CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #19 *ARREST*

[jillianelaine]

Was she employed as a pilot while she was pregnant? At first, when she moved there, I've read she worked as a barista. That would be a safer (understatement) job for a pregnant woman. Maybe the pilot job and the distance she traveled, plus the sense of her job being more significant, more financially lucrative, etc, put a strain on their relationship. Something he couldn't handle do to his insecurities. He finally snapped
All jmo questioning, of course

Yes, a pilot job before working as a barista. I think she had a "grab them by the horns" attitude towards life and he wasn't mature enough to handle the ride..

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Mother of Kelsey Berreth comes face-to-face with daughter's 'killer fiance' Patrick Frazee | Daily Mail Online

Frazee later told police that the couple met later that afternoon so that he could pick up the couple's daughter.

The two did not live together despite being engaged, a fact that many on social media suggested was a bad omen after learning of the disappearance.

It was Berreth however who had been hesitant to move in with her fiance because he still lived with his mother.

 

[Lhughessk]

If my hunch is correct, and I'm not saying it is, the news that was not able to be reported on today could very well be linked to the sealed arrest warrant where it was stated that it needed to remain sealed to protect certain individuals and I'm guessing the integrity of the investigation. Will they be able to keep it sealed past Dec 31st?

From what I can tell, yes they can. I found online a search warrant (not an arrest warrant) from a few years ago in CO. The DA asked that the warrant be sealed until the conclusion of the case, and the court granted that request.

But that was a search warrant. You asked about an arrest warrant. I’m unsure if there is a distinction in CO law.

In my state, warrants can’t stay sealed indefinitely. You can seal for 30 days, then you can request a 30-day extension. After that, it must be unsealed. But it sounds like CO’s open records laws are not as “open”, at least not until a case is over.

https://www.courts.state.co.us/user...bert Dear/Search Warrant 15-2059_Redacted.pdf

 

[Esma]

I just hope they are able to keep the warrants sealed as long as they need to in order to get whatever it is they need accomplished. I’m very curious as to what they have, but no hurry, it will be revealed when the time is right. Justice for Kelsey! I hope they are building a bullet proof case.

 

[Emi]

Good morning everyone!! Marking my spot

 

[Elley Mae]

Mother of Kelsey Berreth comes face-to-face with daughter's 'killer fiance' Patrick Frazee | Daily Mail Online

Frazee later told police that the couple met later that afternoon so that he could pick up the couple's daughter.

The two did not live together despite being engaged, a fact that many on social media suggested was a bad omen after learning of the disappearance.

It was Berreth however who had been hesitant to move in with her fiance because he still lived with his mother.

Thanks for this.

PK’s mother had to know this, and knowing this it had to put some distance between the two women.

I do wonder if Kelsey had wanted to move closer to her family knowing that this relationship was not moving forward at the pace her expected.

.....

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....

Living with mom,doing farrier work, breeding dogs. He was going nowhere fast.

 

[Auntie Cipation]

The neighbor never heard any KB struggle on thanksgiving (really?!) Neighbor was home during the time she saw pf truck at the condo for 30 min, correct? And no witness to him loading up his truck? hmm.

No, the neighbor left home sometime during that time frame, and as she did so she saw his vehicle there in addition to KB's. She didn't say anything/presumably hadn't noticed how long it might have been there, and once she left would logically have no idea how much longer it stayed.


<modsnipped>

 

[Peppery]

Was she employed as a pilot while she was pregnant? At first, when she moved there, I've read she worked as a barista. That would be a safer (understatement) job for a pregnant woman. Maybe the pilot job and the distance she traveled, plus the sense of her job being more significant, more financially lucrative, etc, put a strain on their relationship. Something he couldn't handle do to his insecurities. He finally snapped
All jmo questioning, of course

It hasn’t been cofirmed either way if or when she worked there.

There would still be other options as a flight instructor while pregnant, such as classroom work, tutoring, etc

 

[susiQ]

I never understood how LE concluded her death occurred ON Thursday, and not Friday. IMO, he must have told someone what he did. I realize that maybe he had an alibi. If he was nursing his time with an out of town visitor, if he had spent Thanksgiving and the rest of the holiday weekend in the same household as that person, perhaps it helped to establish a timeline.

I'm thinking that's when her phone went silent. If her phone had been on 24/7 as most of us do, that would be a red flag.

 

[susiQ]

It is interesting that in all annihilation situations, there are feelings involved. SP, allegedly, "loved" AF. CW loved NK. And I think that either PF was genuinely attached to his child.

But all these guys, so different (because you can't compare gregarious SP with odd CW or this guy, from whom the most we heard was "get off my property"), have one major flaw. They seemingly don't understand that one just can't replace people and go on.

SP didn't like how Laci's body changed during pregnancy, he did not want kids, so he invited AF to go to him for vasectomy. Like, "I shall kill my pregnant wife, and live with this new woman and her kid, and have no kids of my own".

CW has a family, and the kids he loves, but he fell out of love with SW, and his new flame wants own kids, and - just like this! - let's kill the old ones and get the new ones with the new woman.

