CANADA Canada - Nicole Morin, 8, Toronto, 30 July 1985

[Woodland]

Thank-you for asking palisadesk - my theory comes from the sum of all the parts - Nicole lived in a very large building with many tenants and got on the elevator twice that day - one return trip from top to bottom and apparently a second trip from the top - she was not seen either time. Nothing was found from a struggle - not a sandal, towel or anything else she may have been carrying. If she was off to meet a friend that was waiting for her, I don't buy she suddenly may have veered off willingly to do something else or go with someone else without letting her waiting friend or mother know. At 9, you know that someone leaving you standing and waiting for nothing to happen would not be appreciated.

I believe her friend btw when she said she spoke to 'Nicole' through the intercom. I just don't think it was Nicole and the friend had no reason to think otherwise.

Who was the last known person to interact with Nicole? Who independently verified seeing Nicole 24 to 48 hours before her disappearance?

Who kept this case in the public eye all this time? Who made public pleas to find Nicole? Who didn't?

The answers and lack of them help form my theory - and all is jmo.

 

[Chorley8]

1. We don't know that nobody saw her get the mail. LE has released few details.
2. Cal Millar wrote that a shoe was found on the elevator. I was hoping if true LE would release that info in their recent news conferences.
3. I don't understand the bit about her not letting her friend know - if we are talking about an abduction. So someone in Nicole's apt. said they were coming down pretending to be Nicole? Well lots of kids around if it was a daycare. But again why bother with this story. If you are making it up why do so in the context of so many witnesses?
4. Matou's theory is based on statistics I think there is no proof in any direction what happened to Nicole. For some reason LE is saying she could be alive. And I am not exactly sure what Woodland is thinking but if I understand the direction she/he is going I think it would favour a favourable outcome....Nicole being alive. Like the son.
5. Still think there must be some reason LE cleared the parents. We know there were lots of sightings LE hasn't told us about and they obviously still give a bit of credence to the woman who saw her get off on the ground floor. And certainly her Dad's pursuit of his lost daughter is exemplary but it is also unusual we can't expect that from every parent.

6. Palisadesk: about going away...yes of course she could be lured the references I was referring to were speculation Nicole might have been "in" on the abduction in some way.
7. All that said Woodland's idea does not contradict my idea in posts above or the info floated recently by LE of her alive. (Again this is just from what I understand WL to be saying could be missing something.)

 

[dotr]

Nicole does not look dissimilar from SMSK, a victim of D.M.H.imo.
Could there be any connection at all to that case?
Wonder if Nicole ever appeared, for whatever reason, on a tv show or other public medium, as did SMK?
Did Nicole ever participated in any sports competitions, such as running, like A.P., the 11 year old, victimized by Francis. C.R? ( Wonder if he spoke French....?)

imo.

 

[Chorley8]

First post on this thread. I am the same age as Nicole and grew up in Toronto. I remember this case and all the Toronto missing and murdered children of the 80's like it was yesterday.

In looking at Nicole's beautiful face, I see some ethnicity, does anyone else? I have tried to find a picture of her mother to no luck. Nicole seems to me to look like she is bi-racial, her father does not look this way to me at ALL.

Theory, Nicole is not her fathers bio daughter, Nicole's bio father came and took her just like the first father did of Nicole's half brother.

What do you do mean by bi-racial? Certainly lots of Quebecois have aboriginal or Metis ancestry. One thing about Nicole's prettiness/cuteness as a child it is interesting that all of the age enhanced pics of Nicole make her look plain to just slightly attractive and one actually made her look a bit unpleasant looking! This is actually important since it is possible that the artists have some ability to see how a person will age. And I am sure we all agree we are not hoping for a solution to the case because she was a cute kid! Need to keep an open mind if there is any possibility we are looking for a Nicole who is alive. I am not sure what to make of Det. Litster Macleod's musings on the side she could be alive. She sort of impressed me but in the following interview she was very much in the background though the dominant Det. didn't seem terribly up on the case (e.g. didn't think there had ever been an award in the case with LM demurring in the background). Who knows maybe she just got carried away with that idea cause of a recent exciting tip. Here on WS we think of these people working all the time on these cases but around the time of the news conference she was already pulled away to be borrowed by Toronto Homicide etc. There are very few pure cold case detectives in Canada I know there was one (!) in Sask. a few years ago.

Dotr I think she may have spoken French I would think a bit - but I don't know for sure. I do conjecture (and it is what we are stuck with to a large degree) that Nicole was targeted because of this "Frenchness" at least as perceived by someone else. Or (and I am still guessing only what WL was getting at) through some liason that was cultural with a third party who wanted a child.

 

[Chorley8]

Nicole does not look dissimilar from SMSK, a victim of D.M.H.imo.
Could there be any connection at all to that case?
Wonder if Nicole ever appeared, for whatever reason, on a tv show or other public medium, as did SMK?
Did Nicole ever participated in any sports competitions, such as running, like A.P., the 11 year old, victimized by Francis. C.R? ( Wonder if he spoke French....?)

imo.

