Found Deceased CO - Joseph Keller, 18, Antonito, 23 July 2015 - #1

[ceci]

Lisa Tate Fetzner has made a statement on her sons Facebook page.

Collin and Christian did not leave immediately but a week later.

Mutual friends of the Kellers has told me Neal is upset that the ranch didnt call the police to report it. They are starting the process of taking in that Joe has passed but continue to pray and have hope.Zoe and Neal may you
have closure.

 

[ceci]

Wow, Lisa deleted it but she was lashing out. How people was trying her to her core. That she loved Joe and the Kellers. That Joe was a good friend to Christian. To keep praying. This is paraphasing as it was longer. It was posted for 5 mins. Max.

Lets give these boys the benefit of the doubt, its very possible Joe fell off a cliff and just hasnt been found. I do applaud that everyone here has not been mean, thanks

 

[Sutton]

Thanks for staying on top of the FB postings!!!

I always try to stay open-minded, but especially so in this case. I will keep an innocent opinion of the friends, until we learn incriminating details. The boys haven't even acted suspiciously, as far as I've heard. (They left, but what else could they do? They couldn't make police report, they were staying on a ranch with JK's family, they are 18-19.)

There are many odd cases on WS that turn out to be true (and not so odd when facts are known).

 

[Treelights]

A MUST SEE VIDEO AND ARTICLE:

http://www.newschannel9.com/news/to...end-speaks-cleveland-missing-teen-19432.shtml

"Friend Speaks About Cleveland Missing Teen."


ALSO, on the video around 1 min 11 seconds, "police arrived around midnight."
Very informative video and article.

IMOO.

 

[GigTu]

Based on FB comments alone, we've all now been convinced Joe was seen at the ranch by his Aunt and Uncle, and that his cousin saw him leave for the run?

If that's true, then we are back to square 1: Joe lost his footing and fell off a cliff, Joe may have gotten altitude sickness and became lost or fell (or both), Joe was hit by a car, Joe was abducted, Joe was attacked by a wild animal, Joe committed suicide, Joe was pushed off a cliff by a friend, Joe changed direction and went back the way he came and ____ (repeat list).

Joe was reported to be only wearing sneakers and red shorts. No shirt. What if Joe went back to his room to get a shirt or water or something, and met with foul play there? Makes me question what CF was doing while the boys were out on their run.

I am still stuck on the fact that early on LE was considering Joe's disappearance an act of foul play, they were looking into the days leading up to July 23, and their seemingly random decision to search La Jara Reservoir.

 

[OldFashionWithaFlair]

A MUST SEE VIDEO AND ARTICLE:

http://www.newschannel9.com/news/to...end-speaks-cleveland-missing-teen-19432.shtml

"Friend Speaks About Cleveland Missing Teen."


ALSO, on the video around 1 min 11 seconds, "police arrived around midnight."
Very informative video and article.

IMOO.

At this point I'm really leaning toward random abduction or possibly he went off road to look at something and had an accident. The second seems less likely to me due to the fact that they have done a thorough search. This is just a sad story. I really hope he is found so that his friends and family can have closure.

 

[SeaEclipse]

The new article/video posted above makes it sound way less like the boys were definitely planning to meet up when Collin turned around than the initial description did. If Collin didn't think it was too strange that he didn't see JK until he didn't show up for dinner, that means that he didn't think it was impossible that JK might have changed directions/run a different way. If that's true, I continue to think the most likely scenario is that Collin ran somewhere and had an accident. I'm actually not suspicious of the friends at all.

We've heard very different versions of what LE thought at the beginning (one version had them w/ no info & only focusing on an accident; another had them focusing on foul play from the get go)... so I'm considering everything on that front pure rumor for now. I do wish we knew why they searched that reservoir.

 

[Eileen730]

Remember Christian Aguilar and Pedro Bravo!
They were best friends... This case made me think of that.

Not saying that's what happened here but it came to mind!

http://abcnews.go.com/US/unrequited-love-jealousy-murder-love-triangle-ended-death/story?id=25070128

 

[GigTu]

It's very possible that Joe decided to veer off the road and follow a trail, and then became lost or just hurt. In fact, based on all that I've now read over the course of time, that seems to be the most likely scenario of all. From there, falling and inability to get up, attack from animals, exposure, or all combined would be of great threat. And if he's under cover of trees, no overhead helicopters or drones will see him. By now, the outcome is grim. If he's resourceful and able to crawl around and feed himself with whatever is available and lick condensation from plant life, he might still be alive out there. People have survived in far worse conditions. Giving up the search is premature. They should revisit everywhere they've already searched. He may have now crawled out from undercover if he heard them last time, in hopes they'll see him.

Being kidnapped seems the least likeliest scenario to me.

