Casey & Family Psychological Profile #10

[txsvicki]

I remember a judge saying that Casey's psychological evaluation was so complicated that he couldn't even begin to explain it, and wonder how the new DSM classifications by the APA is going to effect Casey's defense. Has anyone been following the new classifications? From what I can understand, Narcissism and Histrionic personality disorders are no longer considered mental illness and are not listed. There were 10 personality disorders listed and now there are only five. I believe narcissism is now considered to be antisocial/psychopath as well as histrionic. Borderlines as antagonist. What effect this may have on victims, I don't know, and the classifications could change again. Hopefully, what has been done will be of even less help to Casey who harmed everyone with her diabolical evil planning, plotting sociopath ways. Pyschopaths/sociopaths/narcissists always are the greater danger and harm to the victims. I believe they are more a danger than most people realize, and something needs to be done to recognize it before they murder in their early twenties and thirties.

 

[Chiquita71]

Hey, WS

I stayed away from the thread after I wrote that post. I think everyone here is the most understanding, incredible human beings I have ever met. I regret taking my anger out on another Websleuther, I regret taking my anger out on anyone. I was and I am embarrassed. There are better ways to get a point across than what I did.

I appreciate how well I am treated at WS and I apologize to all of Websleuths for my behavior. I apologize to Solace, who was very kind to me about the whole thing.

Goes to show you, we understand making mistakes, saying something you didn't mean, fighting with people, we understand being human and having flaws...but what none of us can understand is Casey and her family. :snooty:

I :blowkiss: Websleuths

 

[strawberry]

Hey, WS

I stayed away from the thread after I wrote that post. I think everyone here is the most understanding, incredible human beings I have ever met. I regret taking my anger out on another Websleuther, I regret taking my anger out on anyone. I was and I am embarrassed. There are better ways to get a point across than what I did.

I appreciate how well I am treated at WS and I apologize to all of Websleuths for my behavior. I apologize to Solace, who was very kind to me about the whole thing.

Goes to show you, we understand making mistakes, saying something you didn't mean, fighting with people, we understand being human and having flaws...but what none of us can understand is Casey and her family. :snooty:

I :blowkiss: Websleuths

(((((Chiquita))))):blowkiss:

 

[OneLostGrl]

Hey, WS

I stayed away from the thread after I wrote that post. I think everyone here is the most understanding, incredible human beings I have ever met. I regret taking my anger out on another Websleuther, I regret taking my anger out on anyone. I was and I am embarrassed. There are better ways to get a point across than what I did.

I appreciate how well I am treated at WS and I apologize to all of Websleuths for my behavior. I apologize to Solace, who was very kind to me about the whole thing.

Goes to show you, we understand making mistakes, saying something you didn't mean, fighting with people, we understand being human and having flaws...but what none of us can understand is Casey and her family. :snooty:

I :blowkiss: Websleuths

:hug: :blowkiss:

 

[LambChop]

Hey, WS

I stayed away from the thread after I wrote that post. I think everyone here is the most understanding, incredible human beings I have ever met. I regret taking my anger out on another Websleuther, I regret taking my anger out on anyone. I was and I am embarrassed. There are better ways to get a point across than what I did.

I appreciate how well I am treated at WS and I apologize to all of Websleuths for my behavior. I apologize to Solace, who was very kind to me about the whole thing.

Goes to show you, we understand making mistakes, saying something you didn't mean, fighting with people, we understand being human and having flaws...but what none of us can understand is Casey and her family. :snooty:

I :blowkiss: Websleuths

We all learn something here and take things away with us that make us aware of situations we probably never thought about. And there are sore spots sometimes that we hit, not intentional, but just without thinking. I have been away from my mother for 45 years, she lived out West and I was on the East Coast after I married. We are so different it is hard to believe I grew up in the same household. Away from that influence I grew into my own person. We learn and accept views from others by what others feel is acceptable. You did right to bring it to our attention. We look at KC and can't figure how such an attractive girl could do such a thing. Then we see her in action and realize there is no soul to this person. She is a hollow shell of a human. We all need to look beyond our initiation impression of others because even diamonds and gold are more than what they first appear to be.
jmo

 

[LambChop]

Too bad her parents chose not to parent her... that's why Casey is like she is. Her "parents" did nothing but walk on egg shells.. certainly did nothing to teach her about right and wrong, personal resposibility, self discipline, accountability, consequences (natural and otherwise) or cause and effect. They clearly did a lousy job of modelling...

