Found Deceased CO - Gannon Stauch, 11, Colorado Springs, El Paso County, 27 Jan 2020 **ARREST** #42

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  • #501
Yes, I thought her story was that police came to the store or parking lot to get the car. She said LE thought her daughter had the keys in her purse, but TS had them in her pocket.
I thought this occurred at the Marshall's store ?
Where they were purchasing undergarments ... as TS and HH had been "kicked out of the house" by Gannon's parents ? (TS' words, not mine.)
 
  • #502
  • #503
BBM:

Great questions!

The answers are somewhat subjective, but I'll give you my opinion.
I was willing to give HH the benefit of the doubt until I read the affidavit.

The line for me was upon discovering that she refused to cooperate with investigators in the case of her missing, vulnerable, 11-year-old stepbrother.
_______________________________

For me, there's the Red Line. HH crossed it.

The argument that "she's a minor" is not going to cut it for me. At all.

Moral development, i.e., knowing right from wrong, understanding the link between actions and consequences, empathy, etc., occurs prior to the age of 18.
There's not a magic switch at 18, where, Voila! People reach an age of moral accountability.

If HH doesn't know the difference b/t right and wrong now, she likely never will.
I personally suspect she never will…or if she does, she'll disregard it, just as she disregarded it in this case.


Either wittingly or unwittingly, and, frankly, none of us knows which is the case, HH aided TS in cleaning up a crime scene by purchasing cleaning supplies for her, then taking LS out of the house while TS scrubbed TS's blood off of walls, floors, etc.

Do I think HH knew at the time she was purchasing supplies to help her mother clean up a bloody murder scene?
No.


Do I think HH now realizes she purchased supplies to help her mother clean up a bloody murder scene?
Heck, yeah.

She knows.

HH has lied to reporters for her mother.
Even little kids know lying is wrong.

The argument that, "Well, she probably believed her mother," is laughable to me.
Do people honestly think HH doesn't know that her mother is a consummate liar?
She knows her mother lies with practically every exhaled breath.

She also knows her mother did something bad to GS.
She made a decision not to cooperate with LE.


Which is to say, she made a decision not to help investigators find her missing 11-year-old stepbrother.

There's my
Red Line.

JMO.
@GordianKnot , Your position is well stated and duly noted!
e00e.png


Justice for Gannon!
 
  • #504
The first thought I had was air freshener.
Like TS thought she'd erase any horrible smells of blood by spritzing the basement ?

Or there's other coconut smells that are in suntan lotion.
At that time of year it's not likely.

Probably first smelled of bleach (which is probably how she damaged the carpet). So she had to spray to cover that up.

Just a guess.
 
  • #505
So at what point do you hold a 17 year old accountable for their actions? This smacks of enabling them to do whatever they wish. No responsibilities for it. I disagree with you.

Gannon...

I respectfully disagree, MOO, I think LE
has more information than anyone here,
I do not think we need to judge someone, on this forum...

We have argued this particular topic enough, I think it is time to let it rest...
JMHO

Having said that, HH has a lot to deal
w/. She has 50% of her mother’s genes,
(Nature), and 100% of her mother’s
upbringing, (nurture).
Those are some
hard obstacles to overcome. MOO LE
has great experience in dealing w/ kids
like Harley, I have great confidence in
their assessment...JMO
 
  • #506
BBM:

Great questions!

The answers are somewhat subjective, but I'll give you my opinion.
I was willing to give HH the benefit of the doubt until I read the affidavit.

The line for me was upon discovering that she refused to cooperate with investigators in the case of her missing, vulnerable, 11-year-old stepbrother.
_______________________________

For me, there's the Red Line. HH crossed it.

The argument that "she's a minor" is not going to cut it for me. At all.

Moral development, i.e., knowing right from wrong, understanding the link between actions and consequences, empathy, etc., occurs prior to the age of 18.
There's not a magic switch at 18, where, Voila! People reach an age of moral accountability.

If HH doesn't know the difference b/t right and wrong now, she likely never will.
I personally suspect she never will…or if she does, she'll disregard it, just as she disregarded it in this case.


Either wittingly or unwittingly, and, frankly, none of us knows which is the case, HH aided TS in cleaning up a crime scene by purchasing cleaning supplies for her, then taking LS out of the house while TS scrubbed TS's blood off of walls, floors, etc.

Do I think HH knew at the time she was purchasing supplies to help her mother clean up a bloody murder scene?
No.


Do I think HH now realizes she purchased supplies to help her mother clean up a bloody murder scene?
Heck, yeah.

She knows.

HH has lied to reporters for her mother.
Even little kids know lying is wrong.