As Ceci stated early on, it feels very hurtful to falsely accuse the other two boys if they have done nothing wrong. If I was their family, I would be devastated to have this hanging over my son's head. But it's also important to vet all possibilities, even if just to finally rule them out. CG has been vocal in JK's disappearance. CF has been silent. If LE hadn't spent the time and money to search La Jara, I might not even have a question mark about the boys. But they did search there, and it's really odd to me that they did. How can that fact be ignored or overlooked?

 

[Sparky]

Hey Folks,

Just a friendly reminder....

Social Networks

Regarding Facebook, MySpace, Twitter, and other social networking or blog websites: Links may be used to direct posters to view something on a social networking page. But postings on social networking sites are not considered fact; they are rumor.

Copying and pasting, or taking screen caps, directly from these pages is not allowed. Paraphrasing is okay. (Exception: If the Twitter or Facebook post belongs to a verified news station, it may be copied. But a link should still be provided.)

Also, social networking pages may only be linked if they are directly related to a case, i.e. the victim or suspect.

We don't want to post to someone's mother, brother, employer, milkman, or postal carrier just because they know the main player.

We also NEVER link to minor's pages (unless they are the victim). And be sure that the page actually belongs to the person being discussed. Do not link to someone if you are not 100% sure it is the correct person. And if a social networking is set to private and you get in the back way, you may not post what you find. Private means private!

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?65798-Etiquette-amp-Information


:tyou:

 

[pinklilies]

Excuse me for just walking in but I've been listening at the door for a while...

I've googled and can't find any instances of 18 year old men being abducted. I know if there ever has been, someone is sure to find it and post it here.
Under what circumstances, for what reasons would an 18 year old male be abducted, any ideas? Apart from a ransom I cannot think of any.

 

[Fooshcat]

Yes, it's odd. He doesn't fit the typical abductee profile. Not a child, not a female. Most news stories on this case don't even mention that he went running with CG. The fact they would have been separated for 30 minutes maximum really narrows down his location and time of disappearance. SAR teams in a mountainous area are probably very good and experienced. Mountain lion attack would have left evidence. Dogs couldn't pick up the scent? Someone said that's not unusual. Was there any weather between the time of the canine search and JK's disappearance? Speculation - something went wrong and the other two panicked. Drug overdose or accident as a result of drug use. They were afraid of the consequences and/or having to divulge the drug source. Not saying they're bad kids. Teenagers think they're invincible and like to experiment. We all did!

 

[Timekeeper65]

Yes, it's odd. He doesn't fit the typical abductee profile. Not a child, not a female. Most news stories on this case don't even mention that he went running with CG. The fact they would have been separated for 30 minutes maximum really narrows down his location and time of disappearance. SAR teams in a mountainous area are probably very good and experienced. Mountain lion attack would have left evidence. Dogs couldn't pick up the scent? Someone said that's not unusual. Was there any weather between the time of the canine search and JK's disappearance? Speculation - something went wrong and the other two panicked. Drug overdose or accident as a result of drug use. They were afraid of the consequences and/or having to divulge the drug source. Not saying they're bad kids. Teenagers think they're invincible and like to experiment. We all did!

Good first comment Fooshcat and WELCOME!

I am leaning toward accident of some sorts and he was unable to crawl/walk his way back. MOO.

 

[marble]

Excuse me for just walking in but I've been listening at the door for a while...

I've googled and can't find any instances of 18 year old men being abducted. I know if there ever has been, someone is sure to find it and post it here.
Under what circumstances, for what reasons would an 18 year old male be abducted, any ideas? Apart from a ransom I cannot think of any.

First- the caveat that I think that the most likely scenario is that Joseph left the road to relieve himself or run on a trail instead and became ill or injured.

Secondly- I believe the account that his running partner gave makes perfect sense. Also, it'd be a full hour before his friend would have realized that Joseph didn't just decide to take a different route or had headed back early.

However, I do think there's a slim possibility he met with foul play while he was running. Here is a short list of serial killers in the U.S. who targeted only men, often young men. This isn't exhaustive and doesn't include killers like Isreal Keyes etc. whose victims were randomly targeted regardless of gender and age:

John Wayne Gacy killed and sexually assaulted at least 33 teenage boys

Juan Corona killed at least 25 men who worked as traveling laborers. He buried the bodies on fruit ranches in California.

Patrick Kearney, aka "The Freeway Killer": killed at least 43 young men and teenagers during the 1970s. He picked up young men in gay bars or hitchhikers, before killing and raping them.

Jeffrey Dahmer: killed 17 young men

Herb Baumeister: allegedly killed at least 11 gay men, with the possibility of 9 more deaths. He was homophobic and targeted men he assumed were gay.

Dennis Nilsen: murdered 15 men.

Dean Corll aka the Candy Man: raped, tortured and murdered at least 28 boys in the '70s.

David Edward Maust: killed at least 5 teenage boys (and possibly 4 more).