Children learn what they live- they watch the adults in their life.. that's how their morals, their character begins to develop. They did nothing to encourage moral devolopment in this girl.. Cindy made fun of her husband in front of her children.. worse- let them make fun of him. She discussed their personal issues with her children.. she publicly held things over her husbands (their father) head. That kind of behavior makes children side with one parent or the other, I mean here she's implying that it's the "good" parent (the one who didn't screw up) only that deserves their respect.

That is not a good mother! and this is without getting into her real issues. That's just the tip.

Their father has no loyalty towards them what-so-ever.. his loyalty lies with Cindy and they know it. He's a liar, a thief, a cheat and they know it... Worse- he gets away with it and they know it!!

Who is rasing these children, teaching them right from wrong? They were horrible parents, the worst kind (IMO). Imagine nobody caring about your moral development? They created that havoc!

Very good post. Right on the money. Sort of "Leave it to Beaver" on the outside world and "War of the Roses" inside.

 

[txsvicki]

I must have missed something. What did Papa Joe supposedly do to teach Casey to lie and not work? I really disagree that the Anthony's put a lot of emphasis on physical beauty. They didn't have that great of hair coloring or highlights, nice fashionable accessories, jewelry, out of date clothing and hairstyles also by a few years. We don't really know that much of how they lived to call them personality disordered except that George seems to have something really wrong. Casey may have simply had them both turned into total nervous wrecks though. Cindy doesn't seem all that bad to me. They probably raised Casey kind of like they are now. Cindy talked thru things, problem solver and George ran away and blew up while blaming things on others. Not that healthy, but not enough to allegedly premeditate the death of a little toddler. That's serial killer psychopath stuff, and the Anthony's just aren't that bad to have so much influence on someone who was only expected to finish some schooling, get a job, and help take care of the child that she got pregnant with. Not stealing is expected of everyone and living at home while boozing and sleeping around with people. Not that bad of expectations IMO. The only thing really bad we've heard was said by Casey who is a known liar.

 

[claudicici]

I disagree Tx,
I think Cindy encouraged and expected CA to lie and steal,just like she excpected George to do the same.
That way she could stay in control .
She did not want either of them to be independant.She needs to be in charge.

 

[logicalgirl]

I must have missed something. What did Papa Joe supposedly do to teach Casey to lie and not work? I really disagree that the Anthony's put a lot of emphasis on physical beauty. They didn't have that great of hair coloring or highlights, nice fashionable accessories, jewelry, out of date clothing and hairstyles also by a few years. We don't really know that much of how they lived to call them personality disordered except that George seems to have something really wrong. Casey may have simply had them both turned into total nervous wrecks though. Cindy doesn't seem all that bad to me. They probably raised Casey kind of like they are now. Cindy talked thru things, problem solver and George ran away and blew up while blaming things on others. Not that healthy, but not enough to allegedly premeditate the death of a little toddler. That's serial killer psychopath stuff, and the Anthony's just aren't that bad to have so much influence on someone who was only expected to finish some schooling, get a job, and help take care of the child that she got pregnant with. Not stealing is expected of everyone and living at home while boozing and sleeping around with people. Not that bad of expectations IMO. The only thing really bad we've heard was said by Casey who is a known liar.

I agree, when you are parenting a psychopath/sociopath, you are dealing with a willful emotional shell who is building their skills by deliberately going against what you want for them and getting only what satisfies their own needs. To me there is no way the Anthony's are "Father knows best" or "Leave It To Beaver" families, but what family is. You can't guide/teach someone who cannot or will not learn. The only interest a psychopath/sociopath has is their own. If they were teachable or trainable, our prisons would not be full of them. Let ICA take the credit where the credit is due - she is responsible for who she is and what she is - only the Defense wants us to believes differently.

What do you want to bet Bernie Madoff's psyche profile says sociopath? Not a killer but look how many lives he has ruined. Think he cares? Seriously?

 

[Leila]

I disagree Tx,
I think Cindy encouraged and expected CA to lie and steal,just like she excpected George to do the same.
That way she could stay in control .
She did not want either of them to be independant.She needs to be in charge.

I've always been intrigued by Cindy's absolute need to control everyone in the family. Why? How did she get this way? From what little we know about Cindy's family, Cindy is the only girl in the family with several brothers. None of the brothers appear to have much to do with Cindy......we haven't seen any of them coming out in support of Cindy and George. We've gotten to know a little about one brother, Rick, and her mother, Shirley.

