Australia Claremont Serial Killer, 1996 - 1997, Perth, Western Australia

[crabstick]

Cutlers car was placed 6km direct north of St Patricks church in the Cott beach? 1 travel hour by boat using Petermanns bar scale

 

[crabstick]

Who said Mundaring Weir? Your not allowed in there

 

[hoshizora]

I honestly don't think anything you're saying has anything to do with the deaths of these girls or the Claremont serial killer.

 

[hoshizora]

Claremont serial killer: Taxi clue to Ciara Glennon’s death

MORE than 17 years after Ciara Glennon’s body was found in dense bushland 45km north of Perth, a local man has come forward with information that puts a taxi at the scene.

http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/wes...a-glennons-death/story-fnhocxo3-1227173673919

Opinion: Has the Claremont serial killer trail really gone cold?

HAS the trail really gone cold in Australia’s biggest crime investigation, the Claremont serial killings?

WA Police maintain the case is solvable despite the significant passage of time – 19 years since the first girl, Sarah Spiers, vanished – and the millions of man-hours invested by detectives here, by experts from overseas, and in many painstaking reviews.

http://www.perthnow.com.au/news/opi...really-gone-cold/story-fnhocuug-1227188005603

 

[crabstick]

I think some of it does. Sure, its speculation but times and places have validity. Are any of the persons of interest anti-catholic? Do any of the streets relate to their home addresses?

The bodies were laid so the line between them passes through Claremont hotel. Whats the chances? It was deliberate.
Two of the victims were taken either on feast days of the Irelands 3 Patron saints (Both of Iona) were abducted and one only a couple of days in the lead up. Whats the chances?
Ionas logo is of the Southern cross. As per the above data posted I think the victims were abducted and placed in relation to the Southern Cross at the time.
The victims were abducted at around midnight.

Founded on 11 September 1907, the College is named after the Scottish Isle of Iona. Five Presentation Sisters from Kildare, Ireland, followed a call in the 1900s that brought them to Western Australia.
Perth’s first Bishop, Bishop Gibney, felt the Mosman Park site reminded him of the Isle of Iona in Scotland, where Irish Saint Columba (or Columcille) founded a community in 563AD. The Scottish Isle of Iona became a centre of learning from which Saint Columba set forth to spread the Gospel. Bishop Gibney hoped that the site in Perth would fulfill the same purpose.

Its easy to say that you don't think, but explain why, discount the data, the evidence there that relates to the times and places. Discount the attributes the girls have in relationship with the attributes given.
Maybe an astronomer can discount it but someone from the catholic church would know the relationship for sure.
Have you even look at the dates published and places on a map instead dump another media article?

I honestly don't think anything you're saying has anything to do with the deaths of these girls or the Claremont serial killer.

 

[crabstick]

This is someone with a reasonable education and knowledge in a time when there was not quick access on the internet. They have spent some time reading and probably exposure to the areas history.

Debi Marshalls book has outlined the presence of a pretty heavy 'coma' drug. Someone with access to this drug also used as a recreational drug.

Read up on the early interpretation of religious feast. Skulls in wells. WA shares a lot of Ionas geological names. I was surprised.

But how did this person or persons know these girls? This wasn't random. It appears very planned. They either knew the girls or they had access to a database of some form.

 

[crabstick]

I don't think this case will be publicly solved. I think the intention was to set someone up by the killers. Its potentially divisive to the community. Its political. Its religiously sensitive. A person or person is trying to tell a story. A lot of the information is not something wanted in the broader religious population.

 

[Mel 1303]

Crabstick, you have clearly spent a lot of time on this. I must admit, I am a bit confused. I can see where you are going with some of your info, but it all just seems so complicated. To play devils advocate, for want of a better term,

* If someone is anti catholic, and searching for catholic victims who went to catholic schools, why search pubs in the middle of the night? I know after a few drinks people are more vulnerable, but a pub trendy with younger people seems such an unlikely searching ground for catholic victims to kill and dispose of in such symbolic ways.

* It is very coincidental that the three girls went to the same school, however Perth is small in terms of capital cities and IPC is a big catholic girls school. Wealthy catholic families would send their girls there, and Claremont is a pretty wealthy area. I was shopping there yesterday- it is still a very wealthy area. There would be a good chance that girls out and about for the night in Claremont would have attended IPC. I thought, but may well be wrong, that IPC had a higher percentage of day girls, and other girls schools such as MLC had more boarders. If that is the case, IPC girls would be more likely to be in the area as adults than girls from other schools as they would probably have family in the area. Ciara was 27, it was a long time since she had been at school.

