CDC: 107 people on TB flights need tests

[pedinurse]

Thanks for that.

I thought Speaker had admitted he was trying to get back here because he felt abandoned by the CDC.

Do you know anything about the Canadian border guard who let him cross? I know the guy was fired, but I read that that border guard only saw whatever was flagged on Speaker as a warning - not a life or death situation. I'd love to know what the warning stated.

Also, why was it safe for the CDC to fly him on their plane once he back was in the country when it wasn't safe for them to fly him when he was in Europe?

funny thing is that according to that article, the cdc plane / jet was put into place because of their difficulties getting a SARS patient (a severe respiratory disease) back to the U.S.

it was pointed out that it has been being used (at least in the recent past) to transport government officials to meetings since that time.

"In June 2006 the AJC reported that the Gulfstream III, leased by the CDC for about $252,000 a month plus $3,000 per flight hour used, was at the time primarily being used to fly Secretary of Health and Human Services Secretary Mike Leavitt to meetings and press conferences. Leavitt hasn't used the jet since the article ran."

i find that really interesting (so did the politician who was questioning them about this) that the primary use is different from what it was originally approved for (transporting supplies, ill cdc employees and ill u.s. citizens).

a boat would have exposed the other passengers for a lengthy period of time. ventilation on boats isn't that great either indoors, and it is usually really tight quarters as well. so it isn't really a whole lot better than an airplane in terms of risk to other passengers.

 

[southcitymom]

funny thing is that according to that article, the cdc plane / jet was put into place because of their difficulties getting a SARS patient (a severe respiratory disease) back to the U.S.

it was pointed out that it has been being used (at least in the recent past) to transport government officials to meetings since that time.

"In June 2006 the AJC reported that the Gulfstream III, leased by the CDC for about $252,000 a month plus $3,000 per flight hour used, was at the time primarily being used to fly Secretary of Health and Human Services Secretary Mike Leavitt to meetings and press conferences. Leavitt hasn't used the jet since the article ran."

i find that really interesting (so did the politician who was questioning them about this) that the primary use is different from what it was originally approved for (transporting supplies, ill cdc employees and ill u.s. citizens).

a boat would have exposed the other passengers for a lengthy period of time. ventilation on boats isn't that great either indoors, and it is usually really tight quarters as well. so it isn't really a whole lot better than an airplane in terms of risk to other passengers.

Yes - the whole CDC Gulfstream issue is just another reason the CDC has massive amounts of egg on their face right now.

It's purchased to move sick people and supplies and it never seems to do so - just sits there costing us gobs of money.

The CDC now seems to be saying "We were going to get Speaker out of Europe with our plane but those things take time." How much time does it take to get an unused airplane into the air? Anyway that's not the message Speaker got - he was told "no way we can send out plane for you" and "you need to get a private flight or remain in an Italian hospital."

The CDC needs to get its stories straight. But I'm not holding my breath!

 

[pedinurse]

Yes - the whole CDC Gulfstream issue is just another reason the CDC has massive amounts of egg on their face right now.

It's purchased to move sick people and supplies and it never seems to do so - just sits there costing us gobs of money.

The CDC now seems to be saying "We were going to get Speaker out of Europe with our plane but those things take time." How much time does it take to get an unused airplane into the air? Anyway that's not the message Speaker got - he was told "no way we can send out plane for you" and "you need to get a private flight or remain in an Italian hospital."

The CDC needs to get its stories straight. But I'm not holding my breath!

He says that they told him that there wasn't money in the budget to do that. Specific funds are set aside just for the use of the plane for that purpose (unless it the plane was in use taking that guy to some meeting, I guess - even though that was not it's purpose).
IF it is true that they told him that - maybe if they had said yes, we will come get you just get to the italian authorities and check into the hospital - he wouldn't have freaked out and formulated this way to get back into the U.S.

 

[southcitymom]

He says that they told him that there wasn't money in the budget to do that. Specific funds are set aside just for the use of the plane for that purpose (unless it the plane was in use taking that guy to some meeting, I guess - even though that was not it's purpose).
IF it is true that they told him that - maybe if they had said yes, we will come get you just get to the italian authorities and check into the hospital - he wouldn't have freaked out and formulated this way to get back into the U.S.

Oh, I definitely think he would have stayed if he thought they were coming to get him. He might have been stupid to leave the country, but I really feel like he was downright panicked when he was tryng to get back in.

They pay $3 million for that plane (225K/month) regardless plus additional money for the pilot, crew, gas etc...whether it sits at the airport or is en route to pick up a person with TB.

 

[crypto6]

(Emphasis added.) So maybe the closed ventilation system wasn't the issue.

I agree that Speaker should have canceled his wedding plans and stayed put.

But I'm not entirely surprised, given what we have heard from the CDC since, if Speaker thought he was getting a lot of double-talk.

The CDC has access to entire enclosed system suits. Why not use one of those? More of our $$ wasted on bureaucrats who can't think their way out of a paper bag. Maybe we should send the Overland Park, KS LE to deal with this; they seem to know how to get results.....