Well I am not sure how far we should go along tracing ethnicity and crime though obviously it is one kind of network: Roy was aboriginal Howes supposedly had a father form Britain a mother from Austria (no idea what that would mean post-war several possibilities) in the RCMP pic of Howe he arguably looks very Metis (common in Sask). Sharin's Dad's name Caron is a very common Quebecois name and a very common Metis name. In media Sharin's parents were relentlessly protrayed as "hippiesh". I think her Mom said she was called Morningstar because it is the first star she saw when she was born. So what about Alison Parrot did she have a French background? There are so many ways this could go though of course the criminal one and the theme about bikers and the rumour and I think it is only that that she was kidnapped by organized crime and taken to Florida and killed involves organized criminality.

 

[dotr]

Canada AM, A discussion with former LE Mark Mendelson about Nicole.

" Social media can help solve cold cases".

Video
http://winnipeg.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=409297

 

[palisadesk]

Nicole does not look dissimilar from SMSK, a victim of D.M.H.imo.
Could there be any connection at all to that case?

No, beyond extremely unlikely. Nicole disappeared 2 1/2 years after Sharin' Keenan's murder. Police traced Howe's movements following the crime: he was seen in Sault Ste. Marie the following day, boarding a bus for Winnipeg. He had no connections to Toronto and certainly did not stay here. Furthermore, although where he went thereafter cannot be conclusively proven, there is good reason to believe one of his brothers aided him with money and other assistance and may have got him set up in the U.S. -- Montana or the Pacific Northwest. He could have survived for years in a lumber or mining camp environment, for instance. He probably kept a low profile and stayed out of trouble with the law: if he had been arrested, either in Canada or the U.S., his fingerprints would have identified him. With the right contacts, Howe's brother could have obtained false identity documents etc. for him, and if he is still alive, he may be in a nursing home or something similar, under an assumed name.



Howe's abduction of Sharin' was a crime of opportunity; he lived on the same street and happened to encounter her -- how he persuaded her to go with him we will never know.

 

[Chorley8]

No, Police traced Howe's movements following the crime: he was seen in Sault Ste. Marie the following day, boarding a bus for Winnipeg. He had no connections to Toronto. With the right contacts, Howe's brother could have obtained false identity documents etc. for him, and if he is still alive, he may be in a nursing home or something similar, under an assumed name.

I agree it is unlikely. Not to take the thread off-topic I have never understood the status of the Sault sighting. Seen by who and when? Winnipeg is probably a 20 hours bus ride away. No surveillance cameras in those days. My guess (and it is a guess) is that it wasn't him. We don't know what is contacts were in Toronto we only know he left a good job in Sask. to come here illegally. Something drew him.

If he had false ID papers he could come back to Canada.

 

[Snoop Sister]

I hope she is but I strongly doubt it. Imagine though? That would be crazy. I wonder what new place they are looking into and what leads they have. I am wondering if they already knew hence that live feed about a month or so back then this. It seems all too close to be coincidental but I guess maybe it could have been someone watching TV or online that remembered. I wish this case was closed. It haunts me to this day. It makes me mad that this happened. How could this have happened? Seriously? without a trace. ugh

Probably looking at remains. But, that would give the family closure at least.

 

[Chorley8]

It's impossible they would launch a media blitz with the hopeful notion she is still alive at the same time as they think they are close to IDing her remains. It is worth viewing the video Dotr recently linked to from out West retired Det. he doesn't know what it going on either but thinks it would have to be some new information.

 

[Ontario Mom]

"The OPP are assisting Toronto Police with a possible lead in the disappearance of eight year old Nicole Morin."

Read more: http://barrie.ctvnews.ca/police-sea...e-morin-disappearance-1.2045222#ixzz3FZq8cOU7

 

[nitsirk]

Wow! From the link above

Police are searching the area of Horseshoe Valley Road and Old Second South in Springwater Township.

 

[nitsirk]

http://barrie.ctvnews.ca/police-search-springwater-township-for-leads-in-nicole-morin-disappearance-1.2045222#ixzz3FZq8cOU7

Canine and emergency response teams are searching ditches and residential property for signs of 8-year-old Nicole Morin, last seen in Etobicoke on July 30, 1985.

I hope they find something. This location is right off hwy 400, just north of Barrie.

 

[nitsirk]

Interesting twitter from Frank D`Souza of City TV.

Francis D'Souza @cityfrancis · 25m 25 minutes ago
Police say tips after July pointed them to incident in Springwater 2 days after Nicole Morin disappeared.

 

[Woodland]

This is the same area Cindy Halliday was found 16 June 1992, after being reported missing on 21 April 1992 (Easter weekend that year).

Judging by the description of the location - it sounds like the same intersection and surrounding area is being searched. Not understanding the search of ditches and residential properties - which were searched in 1992. Could understand a specific property though. Jmo.

 

[nitsirk]

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/nicole-morin-cold-case-spawns-search-north-of-toronto-1.2792732

Cashman said the tip police are acting on was information originally reported to the OPP nearly 30 years ago.

Police investigated at the time, but did not find anything. The Toronto police are taking another look out of due diligence, Cashman said.

 

[nitsirk]

A picture from the search area courtesy of Courtney Heels CTV Barrie

 

[Woodland]

TPS is looking in that area 30 years after a tip? Good for them on due diligence.

 

[nitsirk]

I bet they recently got a tip that made them take another look at a 30 year old tip.

 

[Woodland]

What do they 'hope' to find after 39 years that a resident has not found yet? Needs to be a specific place imo.