yes, I'm sure... but... does it specify where *the* hair that had the grass seed attached to it, was found? Was it with the rest? i thought somewhere else it had said 'trimmed' or something.. something that made me think a pile were 'trimmed' off at one time and put in an envelope.. was that one hair within that bunch/group? or was that one hair found individually? It really doesn't specify that.
GUILTY Canada - Diane Werendowicz, 23, raped & murdered, Hamilton, Ont, June 1981
- Thread starter redheart
- Start date
-
Martha Morgan - Murder on Oleander Dr. in Shreveport, LA, 19 February 2011
- Latest: Brightchaser47
yes, I'm sure... but... does it specify where *the* hair that had the grass seed attached to it, was found? Was it with the rest? i thought somewhere else it had said 'trimmed' or something.. something that made me think a pile were 'trimmed' off at one time and put in an envelope.. was that one hair within that bunch/group? or was that one hair found individually? It really doesn't specify that.
So many unanswered questions. Was she pregnant at the time? Or had that been in the past? Why had she stopped living with CV? Did CV live with her at her then-current address during the time they lived together? How familiar with the area was he? Was her usual path to/from Malarkey's to cut through the ravine? How long had she lived there?
You DO like details, don't you? lol
One really has to read articles and Tweets carefully. Wasn't there something about they would take her car, or from Etobicoke he would take a bus in the winter or motorcyle?
Something that just occurred to me. RB wasn't interviewed in DW's case (I don't believe?) until some 17 years later, after the DNA had been analyzed and police had obtained a sample of RB's from a Tim Horton's cup or something. At first when he was brought to the police station, he was questioned and he said he didn't know her and hadn't seen her, hadn't been with her. The release of that statement at his trial was the reason why his conviction was successfully appealed. He had not yet been able to speak with the counsel of his choice before making that statement, even though he had requested a specific counsel. He found out AFTER saying that, that they had collected his DNA and that it matched what was found inside the dead girl's body. Busted.
From that it seems that RB wasn't giving up any information willingly, and only when he knew they already had proof, was he willing to admit being with her on that night.
What if we take it a step further. His story *could* be true.. but of course, he wasn't going to risk telling them so, because it made him look guilty of also her murder. His own brother in law told him that he'd be the unluckiest guy in the world, or something to that effect, so he knew he was toast, if he told the truth.
So.. assuming that his story *is* true, that they smoked a joint and had casual sex.. it still doesn't make sense that he didn't drive her home, and that she just preferred to walk home stoned, intoxicated, and alone, in the middle of the night.
What if he had in fact driven her home, let her off at the front of her apartment building.. she quickly threw her jeans back on, didn't bother with her shoes or doing her buttons of her shirt up, just stuck her panties in her purse, and quickly ran inside and into her apartment, after quickly looking around and seeing that nobody would notice.
RB hasn't to this day admitted driving her home, because then it would make his story even *more* unbelievable in having to come up with an explanation for how she mysteriously ended up back outside of her apartment and in the ravine. Nobody would ever believe him. Best to just leave it and say she walked from Malarkey's. He doesn't want to go to prison for life, for smoking a joint and having casual unprotected sex with a stranger from a bar, so he lies.
She arrives inside her apartment, and there is CV, already in there, waiting at the door, staring her down, after wanting to surprise her. He sees her come in dishevelled like that, and puts two and two together.. he flips out, goes after her, the vase gets knocked down in the process, he completely loses it, grabs the first thing he sees, her purse, puts the straps over her head and twists. He comes up with the great idea of wanting to make it appear that she got mugged and raped on her way home from the bar, and so drives or drags her to the ravine, and etc., as per big post above.. takes her shoes with him.. removes the wallet to make it appear like some kind of mugging, finds the panties, leaves those there too, not realizing his own semen is on them from .... WHENEVER. !! Busted!!! Except the police don't give it any merit, and he gets away with murder.
From that it seems that RB wasn't giving up any information willingly, and only when he knew they already had proof, was he willing to admit being with her on that night.
What if we take it a step further. His story *could* be true.. but of course, he wasn't going to risk telling them so, because it made him look guilty of also her murder. His own brother in law told him that he'd be the unluckiest guy in the world, or something to that effect, so he knew he was toast, if he told the truth.
So.. assuming that his story *is* true, that they smoked a joint and had casual sex.. it still doesn't make sense that he didn't drive her home, and that she just preferred to walk home stoned, intoxicated, and alone, in the middle of the night.
What if he had in fact driven her home, let her off at the front of her apartment building.. she quickly threw her jeans back on, didn't bother with her shoes or doing her buttons of her shirt up, just stuck her panties in her purse, and quickly ran inside and into her apartment, after quickly looking around and seeing that nobody would notice.
RB hasn't to this day admitted driving her home, because then it would make his story even *more* unbelievable in having to come up with an explanation for how she mysteriously ended up back outside of her apartment and in the ravine. Nobody would ever believe him. Best to just leave it and say she walked from Malarkey's. He doesn't want to go to prison for life, for smoking a joint and having casual unprotected sex with a stranger from a bar, so he lies.
