Found Deceased Channel Islands - Emiliano Sala 28, pilot David Ibbotson, 60, missing plane, Alderney, 21 Jan 2019

[LibbyinTexas]

That's NOT the shape of a Malibu seat cushion (I won't even comment on the color).

Do you mean you dont think the cushions that they are saying are from the plane can possibly be the cushions?

 

[GraceG]

Do you mean you dont think the cushions that they are saying are from the plane can possibly be the cushions?

No, that is NOT a Malibu aircraft cushion. Wrong shape, thickness, and there are no planes out there with bright blue seat cushions, they come out of the manufacturer with very neutral interior colors. (see attached photo)

 

[GraceG]

Well its Feb 1 .... Does anyone hold out hope that Sala and the pilot could be on an island? I just read a great article from espn In Search of Emiliano Sala
And I was struck by the fact that the search for the plane began almost immediately and lasted till past 2 am ... Of course it was dark but they never saw an oil trace to even suggest the plane hit water and when they say the plane vanished it seems legit... Maybe it was so choppy the oil disappeared fast? And even if cushions have washed up it may still could mean they crashed near land ? They went off radar but could they of still glided way farther out then the search concentrated area??? Can they possibly just be way off in where they are looking?

If they had glided to a ditching they wouldn't have suddenly disappeared from the radar. Besides, ditching in total darkness is about impossible as you can't judge where the water is to flare and stall the airplane a couple of feet from the surface.

Like you, I would like to see a happy outcome, but as someone who flew for a living almost 20 years, it's not going to happen. They had to have stalled and spiraled in or had a high-speed loss of control due to the bad weather and/or airframe icing. Hitting the water at 100 mph (or more) in an aircraft that is not built with the strength of an automobile body (due to weight concerns) it's a non-survivable event.

 

[LibbyinTexas]

No, that is NOT a Malibu aircraft cushion. Wrong shape, thickness, and there are no planes out there with bright blue seat cushions, they come out of the manufacturer with very neutral interior colors. (see attached photo)

Why are they saying they probably are ???

 

[LibbyinTexas]

If they had glided to a ditching they wouldn't have suddenly disappeared from the radar. Besides, ditching in total darkness is about impossible as you can't judge where the water is to flare and stall the airplane a couple of feet from the surface.

Like you, I would like to see a happy outcome, but as someone who flew for a living almost 20 years, it's not going to happen. They had to have stalled and spiraled in or had a high-speed loss of control due to the bad weather and/or airframe icing. Hitting the water at 100 mph (or more) in an aircraft that is not built with the strength of an automobile body (due to weight concerns) it's a non-survivable event.

Why didnt they see oil ? Yes I want a glimmer of hope anything really... Do you suppose the little plane spiraled at high speed deep into the channel and is sitting on the floor somewhere and if so how is it possible it didnt tear to shreds and leave pieces all over - its not like they dont know exactly where it should be but it doesnt seem to be there ... Why ??? What do you suppose happened and why cant they find even a trace ? Especially since they were right on it within 30 minutes. ... Albeit in the dark

 

[GraceG]

Why didnt they see oil ? Yes I want a glimmer of hope anything really... Do you suppose the little plane spiraled at high speed deep into the channel and is sitting on the floor somewhere and if so how is it possible it didnt tear to shreds and leave pieces all over - its not like they dont know exactly where it should be but it doesnt seem to be there ... Why ??? What do you suppose happened and why cant they find even a trace ? Especially since they were right on it within 30 minutes. ... Albeit in the dark

In rough seas, oil will disperse pretty quickly. Even if the airplane went into pieces, those pieces will often sink and it's not at all unusual for an airplane that ends up in the water to disappear without a trace. Here's another one from last fall off the East Coast of the US. Mystery grows over fate of aircraft that vanished off Charleston. Search is suspended. and another from the NTSB archives - it's more common than you would think. ERA14LA415

 

[LibbyinTexas]

In rough seas, oil will disperse pretty quickly. Even if the airplane went into pieces, those pieces will often sink and it's not at all unusual for an airplane that ends up in the water to disappear without a trace. Here's another one from last fall off the East Coast of the US. Mystery grows over fate of aircraft that vanished off Charleston. Search is suspended. and another from the NTSB archives - it's more common than you would think. ERA14LA415

This is heart wrenching awful... I just want to believe they arent looking in the right spot... What I dont really understand is - when they say a plane drops from radar -- does that mean it loses communication and but isnt it possible to lose comminication and still be flying low or something ... I dont really understand what ditching means but in my limited understanding Im wondering if the plane can fall so low its off radar but gliding or going on and on for a greater distance before crashing and thus be in a totally different location???? Sorry for my ignorance on this - I am trying to find some amazing hope that makes survival possible.

