the financial state of their business without asking police to check into it.

 

[ktm44]

How so? I don’t think there were any fields up there. The logging road was on Swakum mountain, was it not? The reference to Swakum Ridge indicates it’s also located on Swakum mountain?

Anyone feel free to correct me if I’m understanding the layout of the land incorrectly.

It's my understanding that NR had crown grazing leases. cattle have no problem wandering. Crown grazing leases have a specific date in which livestock must be removed and that date would have been late fall so any left behind when they were gathered could have strayed a fair distance.

 

[MistyWaters]

It's my understanding that NR had crown grazing leases. cattle have no problem wandering. Crown grazing leases have a specific date in which livestock must be removed and that date would have been late fall so any left behind when they were gathered could have strayed a fair distance.

Thank you for adding your thoughts. Crown grazing leases could be the reason other ranchers might’ve initially believed Ben was out searching for stray cattle in that same area.

 

[zecats]

Yes here too but first there must be evidence of fraudulent activity associated with a company, which is also a crime of course. But we don’t have any reason to suspect Ben was murdered for that reason, other than guessing, is that correct? The owners of the company surely must know the financial state of their business without asking police to check into it.

It doesn't have to be fraudulent activity. There's a distinct possibility that the ranch, plain and simply, wasn't brining in revenue. The last manager , that I can find listed (MW), was let go along with the hay production sale 2 years earlier (1 1/2) He then moved on after managing for many years. The seemingly sudden need for NR owners to hire a college degreed new manager (Ben) absolutely suggests that better financial oversight was needed, maybe a new area of earning (logging has been suggested) was being considered or enhanced, and even to help bring the ranch out of the red. These are absentee owners, for the most part and that doesn't always lead to sufficient supervision. JMO

Bradner R Farms assumes haying operation at Nicola Ranch - Merritt Herald

MW, however, will be leaving the farm in the summer after a transitional period helping Bradner R Farms get up to speed with the operation, and is one of the four still out of a job.

MW said he doesn’t think his position as ranch manager will be refilled as it will be redundant with the leasee.

 

[ktm44]

Thank you for adding your thoughts. Crown grazing leases could be the reason other ranchers might’ve initially believed Ben was out searching for stray cattle in that same area.

Yes, it seems he'd conducted similar searches in the past and may have simply made an offhand comment that he'd like to look again on his days off, next available chance, etc.

Crown leases are also often why ranchers end up in disagreements with the public over hunting & fishing access. Leases are usually large tracts and people don't always see cattle when they enter so they're inclined to leave gates open, intending to close when they leave or not bothering to close when they leave.

 

[otto]

Totally Off Topic - Notre Dame Cathedral in Paris is burning!

 

[Trudie]

Totally Off Topic - Notre Dame Cathedral in Paris is burning!

@otto Merritt search continues with some questioning if cowboy’s disappearance is suspicious
It’s believed Tyner and his horse were likely taken into the backcountry by trailer, but despite pleas for information, no one has come forward
***********
I know this has been posted numerous times. This should clear up the debate as to how Gunny got to Swakum area. (It is believed.)




OT: awful fire, on HLN now.

 

[zecats]

Totally Off Topic - Notre Dame Cathedral in Paris is burning!

Huh! What! Looking now. (Also OT, but wow!)

 

[Trudie]

It's my understanding that NR had crown grazing leases. cattle have no problem wandering. Crown grazing leases have a specific date in which livestock must be removed and that date would have been late fall so any left behind when they were gathered could have strayed a fair distance.

Ben actually posted some pics on his SM of what appeared (imo) of his team bringing cattle down to NR.

 

[zecats]

Wrong spot

 

[zecats]

B.C. RCMP suspend renewed search efforts for missing cowboy

April 14

There are still more questions than answers after renewed search efforts for a missing B.C. cowboy were called off on Friday evening.

RCMP Sgt. Janelle Shoihet said Ben Tyner, who was living in Merritt, B.C., at the time of his disappearance on Jan. 28, is still unaccounted for.

The search was conducted by the Southeast District MCU and the Merritt Detachment with support from Air Service, the Tactical Troop, ‎and the RCMP Underwater Recovery Team and Police Dog Service,” Shoihet said in an email on Sunday morning.

“The investigators still need to determine the next steps.”

Earlier this year, the RCMP revealed the disappearance was being treated as suspicious in nature.

On Sunday, Shoihet declined to comment on why authorities believe the disappearance may involve criminality.

“I can’t go into any specifics with respect to how the determination was made that his disappearance is considered suspicious,” she said.

 

[Trudie]

It doesn't have to be fraudulent activity. There's a distinct possibility that the ranch, plain and simply, wasn't brining in revenue. The last manager , that I can find listed (MW), was let go along with the hay production sale 2 years earlier (1 1/2) He then moved on after managing for many years. The seemingly sudden need for NR owners to hire a college degreed new manager (Ben) absolutely suggests that better financial oversight was needed, maybe a new area of earning (logging has been suggested) was being considered or enhanced, and even to help bring the ranch out of the red. These are absentee owners, for the most part and that doesn't always lead to sufficient supervision. JMO

Bradner R Farms assumes haying operation at Nicola Ranch - Merritt Herald

MW, however, will be leaving the farm in the summer after a transitional period helping Bradner R Farms get up to speed with the operation, and is one of the four still out of a job.