She arrives inside her apartment, and there is CV, already in there, waiting at the door, staring her down, after wanting to surprise her. He sees her come in dishevelled like that, and puts two and two together.. he flips out, goes after her, the vase gets knocked down in the process, he completely loses it, grabs the first thing he sees, her purse, puts the straps over her head and twists. He comes up with the great idea of wanting to make it appear that she got mugged and raped on her way home from the bar, and so drives or drags her to the ravine, and etc., as per big post above.. takes her shoes with him.. removes the wallet to make it appear like some kind of mugging, finds the panties, leaves those there too, not realizing his own semen is on them from .... WHENEVER. !! Busted!!! Except the police don't give it any merit, and he gets away with murder.
SC Tweet
Although he previously said li
He was with her Monday night before her death.
Well.. 'the devil is in the details', so they say, for sure! I'd love to have a transcript of the trial so that we hear everything, and not just the chosen parts that get tweeted.. impossible to tweet everything! I don't remember reading about her vehicle or him bussing it.. but regardless, is it possible he did have access to someone's vehicle that night? or is it possible that he could have kind of put his arm around her, holding her up, and 'walked'/supporter her almost-dead body to the ravine after strangling her? She wouldn't have been quite a dead weight yet.. ? If someone had seen him, they'd just assume she was intoxicated? Not sure how physically far the ravine was from her apartment?
Maybe we should picket with signs "Reopen the Case!"
That may be one more scenario, except the drive home part. CV tried to cover his tracks in the testimony by saying he gave her hell for walking home alone. and building up "the route." Like he laid down the plan to make sense for a ravine assault. But if he gave her hell,why did he let her walk home the previous Monday night alone when he was there with Tom? If he was so in love with her as friends have said, why didn't he drive her home or walk with her?
I might allude to him having her knocked off even which would make sense if she was pregnant and he couldn't have it.
Also, her friend left the bar at one and had parked at the back. If she was going to walk, seems to me her friend would see her around that time.
I see why it was a hung case but maybe it's different if you're actually there in the court.
I thought I had just read today that she hadn't been with him since the previous Friday, but I could be wrong.. it gets complicated and confusing when we're going between case law summaries from 3 previous trials, tweets from this trial, newspaper articles over decades, etc.. and some of them have conflicting information!
Why, 'except the drive home part'? It makes perfect sense.. it could explain a lot.. elaborate.. also, can you please post the link to what your'e referring to irt the monday night?
yes that's correct, BM was known as an assaulter later on, but that doesn't justify how the other 2 exes managed to not be investigated microscopically? And weren't two guys mentioned who lived in the same building as her (one being BM, although he was only 18 at the time, and AFAIK, he didn't yet have any sex or assault charges against him).
added; it wouldn't have been a jealous gf of RB, since nobody knew about his one-night stand with DW. it *could have* however, been a jealous sex partner of CV? But more likely CV himself.
no idea.. but she was also inebriated AND stoned, on top. Probably wouldn't have taken a lot to have her pass out.
i am so curious as to why RB changed his legal counsel. Did he want a new team, or did the old team not want another go at it? They seem to have done such a great job previously, at least a hung jury is better than a conviction. maybe he wanted to take his chances at going for the gold and getting a not-guilty verdict?
It does, but it doesn't make sense why RB would leave that out. It would help him not hurt him to say he dropped her off I'd think.
For the Monday see my Post #59 Here is part of the tweet
It could have been RB's fiance if she drove over there and caught him. A friend in that CAN LII doc also said she was seeing or thinking of seeing someone not attractive older but decided it didn't work out. could be him for all we know.
except her friend said she didn't seem drunk.
Anyhow I asked that because it would have to be enough time to deliver her to the swamp.
Wooosh! You got me searching and I found something dramatic. lol
First "Ironically, though Adler was initially approached by Badge-row’s amily because o his reputation as a DNA expert, the de-ence strategy ultimately had little to do with DNA"
Talks about the change in lawyer.
But more importantly this article talks all about what you were getting at regarding the alcohol level and TOD. It could be as late as 3 am!!!!
Go to the bottom of this article where is says "First Trial" I haven't finished reading, but thought I'd post it before you go to bed: http://www.therecord.com/news-story/4834000-clairmont-badgerow-and-defence-team-split/
Page 5. I guess this is SC's book
But I was just reminded about the young girl who testified to hear screaming after she'd fallen asleep. Her bedtime was 11:30. So maybe around 12. May or may not be pertinent. I read an article about rapes often lasting 30 min to 1 hr.
she (DW) may not have been acting drunk, in that she wasn't being stupid.. but her friends wouldn't necessarily have seen her ability to walk a distance, and depending on how much they were actually conversing with her, they wouldn't necessarily have known if her speech was slurred, or if her inhibitions were way down in the ground, or if the alcohol could have induced a depressed feeling which she sought to lift up by taking up an offer from a stranger, etc. lori had gone away from DW it sounds like, as soon as her other friends had arrived at 11pm (according to at least one version). Those girls saw her then consume 5-6 beers in that hour before she left.. meanwhile, lori had said that SHE had also seen her consume 5-6 beers during the time that she had been with her (9;30-11pm say).. so sounds like DW could have had a LOT of beer.. and then she smoked up after that? who'd be awake? And yet only just over the legal amount in her blood.. why was it not deemed that she died much later than suspected?
I really hope that RB's lawyer didn't dump him due to financial considerations.. sounds like he was excellent.
So what was the objection as to why DW's bf, CV, couldn't have been the murderer??
Similar threads
Online statistics
- Members online
- 139
- Guests online
- 1,070
- Total visitors
- 1,209