The argument that, "Well, she probably believed her mother," is laughable to me.
Do people honestly think HH doesn't know that her mother is a consummate liar?
She knows her mother lies with practically every exhaled breath.

She also knows her mother did something bad to GS.
She made a decision not to cooperate with LE.


Which is to say, she made a decision not to help investigators find her missing 11-year-old stepbrother.

There's my
Red Line.

JMO.

I do so look forward to hearing about HH's time on the witness stand. At this point, she may be charged herself with various things (along with DL - LS's mother and possibly LS's sister). But HH's cooperation is no longer needed - even as a so-called hostile witness, she'll be a total mess on the stand and will either lie and be ridiculous or tell the truth.

It's my red line too.
 
  • #507
I thought this occurred at the Marshall's store ?
Where they were purchasing undergarments ... as TS and HH had been "kicked out of the house" by Gannon's parents ? (TS' words, not mine.)
Yes, as opposed to being "pulled over." I don't think I've ever heard that before. Maybe it was an error. Idk.
 
  • #508
I am now also wondering if HH knew G was in the suitcase in the rental van on their way to Florida.
I seriously doubt a 17 year old who seems naive and easy to control could keep it together mentally knowing her stepbrother was murdered and in a suitcase. We do not know all the facts in this case. We do not know if LS went to SC first and then made a special trip by herself to FL or if she detoured to FL on her way to SC or if she did if HH went with her there. Wasn't there a caravan of family that helped her pack and move back to SC? That is what I read on many groups, that she had family there and the ones I assume she was talking to in the interveiw when she asked where HH was saying she needed HH. If that is the case, I find it highly unlikely she detoured to FL with her caravn of family driving back to SC. That would of been hard to explain. LE has stated at this time they do not believe HH was involved in any of this. Why must so many people keep trying to drag her into this?
 
  • #509
I seriously doubt a 17 year old who seems naive and easy to control could keep it together mentally knowing her stepbrother was murdered and in a suitcase. We do not know all the facts in this case. We do not know if LS went to SC first and then made a special trip by herself to FL or if she detoured to FL on her way to SC or if she did if HH went with her there. Wasn't there a caravan of family that helped her pack and move back to SC? That is what I read on many groups, that she had family there and the ones I assume she was talking to in the interveiw when she asked where HH was saying she needed HH. If that is the case, I find it highly unlikely she detoured to FL with her caravn of family driving back to SC. That would of been hard to explain. LE has stated at this time they do not believe HH was involved in any of this. Why must so many people keep trying to drag her into this?

Gannon...

Very well said...
 
  • #510
"He just broke down crying and said, 'She lied. She lied about the time. He didn’t go to a friend's house,'" Drayton said.

I've thought about this some more. I wonder if Al's breakdown came from the pressure of knowing almost from the beginning that T was involved and RD was the first physical acknowledgement by someone outside of LE that T was responsible? As in, the video might have not mattered at all, but that Al had an extremely emotional reaction to someone else keying in on T.
 
  • #511
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  • #512
Re: HH, I think we should all remember that if SHE had done what her mother did, she'd be charged, and charged as an adult.

I think she knows quite a bit; otherwise she would fully cooperate with LE.

The other day I asked, "Where are the marshmallows?"
Miss 6 replied immediately, "I don't know!"
Mr 7 then said, " Did you check the shelf where you think you hide stuff? "
Mr 9 was watching me closely and finally said, "I think I shouldn't answer this, I have constitutional rights!" (I am a long time homeschooling momma, raising two grands...we had learned about the 4th amendment that day!)
Ha! I'll refrain from repeating how THAT chat went, and he quickly admitted to hiding them to see if I'd notice. Lucky for him, it was still sealed.

But y'all get my point. The two who spoke up had no idea, the last one had to get momma's evil eye threat.
 
  • #513
I've thought about this some more. I wonder if Al's breakdown came from the pressure of knowing almost from the beginning that T was involved and RD was the first physical acknowledgement by someone outside of LE that T was responsible? As in, the video might have not mattered at all, but that Al had an extremely emotional reaction to someone else keying in on T.
I actually take all of that at face value. I think both the neighbor and Al believed that Gannon didn’t return home.

I think law enforcement would have believed the same thing, if not for that bloody crime scene.

The video just didn’t get a clear image of him.
 
  • #514
In all actuality no one here at WS has 'dragged ' HH into this.

She is nearly an adult and she lived at that house.

And she was stated in the AA as "Not cooperating" with LE.
That speaks volumes.

There's more I can post but will add later as real life is calling. :p

I'll refer commenters back to @GordianKnots 's valuable post concerning the red line that has most definitely been crossed.

