CO - Jessica Ridgeway, 10, Westminster, 5 Oct 2012 - #21

[mck16]

I've known more people who have been released from prison than I care to even think about. I can't say that any of them was in a healthier state of mind when released than when incarcerated. I agree that he's unlikely to get any kind of help other than possibly meds.

I actually think more are worse when they come out. they have learned new tricks to hone their particular crimes. Plus they are all mad at the 'system'. Not many take ownership of their problem and try to change. jmo

 

[human]

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=...vqvZwGobrwofDMI9w&sig2=Mu1auTcCoJXMS4ZBu1kHig

Child of Rage. This scared me to death when I saw it.

Exactly. We need parenting classes. Yes we do!!!!

 

[Yellow]

:what:

I go back and forth with it, not because of Jessica's body and items but because how do they have DNA from the joggers? Did they scratch him? I'm confused on that. However, I think AS would like to believe with all his "research" and semester of college (it's not even the end of 1st semester), that he was brilliant and would not get caught. He thought too much of himself and it made his actions sloppy. Just my opinion.

Plus DA said they have lots of DNA to connect him so there must be DNA. It might possibly be only they have touch DNA from the backpack. And maybe to the cross. That would be sufficient, Sorry to be gruesome but maybe they did not find yet the parts of the body that have DNA on them, but they should find them soon, though 3 weeks later I am not sure how much DNA will be there and if he would have done something to get rid of DNA like bleach.

 

[stillwatersc]

Random thoughts:

When AS confessed to his mom, he already knew LE had his DNA. Maybe he hoped his mom would help him leave the country or something, not turn him in. I don't think there was any possibility she would have, but AS may have thought so little of the crime and so highly of himself to believe it.

Whatever he put in the crawlspace was buried or in containers or at least heavily covered - to hide from view and to reduce the smell so it wouldn't be obvious from inside the home.

I think he had previously done allot of dismembering with animals and he was escalating.

Anyone who has had the misfortune to associate closely with a sociopath knows AS's personality. Sociopaths can have different interests, habits & motivations but the way they interact with other people is amazingly similar. There is no rehab for these people.

I highly doubt there was an accomplice.

 

[human]

I don't think that any conclusions can be drawn regarding factors that cause sociopathic behavior. It is possible to find examples of serial murderers that had unfortunate childhoods, and it is possible to find examples of serial murderers that had fortunate childhoods.

Could you please give any examples of people who had good childhoods that are serial killers?

There was a poster who said she was a professional that worked with people who said they had wonderful childhoods, but she had the records of the abuse reports etc.

That is my experience as well. People thinking they had good childhoods, but either they are in denial, or they have no clue what a loving childhood is

 

[Yellow]

Question I had is why didn't anyone see him in the process of hogtieing her?

Ok, so he puts her in the car, I assume she is screaming unless he had chloroform. But it does not seem like he set out to do this that day so maybe he did not have chloroform. He gets her in the car and ties her up. That had to take a few minutes, right? And the car would have been stopped right on the street w a kid screaming fighting off being tied up.

Was it just dumb luck that no one drove by? A car idling there would have attracted notice. Plus he would have had to drive her somewhere. Did no one see him at a stoplight, etc w a girl hogtied in the car?

Oh and he also says he strangled her, apparently while driving I think. How could that have happened? I read it takes a few minutes to strangle. She had to have been upright if he was in drivers seat. Would no one have not seen him in the 4 minutes or so he strangled her? The car would have been driven somewhat erratically if one was driving and strangling someone.

It does not add up, IMO. I think she has to have been knocked out quick. As the murder happened at a secondary scene not the car. I think someone would have seen if the murder happened in the car and he hogtied her,

 

[Marilynilpa]

I wonder if the name sent to MPN was AS or someone else? Has anyone heard anything about AS taking an interest in the Bible?

Even if it wasn't AS, LE would have caught him when the DNA swabs were tested. MOO

I couldn't make it out from what I read. It could have been AS, or someone else.

Perhaps by referring to an interest in the Bible, we are to assume this means AS since it is known that a cross is connected in some way with Jessica's murder?

I agree with you. Once his DNA was taken, it was simply a matter of time before LE knew it was AS.