Rick stood up to Cindy and told her she was a fool for believing Casey's lies. We've seen the emails exchanged between Rick and Cindy's mother, Shirley, and between Shirley and her sister. From those emails we can see that Shirley seems to be an easy going and likable woman. She seems to have good insight into the relationships, stating that Casey hated her mother more than she loved Caylee.

How did Cindy become so controlling? It doesn't appear to be a family trait.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

^ George IMO. She has married a man that ran around on her and took her to the cleaners financially and has been a major disappointment to her in many ways. Her daughter grew up to follow in his wake, then outdid him by murdering the one person in her family she could and did love openly. The woman is trying to hold onto something which will make the last 30 years of her life have some worthwhile meaning to her, hence the control.

 

[Itsy]

I must have missed something. What did Papa Joe supposedly do to teach Casey to lie and not work? I really disagree that the Anthony's put a lot of emphasis on physical beauty. They didn't have that great of hair coloring or highlights, nice fashionable accessories, jewelry, out of date clothing and hairstyles also by a few years. We don't really know that much of how they lived to call them personality disordered except that George seems to have something really wrong. Casey may have simply had them both turned into total nervous wrecks though. Cindy doesn't seem all that bad to me. They probably raised Casey kind of like they are now. Cindy talked thru things, problem solver and George ran away and blew up while blaming things on others.Not that healthy, but not enough to allegedly premeditate the death of a little toddler. That's serial killer psychopath stuff, and the Anthony's just aren't that bad to have so much influence on someone who was only expected to finish some schooling, get a job, and help take care of the child that she got pregnant with. Not stealing is expected of everyone and living at home while boozing and sleeping around with people. Not that bad of expectations IMO. The only thing really bad we've heard was said by Casey who is a known liar.

BBM#1 - I think Casey learned by George's example(s). Children learn what they see, not just by what they're told to do.

BBM#2 - Casey's actions over the years surely would have made any parents nervous wrecks, IMO.

BBM#3 - I see it as George tried to discipline Casey & Cindy not allowing him to. Instead, Cindy "talked things out" but more as a friend rather than a parent and Casey never seemed to have to suffer any consequences regarding her actions. She could have talked to her until she was blue in the face & it wouldn't have done any good. Not sure if counseling would have helped Casey if they'd tried it early on, given that she's certainly either a borderline personality or a sociopath - or both. In any case, tough love wasn't used in this family.

I have a niece that was abandoned by her mother when she was about Caylee's age. The grandparents took over raising her & her older brother and were never denied anything they wanted, nor disciplined in any way except for being told whatever they'd done wrong was "not nice." Both of these children grew up to be horrible young adults, into drug use, lying & stealing. The nephew has been in jail a couple of times...niece has 3 kids by different fathers. It's so sad. My hubby at the time tried to get the grandparents to let us raise her as we couldn't have children. His mom said maybe when she was a teenager. We declined, knowing the damage was already happening and she'd be a terror by then.

Funny story to illustrate how the niece knew she had her grands wrapped around her finger at that young age. Whenever the grandmother would to shopping, the niece would EXPECT a present - and I mean if it was just a trip to the grocery store! One weekend when we were babysitting I took her to Walmart. She started in on wanting something and I told her no. She turned on the tears & screaming like she did with grandma (which worked every time) and I told her that wasn't going to work with me. She quit crying right away and asked me why not! lol, the look on her face was priceless. I then explained that we couldn't afford to buy something every time we went shopping - that usually we just bought what was needed. Then told her we could look at toys or clothes and WISH for them, but would not be buying something every time we went into a store. After that, whenever we'd go somewhere together she'd ask to go "wishing." And we would have a great time looking & wishing, but she never threw another tantrum with me. Still kept it up with grandma, tho!

I really wish we'd been able to raise her (her brother went to live with his father shortly after the mom vanished). I lost touch with her after hubby & I divorced 15+ years ago...

 

[RR0004]

I agree, when you are parenting a psychopath/sociopath, you are dealing with a willful emotional shell who is building their skills by deliberately going against what you want for them and getting only what satisfies their own needs. To me there is no way the Anthony's are "Father knows best" or "Leave It To Beaver" families, but what family is. You can't guide/teach someone who cannot or will not learn. The only interest a psychopath/sociopath has is their own. If they were teachable or trainable, our prisons would not be full of them. Let ICA take the credit where the credit is due - she is responsible for who she is and what she is - only the Defense wants us to believes differently.

What do you want to bet Bernie Madoff's psyche profile says sociopath? Not a killer but look how many lives he has ruined. Think he cares? Seriously?

Wonder if he does now when it's hit so close to home.