Again, no one pulled HH into this investigation.
If LE said she was cooperating there'd be less speculation, and we don't know if anything has changed with her refusal to assist LE or --way before TS' arrest for his murder-- not helping to look for a supposedly lost and frightened 11 year old.

Gannon --while he was still 'missing' -- should have been of more concern than a mother's lies and even a daughter's sympathy for TS.
So that's about the state of things at this point.
 
  • #515
I don't want to sound like I'm dismissing you or people that have commented about HH's upbringing being a reason for not cooperating or having an unfailing allegiance to their parent. But, serious question from me is where is the the line? Because one reason I've flipped on feeling sorry for HH to being very suspicious is that this is a murder case of her step brother. I feel she should have been very open to relaying on the oddities of her mother's behavior to investigators prior to the arrest given what we read about her in the AA.

So where is that line - should people raised by a TS type person be treated differently if they actively participate in murdering someone with their mothers? Covering up murder? Participating in something not as bad as murder? Knowing info but not cooperating? Knowing nothing and not cooperating? Note I'm *NOT* saying HH is involved at all in the act of murder. Just wondering where she stops being a victim that doesn't deserve judgement of her behavior for people that sympathize with her upbringing.

I completely understand and sympathize with those that can compare their own upbringing with HH's, so please don't take this post as confrontational, I'm just genuinely curious of where the line is crossed from victim to willing participant. Regarding HH specifically, what would need to come out in this case to come to a mindset of "despite her upbringing she really isn't a victim here - should have known better and <fill_in_the_blanks_here> is inexcusable behavior."
For me, the line is where one person's rights violates criminal or civil law.
 
  • #516
Hmmm.... I recall that the burned carpet was a story from SM (and banned from WS discussion). If LE did not find any evidence of the alleged burned carpet per AA, then perhaps it was a rumor(?)...

Was LS thinking about trying to disguise the murder of GS with a house fire? o_O
That's a good possibility, because that video is said to be from Sunday night. Did she opt instead for trying to poison him? That didn't work either, so she kills him in the eleventh hour at home?

One thing we didn't see mentioned in any of those search warrants in the AA, was firearms. Did they have any?
 
  • #517
RD also said there was even audio. Say if GS went through the back gate which goes around (i believe) to the sliding glass to the main level, then I just dont get not hearing a second car slam that day or what.

I know Im in the absolute minority, but I have never believed the tape to be the day in question. I have always thought that Gannon was murdered in the home. This is not a knock on RD about who he is as a person to be clear, but a lot of the story never made sense. It makes less sense if we say Gannon was murdered at 2:20 ish and in the home.

RD saying "this is the break we needed" didn't make sense bc he didnt find the video until 6 days later and 2 days after Gannon was reported missing, Tee was already getting interviewed as lets face it, a suspect. There were reports that LE source told the media that she was suspected day 1 and that was told to them within a day or two. A lot happened between day 1 and 6. I don't think anyone knew that TS would have such an insane story, but it really confirms that LE wanted her for the murder by the 29th. The issues with the release of the tape are interesting too since LE said they did not want that released. I am not sure if they were playing games to get movement from her or what though. It's very confusing. I also find it interesting that only is RD not on the list, but neither is xfinity. Someone has to validate it in court I think. At least thats how I've seen these things go. In the Amber Guyger trial there were dates and times messed up for a key card Amber used to enter the gates of the building where her and Botham Jean lived. They had a person from the server management team come to court and explain the dates and also validate that the records they had in their hands were the same the company had. I think it's pretty standard practice to compare data an individual has (even if its LE) to an expert even if that is just an "expert" in their company. The DA will do the same thing with evidence to confirm that the evidence inside matches what they signed off on.


And like I said before, the cleaning up for such a short time doesn't add up to me. Its a lot to get done. I also wonder (warning graphic)

how long does blood have to sit to seep from carpet, to carpet pad, to cement? Im guessing its longer than an hour so if they arrived home at 2:20 and Laina arrived at 3:15 its not adding up to enough time. I wish I could test that. Even if Gannon was left there for an hour and it pooled in that period, that would mean she still needed to remove his bedding, clean the walls, clean the spot in the utility room, and the stairs basically getting into the time HH returned home. Thats a lot of work

First, it had to be quite a volume of blood. Think about how if you spilled 16 ounces of water on your mattress - it probably would barely make it to the springs or the floor if the mattress was on the floor. I don't know what kind of mattress they had, but I'd think it would take at least an hour to get through a typical mattress. Maybe longer.

I believe Gannon was killed by a gunshot to the head (from about the doorway or a little closer). Most of his blood ended up in that mattress and LE knew that early on. Somehow, LS managed to hide the blood spatter on the wall and in the mattress from LE's first inspection. She had already split the scene when MCS came back and discovered what had happened. I'm guessing the "saucer sized" pool stain was on the floor, under the carpet, under the mattress - and that each higher level of blood stain was bigger.