Your research is pretty comprehensive, thank you for sharing.

I missed the reference to Mundaring Weir- do I need to read back more carefully, or was something deleted?

 

[Mel 1303]

Did all three girls attend IPC? I cant find anything anywhere that confirms Ciara went to that school. It appears she went to a different co-ed school in Perth.

 

[crabstick]

Apparently two of them went to Iona, the third may have for a short period. Glad to hear the facts.

Did all three girls attend IPC? I cant find anything anywhere that confirms Ciara went to that school. It appears she went to a different co-ed school in Perth.

The 3 Patron Saints of Ireland

Sarah Spiers Missing Jan 27 - Brigit of Kildare - Feast day1st February
Jane Rimmer Missing June 9 - Saint Columba - Abbott of Iona - Feast day June 9th
Ciara Glennon Missing March 14 - St Patrick - founded abbey on Iona - Feast March 17th

I dont know the exact coordinates the two victims were found.



St Brigid's head was reputedly carried to King Denis of Portugal in 1283 by Irish knights travelling to the Aragonese Crusade

 

[PrimeSuspect]

@ crabstick, are you describing from your studies, the modus operandi of the killer?

 

[crabstick]

Looks like someone demonstrating their history, mapping, astrology, psych skills. Someone familiar the Gaelic language? Its just thematic storyline.
If its true, its a hell of a novel. Any fictional murder books with similar storyline?

The bloke below doesn't look like he spends much time in the sun. Light skin, dark hair. Is he even an Australian citizen? Kiwi?

@ crabstick, are you describing from your studies, the modus operandi of the killer?

 

[crabstick]

Ciara was at Royal Freshwater Yacht club the night before organising her sisters wedding?

Essentially, a taxi or car would roll down Bayview terrace into the Claremont yacht club. The yacht could then head out of the river up or down to the marinas closest to the two victims in the above map. They could then be delivered to their planned locations?

Boat owners checked in both yacht clubs? Someone with a yacht would have the skills to map out what has been done.

An easy undetected getaway? No roads until the last few miles.

 

[hoshizora]

Have you even look at the dates published and places on a map instead dump another media article?

Wow. There's no need to be like that. I post media links because they're the only things we get on the case that are actually updates and not speculation. And yes, I did look at the dates and try to make sense of the stuff you have posted. I am a reasonably intelligent person. I just don't think it ties into the case. And I'm not going to explain why I don't believe it when it's just theories and speculation and everyone has their own. I think the only thing that you have brought to our attention that has some weight is that the bodies being laid so the line passes through the Claremont Hotel. It sounds like you've done a lot of research on this and I respect that though.

 

[hoshizora]

I know we're not allowed to post links to other forums, but there is some interesting discussion about the CSK on a forum about football (AFL, not soccer, for those international people following this case). You should be able to find it if you google CSK.

 

[hoshizora]

You'll have to pardon me for dumping another link.

Coronial inquest key to crack cold cases, says family of murdered teenager Daniel Morcombe

THE father of murdered Daniel Morcombe would like to see coronial inquests used more readily to crack Australia’s most difficult and protracted cases.

Bruce Morcombe said an inquest was a “game-breaker” in his son’s case and he believes the extra powers available – such as compelling suspects to answer questions in a courtroom setting – could have a similar, positive impact on other cold cases.

In WA, shadow attorney general John Quigley recently called on the State Coroner to probe the unsolved Claremont serial killings. Mr Quigley said an inquest also offered the best hope for a breakthrough in the Corryn Rayney investigation.

http://www.news.com.au/national/wes...-daniel-morcombe/story-fnii5thn-1227188263268

Very interesting. What are your opinions on this? Do you think cases should be pushed towards an inquest or the police should continue their investigations/collect evidence? It's hard to know because we don't know how much evidence the police have and what an inquest would find.

 

[Mel 1303]

It has been nearly 20 years- these girls deserve justice. Their families deserve justice. Sarah deserves to be returned to her family and friends.

Would an inquest help? Maybe. In the case of Daniel Morcombe, it definitely did. My impression was that they were pretty sure who was responsible for Daniel's disappearance, and needed the higher powers of an inquest to compel people to testify. Are LE as sure in this case? I would love to see an inquest that tested all the evidence, evaluated the investigation, and made solid useful recommendations. My fear would be that it would turn into a circus and cause even greater heartache for the families. So hard to know without knowing what the police already have.