 

[RR0004]

Anyone can reply to this if you know the answer?

I have read Lee tell prosecutors that Jesse flat out lied to him about meeting Tony at a pool (introduced by Casey). He says Jesse said it never happened and that KC said "he is a f....ing liar".

Jesse readily offers that information to the police in his interview with Yuri, etc.

So I don't know what Lee is talking about. I cannot see Jesse lying about this. Lee also says that Tony flat out lied to him about being in KC's car. I have not seen this either. Tony did not drive around in KC's car. He had his jeep and they drove that to her house the day they got the gas cans. The day he picked her up at Amscot, KC was ready to go with bags in hand and Tony never got out of the car. So Lee is flat out lying here.

I also find it extremely hard to believe that when Cindy called Lee on July 3rd frantic asking him to find KC that she never mentioned Caylee. Lee says she did not and he did not learn about it until later. Now Cindy is frantic and calls Lee to find KC and NEVER mentions she has not seen Caylee - he tells this to the prosecutors. A lie in my opinion. But the reason I don't know. Maybe to look like I did not see this as urgent as it apparently became.

Remember, he also said he believes everything his sister says.

 

[claudicici]

I wonder how Cindy became that way myself.I don't think it was because of George.
I know I seem to be hard on her but I believe she screwed up George in the first place.He was ok until she made him quit his job,broke his backbone,completely took his manhood.
She seems to only thrive when she sucks every bit of self worth out of a person.
She did it to George and she did it to ICA.
She mentally torments the ones around her.ICA may never have experienced sexual abuse by her father or brother but the mental abuse seems so apparent to me.
I don't think she was spoiled I think CA deliberately stunted ICA's mental growth.

 

[Solace]

I wonder how Cindy became that way myself.I don't think it was because of George.
I know I seem to be hard on her but I believe she screwed up George in the first place.He was ok until she made him quit his job,broke his backbone,completely took his manhood.
She seems to only thrive when she sucks every bit of self worth out of a person.
She did it to George and she did it to ICA.
.

How can you know that? George has never carried his weight financially in the marriage and he readily admits it; he also maxed the credit cards to a Nigerian in England on a scam. His job history is less than for lack of a better word. Rick Plesea, Cindy's brother, says George put his own father's head through the windshield in an argument with him - could be true or not. But his father wanted him out of the business; he failed miserably after that at his own small business - he admits that. They lost their first house because of this. He took $5,000 from the woman who tried to help him and Cindy after Caylee went missing. She subsequently tried to kill herself.

It is true Cindy is overbearing and you can see that in the way she is with the detectives and then on the shows lately. But George and Lee do their share of lying on KC's behalf also. So this whole family is dysfunctional. It is not all Cindy's fault. It is both Cindy and George's.

 

[logicalgirl]

How can you know that? George has never carried his weight financially in the marriage and he readily admits it; he also maxed the credit cards to a Nigerian in England on a scam. His job history is less than for lack of a better word. Rick Plesea, Cindy's brother, says George put his own father's head through the windshield in an argument with him - could be true or not. But his father wanted him out of the business; he failed miserably after that at his own small business - he admits that. They lost their first house because of this. He took $5,000 from the woman who tried to help him and Cindy after Caylee went missing. She subsequently tried to kill herself.

It is true Cindy is overbearing and you can see that in the way she is with the detectives and then on the shows lately. But George and Lee do their share of lying on KC's behalf also. So this whole family is dysfunctional. It is not all Cindy's fault. It is both Cindy and George's.

I'm starting to think we have the Chicken and the Egg conundrum here - which came first? :banghead: I see a family with members completely out of control, and Cindy who (attempts) to be the biggest controller of all - but when I look for results of her controlling, I see.....a mess, a huge mess. Which to my sense of logic means she controlled....nothing. Trying in this world gets you nothing. Look at the sentence - "well, I tried to get to work on time." It implies failure to succeed at a specific goal. I see Cindy "tried" to control what went on in her family, and in the media, and in the evidence against ICA, but I see her succeeding at nothing. Look at her roles in her life. Daughter. Sister. Wife. Mother. GrandMother. She succeeded at nothing and controlled nothing. To me this is why we see her completely bizarre behavior. CA doesn't have the self discipline to control her behavior because she thinks it will hold off what ever terrible thing is coming in to her family's life and into hers. She knows it won't but she can't seem to stop. She's had lots of practice in her lifetime.

All IMO - boy, I'm in a mood this AM, aren't I?:innocent::blushing:

 

[Jomo]

I have a bit of a problem seeing Cindy as the one running the show. To me it is obvious that KC is running the show.