I also believe that LE has evidence that the only two people in the house were Gannon and Letecia Stauch.

Her google search results show an upset woman - but not a psychotic one. I want to say "desperately stupid and lonely." If I didn't know what happened after, that's what I'd say.

I think there's more to her search history that will come out at trial. This was just to get her arrested. Kudos to Officer Bethel, btw, for her understated and very convincing report.

I also believe LS had to use the particle board to drag Gannon's body (possibly with rigor setting in) to her car.
 
  • #518
I seriously doubt a 17 year old who seems naive and easy to control could keep it together mentally knowing her stepbrother was murdered and in a suitcase. We do not know all the facts in this case. We do not know if LS went to SC first and then made a special trip by herself to FL or if she detoured to FL on her way to SC or if she did if HH went with her there. Wasn't there a caravan of family that helped her pack and move back to SC? That is what I read on many groups, that she had family there and the ones I assume she was talking to in the interveiw when she asked where HH was saying she needed HH. If that is the case, I find it highly unlikely she detoured to FL with her caravn of family driving back to SC. That would of been hard to explain. LE has stated at this time they do not believe HH was involved in any of this. Why must so many people keep trying to drag her into this?

Well, I don't think HH knew that Gannon was murdered and in a suitcase. She's taken an internal stance that her Mom is Truthful and at that point, she was buying LS's story even though no one else ever would. So HH would not have thought Gannon was in a suitcase in either the Nissan or the moving van (I think it was the moving van for obvious reasons).

But HH knew, deep inside, that her mother was lying or covering up for something. Even if she believed Gannon had run away, she had to tell herself that there was a reason. LS probably made it sound like it was AS's fault

Spencer Wilson says there were 5 people in the "caravan" on Jan 31. It seems clear they either left that night or the next morning (probably that night but didn't go too far). 5 of them.

The maps created here on WS and elsewhere show that at some point, there does seem to be a parting of the ways between the two vehicles (but not necessarily - the other hypothesis would be that they were somewhat lost - I don't think they were lost).

LS went to Florida. There were 5 seats in the Nissan. She could have driven the moving van by herself.

Surely everyone in the car had to be very very suspicious by then? If they testify that they were totally unaware and unconcerned about LS leaving CO right after Gannon disappeared, they lose all credibility with the jury and if they are even remotely like LS, they'll say that they were suspicious.
 
  • #519
BBM:

Great questions!

The answers are somewhat subjective, but I'll give you my opinion.
I was willing to give HH the benefit of the doubt until I read the affidavit.

The line for me was upon discovering that she refused to cooperate with investigators in the case of her missing, vulnerable, 11-year-old stepbrother.
_______________________________

For me, there's the Red Line. HH crossed it.

The argument that "she's a minor" is not going to cut it for me. At all.

Moral development, i.e., knowing right from wrong, understanding the link between actions and consequences, empathy, etc., occurs prior to the age of 18. There's not a magic switch at 18, where, Voila! People reach an age of moral accountability.


If HH doesn't know the difference b/t right and wrong now, she likely never will.
I personally suspect she never will…or if she does, she'll disregard it, just as she disregarded it in this case.


Either wittingly or unwittingly, and, frankly, none of us knows which is the case, HH aided TS in cleaning up a crime scene by purchasing cleaning supplies for her, then taking LS out of the house while TS scrubbed TS's blood off of walls, floors, etc.

Do I think HH knew at the time she was purchasing supplies to help her mother clean up a bloody murder scene?
No.


Do I think HH now realizes she purchased supplies to help her mother clean up a bloody murder scene?
Heck, yeah.

She knows.

HH has lied to reporters for her mother.
Even little kids know lying is wrong.

The argument that, "Well, she probably believed her mother," is laughable to me.
Do people honestly think HH doesn't know that her mother is a consummate liar?
She knows her mother lies with practically every exhaled breath.

She also knows her mother did something bad to GS.
She made a decision not to cooperate with LE.


Which is to say, she made a decision not to help investigators find her missing 11-year-old stepbrother.

There's my
Red Line.

JMO.
Hehehhe-- totally OT, but I am cracking up over your new avatar.
I think the world of you both and value your opinions here and the Bet was hilarious.
Thanks for laugh today.
JS and JMO
 
  • #520
bbm
I actually take all of that at face value. I think both the neighbor and Al believed that Gannon didn’t return home.

I think law enforcement would have believed the same thing, if not for that bloody crime scene.

The video just didn’t get a clear image of him.
But it sure did show a shadow.
 
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