Crypto6

 

[pedinurse]

The CDC has access to entire enclosed system suits. Why not use one of those? More of our $$ wasted on bureaucrats who can't think their way out of a paper bag. Maybe we should send the Overland Park, KS LE to deal with this; they seem to know how to get results.....

Crypto6

Heck they make ventilation hoods (not the green masks you see on people, or the earloop ones - I am talking VENTILATION HOODS. I don't know if that would be an appropriate use of one, however - because people with TB are kept in special rooms (negative pressure rooms) which help prevent cross contaimination and airborne microbes from spreading. But it is a thought.

 

[pedinurse]

Oh, I definitely think he would have stayed if he thought they were coming to get him. He might have been stupid to leave the country, but I really feel like he was downright panicked when he was tryng to get back in.

They pay $3 million for that plane (225K/month) regardless plus additional money for the pilot, crew, gas etc...whether it sits at the airport or is en route to pick up a person with TB.

I think that panick would be a normal, and natural human feeling in that situation.

 

[crypto6]

Heck they make ventilation hoods (not the green masks you see on people, or the earloop ones - I am talking VENTILATION HOODS. I don't know if that would be an appropriate use of one, however - because people with TB are kept in special rooms (negative pressure rooms) which help prevent cross contaimination and airborne microbes from spreading. But it is a thought.

Right. They have self-contained systems, so the crew contamination is not an excuse. Or the crew could wear masks with microbe filters. I really had a better opinion of the CDC before this came out.....

Crypto6

 

[Texana]

Again, the only good thing to come out of this is a glaring spotlight on the failures of all the government agencies involved...

 

[southcitymom]

I think that panick would be a normal, and natural human feeling in that situation.

Me too. I like the ventilation outfit thought.

 

[southcitymom]

Again, the only good thing to come out of this is a glaring spotlight on the failures of all the government agencies involved...

You're absolutely right!

 

[fundiva]

Thanks for that.

I thought Speaker had admitted he was trying to get back here because he felt abandoned by the CDC.

Do you know anything about the Canadian border guard who let him cross? I know the guy was fired, but I read that that border guard only saw whatever was flagged on Speaker as a warning - not a life or death situation. I'd love to know what the warning stated.

Also, why was it safe for the CDC to fly him on their plane once he back was in the country when it wasn't safe for them to fly him when he was in Europe?

He did say he felt abandoned. He also says that he was trying to evade authorities, but his actions show otherwise. I believe the CDC should have been more sympathetic, but I'm sure they were upset that he had traveled against their advice and put himself in a situation they couldn't control because of his arrogance. IMO, it's his arrogance that got Speaker into this situation - for some reason the rules don't apply to him.

Also, it wasn't a Canadian border guard, it was a U.S. border official that waved him through. His passport had been flagged; but Speaker must have talked himself out of it because the immigration official overrode the flag and let him through. I doubt the immigration guy would have just erased the flag without having a conversation with Speaker. By the way, the immigration official (of 18 years) is not on a leave of absence pending an investigation and may be fired because of Mr. Speaker. Another notch in his belt showing he doesn't care what happened to anybody else but himself.

 

[Details]

...One of the interesting things from the article I recently posted is that the CDC said they couldn't send their airplane to get him because of the exposure risk to the crew, but then they turned around and said that Speaker really only exposed two rows away from him to the TB when he travelled the commercial flight.....

As I've heard it reported, they're only testing 2 rows away to figure out how contagious he was. If any of them show up positive, then they'll have to go hunting for the rest of the airplane. So, they aren't saying he was only contagious within a few rows.

 

[Details]

This is the big issue to me. From what I've read, I honestly don't know what to believe.

I understand that the CDC told him not to fly. But I don't understand why Speaker wasn't immediately quarantined if they thought he was such a danger. Answer: they knew he wasn't a danger. They told him as much in the same conversation where they told him not to fly.

Because legally they first had to present him with a paper. He left before they could, moving his departure date up (hmm, fatherly advice from the CDC FIL?) - oops - you were talking about in Rome. How about because it takes time to talk to the Italian authorities, and they figured he was a normal person who wouldn't risk killing other people by boarding an airplane when told not to? And how serious it was?

I pretty much operate under the idea umbrella that people are selfish and want to do what they want to do. So I'm assuming Speaker really wanted to go on his wedding trip before he went to Denver and I can understand that.

And while it was selfish of him to do what he did, I don't think for a second that he thought he was putting anyone in danger by doing it.

Now, when he was in Europe and the CDC called him and said "we've got new tests and you need to stay put and go to a hospital there," he understandably freaked because a few weeks ago they had told him that the only place he could be treated was this hospital in Denver. Did they tell him during this phone call that he was now a danger to people? Again - not that I'm aware of.

Here's where I disagree - they told him not to fly, that the Italian authorities would be picking him up, and that he was put on the Do-Not-Fly list - all of this by his words, and pretty blatantly obvious that they're worried about him passing this disease on (they'd told him all along that he was contagious - just not very). Any moron (and he isn't) would know that the situation had changed, that they were worried about the danger to other people.