Cindy has been running around supporting her and this just doesn't seem like the usual relationship between a controlling mother and a rebellious daughter.

I think KC is the one everyone is afraid of and in control. This would go a long way to explaining the families reactions and decisions since before the arrest.

At times in the first Jail house visit on July 25, 2008, is seemed like the family was asking questions with a "Is-that-okay?" kind of tone. Also the first words out of KC's mouth were "Don't worry. I didn't say anything."

Her smirks in court and general attitude come from a whole life-long practice of controlling everyone, especially her parents. Taking little Caylee away initially was a control move. The attitude of "entitlement" is not something that has just come up as a reaction to Cindy's over controlling nature. I'm sure that she was a holy terror at home when not happy and everyone tiptoed around her and smoothed her path so they wouldn't have to deal with her tantrums. It almost seems that Cindy over controlled others to make sure they did not upset Casey, not overcontrol Casey.

KC writing cheques out of Cindy's account full knowing that Cindy knew about it and continued to permit it is another thing that just doesn't fit the idea that Cindy was the overcontroller.

I will never really believe that Cindy's controlling nature was the reason for any of this. KC was stubborn, willful, manipulative, fearless, and defiant without empathy and without impunity.

 

[logicalgirl]

I have a bit of a problem seeing Cindy as the one running the show. To me it is obvious that KC is running the show.

Cindy has been running around supporting her and this just doesn't seem like the usual relationship between a controlling mother and a rebellious daughter.

I think KC is the one everyone is afraid of and in control. This would go a long way to explaining the families reactions and decisions since before the arrest.

At times in the first Jail house visit on July 25, 2008, is seemed like the family was asking questions with a "Is-that-okay?" kind of tone. Also the first words out of KC's mouth were "Don't worry. I didn't say anything."

Her smirks in court and general attitude come from a whole life-long practice of controlling everyone, especially her parents. Taking little Caylee away initially was a control move. The attitude of "entitlement" is not something that has just come up as a reaction to Cindy's over controlling nature. I'm sure that she was a holy terror at home when not happy and everyone tiptoed around her and smoothed her path so they wouldn't have to deal with her tantrums. It almost seems that Cindy over controlled others to make sure they did not upset Casey, not overcontrol Casey.

KC writing cheques out of Cindy's account full knowing that Cindy knew about it and continued to permit it is another thing that just doesn't fit the idea that Cindy was the overcontroller.

I will never really believe that Cindy's controlling nature was the reason for any of this. KC was stubborn, willful, manipulative, fearless, and defiant without empathy and without impunity.

Bravo! What you said is so much better than I said but wished I could have said!!

 

[ZsaZsa]

I have a bit of a problem seeing Cindy as the one running the show. To me it is obvious that KC is running the show.

Cindy has been running around supporting her and this just doesn't seem like the usual relationship between a controlling mother and a rebellious daughter.

I think KC is the one everyone is afraid of and in control. This would go a long way to explaining the families reactions and decisions since before the arrest.

At times in the first Jail house visit on July 25, 2008, is seemed like the family was asking questions with a "Is-that-okay?" kind of tone. Also the first words out of KC's mouth were "Don't worry. I didn't say anything."

Her smirks in court and general attitude come from a whole life-long practice of controlling everyone, especially her parents. Taking little Caylee away initially was a control move. The attitude of "entitlement" is not something that has just come up as a reaction to Cindy's over controlling nature. I'm sure that she was a holy terror at home when not happy and everyone tiptoed around her and smoothed her path so they wouldn't have to deal with her tantrums. It almost seems that Cindy over controlled others to make sure they did not upset Casey, not overcontrol Casey.

KC writing cheques out of Cindy's account full knowing that Cindy knew about it and continued to permit it is another thing that just doesn't fit the idea that Cindy was the overcontroller.

I will never really believe that Cindy's controlling nature was the reason for any of this. KC was stubborn, willful, manipulative, fearless, and defiant without empathy and without impunity.

But from what people, bloggers and regular Orlando area residents have seen of CA it wouldn't be much of a stretch for her defense to say that ICA 'overdosed' Caylee inadvertently, and she died in the trunk and ICA was so terrified of CA - knowing an autopsy would reveal evidence of her chronic drug abuse of Caylee - that she panicked and disposed of her body, and came up with the Zanny story. It will all come down to Cindy- and she has been playing right into their hands with all her public histrionics - if her current Lawyers have finally convinced her to keep quiet I imagine it's because they have figured this out too...