I wonder if AS might have "confessed" to his mom because he thought she might help him get away? If so, she quite rightly called LE. JMO

 

[Marnie]

I wonder if one of the conditions of his treatment from addiction was that he not be allowed online? His online life seems to have abruptly cut off circa two years ago. Maybe it was court ordered and is linked to a possible juvenile charge (this is all speculation).

It may have been part of his treatment at a psych facility, but if there was no LE or arrest involved, there would be no way to say if it was a condition to his treatment plan or if there was a way for them to monitor his online activity. IMO.

Jumping off of this post.....Which brings me to this question: If he is tried as a juvie, are all his possible priors allowed to come into play? Even if he is tried as an adult, would any of his possible juvenile offenses be allowed in court? I mean, technically, he IS a juvenile. Can anyone help me understand this?

 

[Jules71]

I wonder if one of the conditions of his treatment from addiction was that he not be allowed online? His online life seems to have abruptly cut off circa two years ago. Maybe it was court ordered and is linked to a possible juvenile charge (this is all speculation).

Very good thought!

 

[passionflower]

I wonder if he was the favorite son, the golden boy like scott peterson or joran vs?

 

[Jules71]

Could you please give any examples of people who had good childhoods that are serial killers?

There was a poster who said she was a professional that worked with people who said they had wonderful childhoods, but she had the records of the abuse reports etc.

That is my experience as well. People thinking they had good childhoods, but either they are in denial, or they have no clue what a loving childhood is

Good question. I would be interested to see if any SK's truly had good childhoods (not just what they thought was a good childhood).

According to the article that was linked before: "They [scientists] believe that brain patterns and genetic makeup are not enough to make anyone a psychopath. You need a third ingredient: abuse or violence in one's childhood.

I found it interesting about the "warrior gene" and if you have that you may not respond to serotonin.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=127888976

 

[Marilynilpa]

Could you please give any examples of people who had good childhoods that are serial killers?

There was a poster who said she was a professional that worked with people who said they had wonderful childhoods, but she had the records of the abuse reports etc.

That is my experience as well. People thinking they had good childhoods, but either they are in denial, or they have no clue what a loving childhood is

Aren't there some serial killers who by all accounts had good childhoods? I think there may be, but can't think of any off hand. I'll see what Google has to say.

ETA: Duh, just as I posted this I realized that just because someone's childhood was good "by all accounts" certainly does not mean that person feels his childhood was good. Forgive my faulty thinking!

 

[iamnotagolem]

Question I had is why didn't anyone see him in the process of hogtieing her?

Ok, so he puts her in the car, I assume she is screaming unless he had chloroform. But it does not seem like he set out to do this that day so maybe he did not have chloroform. He gets her in the car and ties her up. That had to take a few minutes, right? And the car would have been stopped right on the street w a kid screaming fighting off being tied up.

Was it just dumb luck that no one drove by? A car idling there would have attracted notice. Plus he would have had to drive her somewhere. Did no one see him at a stoplight, etc w a girl hogtied in the car?

Oh and he also says he strangled her, apparently while driving I think. How could that have happened? I read it takes a few minutes to strangle. She had to have been upright if he was in drivers seat. Would no one have not seen him in the 4 minutes or so he strangled her? The car would have been driven somewhat erratically if one was driving and strangling someone.

It does not add up, IMO. I think she has to have been knocked out quick. As the murder happened at a secondary scene not the car. I think someone would have seen if the murder happened in the car and he hogtied her,

Exactly! It was prime take your kid to school time. He had presumably dropped his brother off at school then grabbed her, who was heading to meet her friend (at an undetermined location). Where were all the other kids and parents? No one saw a thing?

If he did use chloroform, then why the need to hog tie her? If he strangled her right away, then why hogtie her?

 

[Jules71]

Re: the warrior gene aka MOA (MOA-A & MOA-B)

"MAOs are extremely important for proper brain function as they inactivate neurotransmitters. When MAOs are in over abundance, there is too much inactivation of neurotransmitters. Neurological disorders like depression, criminal behavior, phobias, ADD, and addiction can arise. In fact, a major treatment for depression is MAO inhibitors..." (MAOI's)

http://scienceblogs.com/retrospectacle/2006/08/10/the-maori-mao-inhibitors-and-t/

 

[AstroKitty]

Exactly. We need parenting classes. Yes we do!!!!