 

[GraceG]

This is heart wrenching awful... I just want to believe they arent looking in the right spot... What I dont really understand is - when they say a plane drops from radar -- does that mean it loses communication and but isnt it possible to lose comminication and still be flying low or something ... I dont really understand what ditching means but in my limited understanding Im wondering if the plane can fall so low its off radar but gliding or going on and on for a greater distance before crashing and thus be in a totally different location???? Sorry for my ignorance on this - I am trying to find some amazing hope that makes survival possible.

Air traffic controllers track aircraft using two types of radar. "Primary" radar determines a plane's position by analyzing signals that bounce back off the aircraft; the "secondary" or "enhanced" type requests information from each plane, which is then sent by a piece of equipment aboard an airplane known as a transponder.

Radar facilities are based on land, and each one has a range of about 200 miles (320 kilometers). So you might have a commercial airline go off the radar for a bit (though they have other means of getting their info to ATC) on a transoceanic flight but where this plane went missing there would be continuous radar coverage

Going so low as to not be seen on radar is only going to happen if large mountains prevent line of sight contact, also not an issue in this case.

Had they just glided down to a low altitude the air traffic controller would have seen that, and likely questioned why they were descending. The fact that they disappeared from the scope only means one thing. They crashed into the water, and it was probably an extremely rapid descent. I’m still going with loss of control. They were cloudy, stormy weather and the faa public records (www.faa.gov) for the pilot (who was issued the same type of license he had in the United Kingdome -what they call private pilot/foreign based) shows he was not licensed to fly commercially nor in the clouds (no instrument rating).

 

[LibbyinTexas]

Air traffic controllers track aircraft using two types of radar. "Primary" radar determines a plane's position by analyzing signals that bounce back off the aircraft; the "secondary" or "enhanced" type requests information from each plane, which is then sent by a piece of equipment aboard an airplane known as a transponder.

Radar facilities are based on land, and each one has a range of about 200 miles (320 kilometers). So you might have a commercial airline go off the radar for a bit (though they have other means of getting their info to ATC) on a transoceanic flight but where this plane went missing there would be continuous radar coverage

Going so low as to not be seen on radar is only going to happen if large mountains prevent line of sight contact, also not an issue in this case.

Had they just glided down to a low altitude the air traffic controller would have seen that, and likely questioned why they were descending. The fact that they disappeared from the scope only means one thing. They crashed into the water, and it was probably an extremely rapid descent. I’m still going with loss of control. They were cloudy, stormy weather and the faa public records (www.faa.gov) for the pilot (who was issued the same type of license he had in the United Kingdome -what they call private pilot/foreign based) shows he was not licensed to fly commercially nor in the clouds (no instrument rating).

What your saying probably happened is they were last seen at - I think 2300 and then because they just dropped off radar that they lost control and spiraled rapidly down to the water and so that spiral down will not be seen on a radar? So if its super fast its not going to be seen ? And then it hits water- breaks up or is it under water pretty deep when it plunges and breaks up under water which is why no one saw it 30 or so minutes later but then even still if it broke up why hasnt anything surfaced? Does it just all sink?

 

[LibbyinTexas]

In rough seas, oil will disperse pretty quickly. Even if the airplane went into pieces, those pieces will often sink and it's not at all unusual for an airplane that ends up in the water to disappear without a trace. Here's another one from last fall off the East Coast of the US. Mystery grows over fate of aircraft that vanished off Charleston. Search is suspended. and another from the NTSB archives - it's more common than you would think. ERA14LA415

Okay I read this again and you say its not uncommon for it to allllll sink bummer - its beyond my ability to really wrap my head around these disappearances --- how whole aircrafts can really just vanish into the ocean for good .