MW said he doesn’t think his position as ranch manager will be refilled as it will be redundant with the leasee.

From same link:

We made a cashflow decision in support of our cow herd,” said Williams.

Under this lease agreement Nicola Ranch will receive a percentage of the crop from Bradner R Farms, which will be in charge of growing the hay, using their own equipment to harvest it, said Williams.

“There won’t really be any money changing hands,” he said.

“We own the land and the irrigation equipment, and they’re going to be responsible for the operation and the variable cost of operating the farm,” he said.
************************************
It is moo from the linked info NR was suffering financially & 1+ year without management proved futile, thus Ben was hired. Therefore, I think a thorough investigation will include a forensic audit. LE must be looking for a motive.
Jmo

 

[MistyWaters]

B.C. RCMP suspend renewed search efforts for missing cowboy

April 14

There are still more questions than answers after renewed search efforts for a missing B.C. cowboy were called off on Friday evening.

RCMP Sgt. Janelle Shoihet said Ben Tyner, who was living in Merritt, B.C., at the time of his disappearance on Jan. 28, is still unaccounted for.

The search was conducted by the Southeast District MCU and the Merritt Detachment with support from Air Service, the Tactical Troop, ‎and the RCMP Underwater Recovery Team and Police Dog Service,” Shoihet said in an email on Sunday morning.

“The investigators still need to determine the next steps.”

Earlier this year, the RCMP revealed the disappearance was being treated as suspicious in nature.

On Sunday, Shoihet declined to comment on why authorities believe the disappearance may involve criminality.

“I can’t go into any specifics with respect to how the determination was made that his disappearance is considered suspicious,” she said.

Yes if LE still have unanswered questions, its no wonder we do too.

“Another search could commence in the future, Shoihet added, but it depends on what investigators decide.

“I don’t know what the next steps will be, the investigators will go back and figure out what the next steps will be,” she said. “They will still be going over any investigative avenues that have not already been covered.”....”
Search for Ben Tyner “done for now” - Merritt Herald

 

[MistyWaters]

Yes, it seems he'd conducted similar searches in the past and may have simply made an offhand comment that he'd like to look again on his days off, next available chance, etc.

Crown leases are also often why ranchers end up in disagreements with the public over hunting & fishing access. Leases are usually large tracts and people don't always see cattle when they enter so they're inclined to leave gates open, intending to close when they leave or not bothering to close when they leave.

This is one reason I think an unintentional confrontation with someone can’t be entirely ruled out at this point in time. Sadly it’s become all too common for a disagreement to erupt between two people, one becomes aggressive and then a physical fight occurs. Then the aggressor, who’s not as tough as he thought he was, pulls a knife. Most times there’s other people around who step in or call police on behalf of the victim. Particularly in this hypothetical example with nobody else nearby, if the aggressor already has a criminal record and is prone to committing assault, it’s highly unlikely he’d escort his victim to the nearest hospital.

 

[Sillybilly]

Last night Global TV had a clip about the search for Ben being suspended. Mentioned areas being searched were previously covered by snow. One comment that caught my ear was "police are hopeful they will be able to find his remains". When we combine that with Shoihet's wording of "how the determination was made that his disappearance is considered suspicious”, it is sounding more hopeful that they are heading in the right direction.

I find it curious they are referring to "remains" yet I haven't seen any indication of even one HRD dog in the entourage of searchers. Anyone else see any HRD dogs and handlers?

 

[MistyWaters]

Last night Global TV had a clip about the search for Ben being suspended. Mentioned areas being searched were previously covered by snow. One comment that caught my ear was "police are hopeful they will be able to find his remains". When we combine that with Shoihet's wording of "how the determination was made that his disappearance is considered suspicious”, it is sounding more hopeful that they are heading in the right direction.

I find it curious they are referring to "remains" yet I haven't seen any indication of even one HRD dog in the entourage of searchers. Anyone else see any HRD dogs and handlers?

Unless the media was keeping it quiet, nothing was reported about a forensics team arriving on site either. Usually if something important is discovered, the heightened activity around the search area becomes very noticeable as other team members arrive on site and the media shows no hesitation in reporting on it.

Maybe the statement “police are hopeful they will be able to find his remains” leads towards LE conducting other searches in the future?

(Link above)
“Another search could commence in the future, Shoihet added, but it depends on what investigators decide.”

 

[Trudie]

Last night Global TV had a clip about the search for Ben being suspended. Mentioned areas being searched were previously covered by snow. One comment that caught my ear was "police are hopeful they will be able to find his remains". When we combine that with Shoihet's wording of "how the determination was made that his disappearance is considered suspicious”, it is sounding more hopeful that they are heading in the right direction.

I find it curious they are referring to "remains" yet I haven't seen any indication of even one HRD dog in the entourage of searchers. Anyone else see any HRD dogs and handlers?

@sillybilly What about the dogs used at feedlot/compost area last week?
With spring melt, search for Merritt-area rancher Ben Tyner resumes
RCMP are out there. They're being supported by the tactical troupe, police dog services, air services are also out there, investigators from the Major Crime Unit, and then the Merritt RCMP Detachment."

(Police dog services I assumed to be HRD)

Police Dog Services - Royal Canadian Mounted Police