I think Beth's parents did a wonderful job. It was her bio parents that just ruined her. She is an RN/BSN now and runs a website to help others who were in her position. It's pretty fascinating and heart breaking at the same time.

 

[sfbaynancydrew]

I babysat a little boy when I was a teenager whom I am quite sure was a born psychopath. His Mom was this crunchy, love the world hippie. He had a younger sister and father was out of the picture. He was 8 and little sis was around 5. Anyhow the one and only time I babysat, he tried to kill his sister several times---made clothesline booby traps out of wire, put her in a tree and told her to jump, locked me out of the house, tried to poison the food, and was generally a terrifying child. At 16 or so I was so exasperated at the end of the night I spanked him once on the butt--hard--and he let out a howl that still haunts me because it didn't sound childlike or human. I felt awful for spanking him and broke down apologizing and crying to his mom because I felt so guilty. She was totally understanding and had that sad look of losing another babysitter. She tried calling me back several times but I always made excuses and she finally got the clue.

I get edgy thinking he's an adult now.

 

[LittleMissContrary]

Exactly. We need parenting classes. Yes we do!!!!

In reference to the movie "child of rage"


That was just downright disturbing.

Such an intelligent beautiful child. Hard to reconcile with the wounded
monster who would hurt all those around her.

 

[Desdemona]

This is from a Fox article regarding the alleged addiction and treatment.

Senior investigative reporter Josh Bernstein confirmed that the teenager had been treated for an addiction to .

Bernstein reports family members say he was just 15 years old and his addiction was so strong that it required counseling.​

http://kdvr.com/2012/10/24/exclusiv...ustin-sigg-treated-for-🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬🤬-addiction/

It does not mention a treatment facility, nor being taken out of school for treatment as has been discussed here. Do these ideas come from a different article/story? TIA

 

[foxbluff]

I go back and forth with it, not because of Jessica's body and items but because how do they have DNA from the joggers? Did they scratch him? I'm confused on that. However, I think AS would like to believe with all his "research" and semester of college (it's not even the end of 1st semester), that he was brilliant and would not get caught. He thought too much of himself and it made his actions sloppy. Just my opinion.

IDK anything for sure & I'm just jumping off Astro's post here. However, I read article from MSM that said DNA was found on backpack (and/or contents?)

Also, if my notes are correct, a 10/19/12 CBS4 article reported that the DNA from the guy arrested due to having his mother's dismembered remains in his car, eliminated him as suspect in JR's case.

I have always believed that the cross was from the site of Memorial wkend attack on 22 y.o. jogger. I believe it had perp's DNA, but that they found no match in databases. I believe DNA on that cross and on JR's backpack turned out to be a match, but again, not in databases. IMHO

Also, IMO, the only reason there's an Oct. 2012 date on the photo of the cross is that no photo was made of the cross until the DNA on it was a match to the DNA on a murdered child's backpack.

 

[AstroKitty]

It would be rather impossible to hogtie a person in a car on a street without being seen. Given of course that he did a real hogtie. I'm pretty well versed in BDSM and as soon as I read it I went "liar".
I do not think he soaked that rag with any knock out chemicals. I think he just soaked it in chemicals. I believe he was being manic in the abduction attempts (meaning, he probably has little impulse control) and it's not as well thought out as we would think it is. But he would never admit to that, because in doing so it would be admitting he didn't have full control.
I think the rag and the tying up are all fetishes of his but he's 17 and doesn't know how to exact them. He's watching and assuming that's "real life". Forgetting that it's all staged. With my background (I'm not sure I can be a verified BDSM specialist here but hey mods .. if you need one, lol I can be verified!) and knowledge, most people starting out in Sadistic behaviors with lust behind them, begin with what they see, be it old detective magazines to . They don't grasp how to get the person there though, the lure. They concentrate on what they want to DO after the person is in their control. This is why often times, as adults they seek out pro dominatrixes or pro subs, who guide them and they act it out with a consenting adult verses the alternative.

My opinion and 12 years of knowledge within that community.