 

[crabstick]

The fact the girls were taken around the 3 patron saint dates meant the murderer had some form of ritual going on. In some of the info I posted prior it mentions Southern Cross at midnight in Ireland.
I believe the 3 patron saints were responsible for ridding Ireland of its 'pagans'. If all the girls are Catholics then maybe they had some form of history agenda. A psychologist may understand the motives, or the concept a druid trio etc has a fanciful murderous theme in this case.
I believe that the killer or killers either pre-planned these 3 victims via their surnames and or the jewellery they were wearing. They may have recognised the jewellery they were wearing and the underlying meaning.
Of all the girls that are in Claremont at a given time, whats the chances they went to Iona? Thats area is a private school cluster of non catholic schools.
Research the jewellery that is missing. I believe Sarah had a sunflower or daisy missing? Ciara has a claddagh ring or something missing? Was Jane wearing jewellery that went missing? Jane may have met this person elsewhere prior? She ignored the girls then sat there looking.
See what the Gaelic interpretation of the daisy and Claddagh ring represent. Someone with a good understanding of Gaelic history appears to have been involved. The jewellery is missing...
I must admit, initially I had an interest for reasons I wont divulge but when someone pointed out geographical placement of the bodies then I really took an interest in where another body or bodies may have been placed. This wasn't your average murder crime, it was carefully planned.
Initially I thought all the girls were Irish. I did some research then discovered the history of Iona in the UK, then when I discovered the Patron saint dates I thought I had made some serious headway but I'm not sure it will lead to the identity of the culprit or culprits.
Initially I had some time and spent 8 days looking through Google earth. I lost interest but then started back to look from time to time.
The problem with the spatial analysis is it can be everything and it can be nothing. A very inefficient tool.
An example might be, while I don't know where one person of interest lives. I looked in the phone book. It may not be his address.
If correct, his adjacent street is Lillian st (Janes body laid in Lilies) and in line with the address is Columba st. It could be hints at his location or totally circumstantial. Run a vector from Cutlers car through to Iona, it runs straight through the address. It can be everything or nothing.
But when bodies are laid in a manner that the vector passes through Bayview tce. That's a deliberate attempt.
I think the daisy and claddagh are both a form of geometry carried out with a compass and square. I think there's a map of some form with a similar format which has the location of the bodies on it. Is it complex or quite simple is the question.
Initially I thought it may have been a teacher or someone studying to be in the education industry.

Crabstick, you have clearly spent a lot of time on this. I must admit, I am a bit confused. I can see where you are going with some of your info, but it all just seems so complicated. To play devils advocate, for want of a better term,

* If someone is anti catholic, and searching for catholic victims who went to catholic schools, why search pubs in the middle of the night? I know after a few drinks people are more vulnerable, but a pub trendy with younger people seems such an unlikely searching ground for catholic victims to kill and dispose of in such symbolic ways.

* It is very coincidental that the three girls went to the same school, however Perth is small in terms of capital cities and IPC is a big catholic girls school. Wealthy catholic families would send their girls there, and Claremont is a pretty wealthy area. I was shopping there yesterday- it is still a very wealthy area. There would be a good chance that girls out and about for the night in Claremont would have attended IPC. I thought, but may well be wrong, that IPC had a higher percentage of day girls, and other girls schools such as MLC had more boarders. If that is the case, IPC girls would be more likely to be in the area as adults than girls from other schools as they would probably have family in the area. Ciara was 27, it was a long time since she had been at school.

Your research is pretty comprehensive, thank you for sharing.

I missed the reference to Mundaring Weir- do I need to read back more carefully, or was something deleted?

 

[crabstick]

Look at Mallard, busted knocking off the Iona chalice.
The Lilies Jane were laid in are lilies often used in marriage ceremonies. The macro taskforce pin is a lilie.
Was there a group of people holding marriage ceremonies knocking off girls? You know, it can be everything and nothing.

Where Jane was laid has a couple of different significant points in mapping on some maps.

Both the suburbs were UK orientated, both the streets are UK orientated, both the victims are UK orientated.

 

[crabstick]

Initially while I searched the main meridian for clues I discovered Spiers st on it in the North. I then went ok, looked at Glennon and Rimmer lane? Running a vector through those two streets ran through St Patricks church in Freo. It can be everything and it can be nothing but it reinforced the 3 patron saint theme again.
There is other attributes I discovered which someone would have to have personal knowledge of pre Google earth and CAD applications. Another is that the vector we do know, runs through the Irish embassy. At one point I thought a cartographer may have been involved for reasons I wont mention.
There is other attributes in cartography I discovered but it could be everything or nothing.

Google earth may not help us because I think this was potentially done with compass and square or slide on a paper map.

1996 was a pretty eventful year. For instance, the IRA had an uprising in 86. I thought all the girls were Irish Catholics, but apparently they're not.