Raul Osiel Marroquin: killed at least 4 gay men after luring them out of gay bars.

Thomas Dillon: killed at least 5 men, he shot each for seemingly no motive.

Robert Berdella: raped and murdered at least 6 men.

Gary Ray Bowles: killed 6 men.

Ronald Dominique: killed at least 23 men.

Larry Eyler: was convicted of the murder and dismemberment of a 15 year old boy in 1984, he confessed to killing at least 21 other men.

Randy Steven Kraft aka The Scorecard Killer: killed at least 16 men, after raping, torturing and mutilating them. Kraft may have raped and murdered at least 50 more men.

 

[pinklilies]

Phew Marble, thank you I think, that is an horrific list and does show that men can be and are targeted. I think maybe many of those men were probably befriended and lured first.

I think what I was meaning was in the actual sense of an abduction, I soppose in the way as how I see one, as in being over powered while out jogging on an open road and forced into a vehicle, a young man of 18. I'm just not feeling that.

I'm more thinking your first option, or perhaps he thought he could take a short cut and beat his friend back, but had an accident and he's just sadly not been found yet.

 

[marble]

Hi 1pinkillies, I agree with you on all counts, and although a certain percent of those murders were stranger abductions and snatched off the street, the majority of the victims from my list agreed to climb into the killer's vehicle or otherwise accompany them somewhere rather than being overpowered and forced into a automobile.

Stranger abductions/murders are very, very rare in general and even more rare if there's a male victim. I'm probably only entertaining this possibility due to first-hand experience training as part of running groups that consisted mainly of young men. I'd heard a lot of stories from them about feeling threatened and targeted when they'd been out on a run by themselves, and having homophobic slurs and items thrown out of car windows at us was common enough as to be unremarkable. It happened regularly, and it was easy to ignore it or yell back when there was a large group but I knew of a non-negligible number of guys who at some point during their running careers felt threatened and afraid for their safety enough when they were out on their own that they were forced to try to lose an unglued pursuer by cutting between houses or through woods, hiding in a field, etc.

Now granted, it's likely most of the time the person chasing them in their vehicle was just trying to scare them, but they were predators of a certain kind just the same. For a certain type of person seeing a fit young man galloping down the road in shorts (and especially a fit young man shirtless) triggers some kind of aggressive bullying rage (which I don't have to be Freud to analyze ) and sadly it's not an unusual phenomenon. I'm not saying that's what happened here, I am still of the opinion Joseph became lost, ill, or injured, but male runners being chased and/or assaulted for not conforming to a certain view of masculine behavior and appearance is a real phenomena.

 

[pinklilies]

Goodness Marble, how you describe that sounds real frightening and I apologise for the fact that I've not really even considered male runners to be at such risk before, not in the ways you've just explained. But heck yes, I can certainly see what you've just described, happening. Very intimidating.
I'm sorry because my words must have seemed somewhat flippant, they do to me now, when the dangers male runners face can be just as real as what females face.

I will say, I learn a lot on this forum. Thank you very much for that.

 

[marble]

Goodness Marble, how you describe that sounds real frightening and I apologise for the fact that I've not really even considered male runners to be at such risk before, not in the ways you've just explained. But heck yes, I can certainly see what you've just described, happening. Very intimidating.
I'm sorry because my words must have seemed somewhat flippant, they do to me now, when the dangers male runners face can be just as real as what females face.

I will say, I learn a lot on this forum. Thank you very much for that.

No worries, it didn't sound flippant at all! I wouldn't have realized the regularity with which this happens if I hadn't heard the stories and seen similar behavior first-hand myself. Also, except for one particular case where the offender had charges brought and my friends testified in court, most of the young men never reported the episodes of being chased to the police. They figured they'd only look like scaredy cats and there was nothing the tormentors could be charged with anyway.

 

[ceci]

Ive concluded Joe went off on a trail to explore and had an accident. He had hiked the Appalachian Trail.




IMO, i believe the boys are innocent. I did have doubts early on due to the silence.

I have a feeling come hunting season that his remains will be found. As awful as it sounds, but animals will scatter the remains, to put it delicately.

These boys has to live with this and its affects can be devastating. CF decided to take a nap instead of jogging is what i heard. Sounds reasonable. They had been driving alot.

 

[Timekeeper65]

Ive concluded Joe went off on a trail to explore and had an accident. He had hiked the Appalachian Trail.




IMO, i believe the boys are innocent. I did have doubts early on due to the silence.

I have a feeling come hunting season that his remains will be found. As awful as it sounds, but animals will scatter the remains, to put it delicately.

These boys has to live with this and its affects can be devastating. CF decided to take a nap instead of jogging is what i heard. Sounds reasonable. They had been driving alot.

I have enjoyed reading your comments. Your theory sounds plausible to me.