Throw stones at me if you wish, but if I didn't think I was a danger to anyone, I would have tried to get back home as well!

Maybe, I don't have all the facts right - feel free to correct me if I am missing anything cogent.

See, I see no way he could not know he was a danger, and not to mention that when some organization like the CDC is involved - it's serious. When you are on the Do Not Fly list - it's serious. I would not ever go up against that without some good, well researched, reason.

 

[Details]

Yes - the whole CDC Gulfstream issue is just another reason the CDC has massive amounts of egg on their face right now.

It's purchased to move sick people and supplies and it never seems to do so - just sits there costing us gobs of money.

The CDC now seems to be saying "We were going to get Speaker out of Europe with our plane but those things take time." How much time does it take to get an unused airplane into the air? Anyway that's not the message Speaker got - he was told "no way we can send out plane for you" and "you need to get a private flight or remain in an Italian hospital."

The CDC needs to get its stories straight. But I'm not holding my breath!

That's what Speaker says - but so far as I'm concerned, he's lying all over the place. He says he knew before he left that he had to go to the Denver hospital or he might DIE! Then in the next statement makes it seem like he didn't think he had anything serious when he left.

The CDC has always been saying they planned to fly him home, but needed a little time. And his insurance also may well have covered the flight. But he didn't feel like waiting.

 

[southcitymom]

Thanks, Details. You make some excellent points. I agree that he should NOT have left the country; however, I'm not buying the CDC's story about getting him back to the States.

The CDC has arms all over the world to include Italy. If this man was infected with contagious TB and such a THREAT, they should have sent someone to pick him up and put him in quarantine. They knew where he was staying.

I might not trust everything Speaker is saying, but neither do I trust everything the CDC is saying. There's lots of spin around this case - that's what makes it so difficult to know what to think.

 

[angelmom]

I know I said I was staying out of this conversation, but this was in a tiny section of the AJC today called Q&A on the news that probably wouldn't pop up in any news searches. I found it incredibly interesting.

http://www.ajc.com/search/content/metro/stories/2007/06/10/metquesti0610a.html

Q: A recent article regarding Andrew Speaker's celebrated TB case said that "between 1993 and 2006, 49 people were diagnosed with XDR-TB in the United States." What was the survival rate of these 49 people?

—- ELLEN DUKES, Austell

A: Seventeen of those diagnosed with extensively drug-resistant tuberculosis or XDR TB between 1993-2006 completed treatment. Twelve died during treatment; eight had an outcome not yet reported, and 12 either moved or had no follow-up.

According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention Web site at digbig.com/4tbbm, our edit of a longer Web address, the 49 XDR-TB cases were reported in nine states and one city. The highest number of cases, 19, were in New York City. followed by 11 cases in California.

Of the 12 people with XDR TB who died, 10 were also HIV positive. Speaker's case is the first reported in Georgia since at least 1993.

 

[fundiva]

He did say he felt abandoned. He also says that he was trying to evade authorities, but his actions show otherwise. I believe the CDC should have been more sympathetic, but I'm sure they were upset that he had traveled against their advice and put himself in a situation they couldn't control because of his arrogance. IMO, it's his arrogance that got Speaker into this situation - for some reason the rules don't apply to him.

Also, it wasn't a Canadian border guard, it was a U.S. border official that waved him through. His passport had been flagged; but Speaker must have talked himself out of it because the immigration official overrode the flag and let him through. I doubt the immigration guy would have just erased the flag without having a conversation with Speaker. By the way, the immigration official (of 18 years) is not on a leave of absence pending an investigation and may be fired because of Mr. Speaker. Another notch in his belt showing he doesn't care what happened to anybody else but himself.

Whoops! I meant to say he says he was NOT trying to evade authorities.

 

[accordn2me]

I just saw on Fox News that a CDC plane has landed in Miami with a woman throwing up blood. Noone is being allowed off the plane......

 

[accordn2me]

I know I said I was staying out of this conversation, but this was in a tiny section of the AJC today called Q&A on the news that probably wouldn't pop up in any news searches. I found it incredibly interesting.

http://www.ajc.com/search/content/metro/stories/2007/06/10/metquesti0610a.html

Q: A recent article regarding Andrew Speaker's celebrated TB case said that "between 1993 and 2006, 49 people were diagnosed with XDR-TB in the United States." What was the survival rate of these 49 people?

—- ELLEN DUKES, Austell

A: Seventeen of those diagnosed with extensively drug-resistant tuberculosis or XDR TB between 1993-2006 completed treatment. Twelve died during treatment; eight had an outcome not yet reported, and 12 either moved or had no follow-up.

According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention Web site at digbig.com/4tbbm, our edit of a longer Web address, the 49 XDR-TB cases were reported in nine states and one city. The highest number of cases, 19, were in New York City. followed by 11 cases in California.

Of the 12 people with XDR TB who died, 10 were also HIV positive. Speaker's case is the first reported in Georgia since at least 1993.

So....I wonder if the 12 who moved or had no follow-up took planes anywhere?