 

[Elainera]

how whole aircrafts can really just vanish into the ocean for good .

Maybe aircrafts should have large sealed aircontainers so they come back up.

 

[cybervampira]

US Marine scientist behind hunt for Emilaino Sala is 'confident' he'll find sunken wreckage | Daily Mail Online

The US marine scientist behind the private hunt for the wreckage of Emiliano Sala's plane has promised he'll find answers for the star's family.

David Mearns, who is assisting the Sala family in the private search, revealed his confidence in finding the missing plane during a press conference at St Peter Port harbour, Guernsey, at the end of Crown Pier, today.

He had previously said search efforts to recover the missing plane would focus on a 24sq nautical mile area of the seabed north of Guernsey.

Two separate underwater searches are set to be launched on Sunday to try and trace the missing Piper PA-46 Malibu plane.

[...]

US-born Mr Mearns has been called in after a funding campaign backed by Premier League stars Laurent Koscielny and Ilkay Gundogan raised nearly £260,000.

A specialist vessel which can scan anomalies on the seabed has arrived in Guernsey to carry out the search.

[...]

 

[GraceG]

Maybe aircrafts should have large sealed aircontainers so they come back up.

A pressurized airplane already IS a large sealed air container.

 

[LibbyinTexas]

This question is for GraceG - you had said that the Malibu planes do not make cushions with colors only neutral etc... Why wont they dismiss them like they did the other aluminum stuff found? I keep reading that those cushions are more thsn likely from the plane?

 

[buttonbaby]

This question is for GraceG - you had said that the Malibu planes do not make cushions with colors only neutral etc... Why wont they dismiss them like they did the other aluminum stuff found? I keep reading that those cushions are more thsn likely from the plane?

I'm not GraceG, but just wanted to make a brief comment.... is it possible that it's the lighting in the first photo making the cushion look blue? The second photo and everything in it (stones, etc.), look much more true to color, and would better match with the neutral colors of an aircraft interior that GraceG mentioned. JMO. MOO.

 

[LibbyinTexas]

I'm not GraceG, but just wanted to make a brief comment.... is it possible that it's the lighting in the first photo making the cushion look blue? The second photo and everything in it (stones, etc.), look much more true to color, and would better match with the neutral colors of an aircraft interior that GraceG mentioned. JMO. MOO.

I was thinking that aslo!

 

[GraceG]

This question is for GraceG - you had said that the Malibu planes do not make cushions with colors only neutral etc... Why wont they dismiss them like they did the other aluminum stuff found? I keep reading that those cushions are more thsn likely from the plane?

Hi Libby - the first photos of the cushion showed a distinct blue color which you'd not find in a manufactured Malibu honestly they looked like boat cushions to me but the later picture with different lighting showed a much more neutral color so they could be aircraft seat cushions. A photo of the interior of a Malibu is attached so you can compare the shape of the found cushion from one from that model plane.

 

[Elainera]

A pressurized airplane already IS a large sealed air container.

But then they should simply float?

 

[crhedBngr]

No, that is NOT a Malibu aircraft cushion. Wrong shape, thickness, and there are no planes out there with bright blue seat cushions, they come out of the manufacturer with very neutral interior colors. (see attached photo)

Glad we've got your expertise, @GraceG !

Praying they are found soon.

 

[Elainera]

An underwater search for the missing plane carrying footballer Emiliano Sala and his pilot begins on Sunday.

The Air Accidents Investigation Branch (AAIB) said its Geo Ocean III vessel was expected to arrive at the search area at 09:00 GMT.

Together with a privately-funded vessel, it will conduct sonar surveys off Guernsey.

The AAIB said its search was expected to last three days, while the private search will continue "until the plane is located".

Speaking from Guernsey harbour, Mr Mearns said his team would work jointly with the AAIB's vessel.

They plan to search an area covering two square miles about 24 nautical miles north of Guernsey.

The location has been based on the flight path before it lost radar contact, said Mr Mearns, a shipwreck hunter.

Mr Mearns said both vessels would divide their search area in half, looking for "wreckage" and a "debris field" in a depth of 60-120m (196-390ft).

"We will continue to work until the plane is located," he said.

Sala plane underwater search begins