(He never asks himself, what if the new flame will be unable to have kids, or the new kids will have issues, be less than perfect. Then what? Kill them, too?)

Now I don't know the exact details of PF's life. People think there is another woman, but even if so, I won't be surprised if this is not even a passionate love. For him, it matters to 100% own the kid.

But even the simplest thing - how would it be for the child to grow up without the mother, or with a stepmother - doesn't enter his head? (He should understand the concept of motherhood, he is attached to own mother). How come he doesn't care about his child?

I think it boils down to the fact that narcissists cannot feel empathy. If they are really good actors, they can fake it.

 

[susiQ]

I wonder if PF is capable of having a serious relationship with any woman. Or if the price of cattle will always come into play?

Not anymore

 

[susiQ]

From what I can tell, yes they can. I found online a search warrant (not an arrest warrant) from a few years ago in CO. The DA asked that the warrant be sealed until the conclusion of the case, and the court granted that request.

But that was a search warrant. You asked about an arrest warrant. I’m unsure if there is a distinction in CO law.

In my state, warrants can’t stay sealed indefinitely. You can seal for 30 days, then you can request a 30-day extension. After that, it must be unsealed. But it sounds like CO’s open records laws are not as “open”, at least not until a case is over.

https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/04th_Judicial_District/El_Paso/Robert Dear/Search Warrant 15-2059_Redacted.pdf

Thank you! I guess we'll just have to wait and see.

 

[kkdj]

When Kelsey first moved to CO did she live with PF and his mother? We know at some point she bought her own place, but did she live with them prior? ie I wonder if there were problems within the relationship because of him being, well, a mama's boy. The life of being involved with a mama's boy can be pretty disturbing imo.

 

[LAHOLLA]

Hoping today is the day that KB is found!

 

[girlhasnoname]

Then custody, probably related to potential move.

Plus the trait, the only trait, that I view as linking him to CW and SP.

All three view women as interchangeable.

Yes and I would say disposable as well.

 

[Irmese]

You very well may be right there.

This isn’t directed at you, but it reminded me of a point I wanted to make about PF being compared to CW.

Many of us followed the Watts case very closely, and the memory of that is still fresh in our minds.

Now we have another murder case that also occurred in Colorado.

Both involved young, good-looking women.

Both involved evil men.

But these crimes are not the same. And these killers are not the same.

Psychologically, these are two very different types of killers.

Chris Watts was a sociopathic narcissist, who wanted a fresh start and a new life.

His entire existence was a carefully crafted facade.

He was in a completely separate category from your average murderer (family annihilator).

What makes those guys tick, is not what makes most other killers tick.

PF may have some similarities to CW, but his crime is much more common.

Likewise, he is much more common, as murderers go.

Because of this, I think when all is said and done, we will have a motive that we can wrap our heads around a lot better.

We just shouldn’t make the mistake of seeing them as the same person.

Not if we want to truly understand what happened.

Exactly. PF's crime is common in murder cases, we just don't know all the details yet. When we learn the details, we will see proof he's the duck we could hear quacking.

 

[Irmese]

I never understood how LE concluded her death occurred ON Thursday, and not Friday. IMO, he must have told someone what he did. I realize that maybe he had an alibi. If he was nursing his time with an out of town visitor, if he had spent Thanksgiving and the rest of the holiday weekend in the same household as that person, perhaps it helped to establish a timeline.

Probably because he said that was when he saw her last and no one else saw her or heard from her after he picked up K.

 

[PommyMommy]

When Kelsey first moved to CO did she live with PF and his mother? We know at some point she bought her own place, but did she live with them prior? ie I wonder if there were problems within the relationship because of him being, well, a mama's boy. The life of being involved with a mama's boy can be pretty disturbing imo.

Her mother said they have never lived together. We know that she lived in another townhouse unit in her subdivision before buying her current home.
MOO

 

[PommyMommy]

My understanding is that cameras will be allowed in the courtroom Monday... Does anyone know what time the proceeding starts and where we can watch? Thank you!

Monday, Dec. 31, 2018
8:30 am MST
9:30 am CST
10:30 am ET
7:30 am PST

At this point, I know of two stations per the court order but expect to add more today as they are announced.

https://www.courts.state.co.us/user...er/caseofinterest/2018CR330/001/EMC Order.pdf
THIS MATTER comes before the Court for consideration of the first two petitioners, 9News and KRDO’s request for expanded media coverage of the first appearance hearing.

Only two camera operators will be permitted in the courthouse building on December 31, 2018. 9News and KRDO will confer as to which one may set up a single camera (audio/video/still) in a stationary position in the hallway and which one will set up a single camera (audio/video/still) in a stationary location in the courtroom that will not disrupt the proceedings.

Members of the media may utilize personal digital assistants (PDAs), laptops, tablets, and notebooks in the courtroom with wireless capabilities so long as it creates no disruption during the course of the trial.

Live streams:
Live Video | 9NEWS.com

KRDO.com | 24/7 live streaming news and weather coverage for Colorado Springs, Pueblo, Cañon City, Woodland Park and all of Colorado. - KRDO

It is common for most stations to broadcast live on FB as well:

9NEWS (KUSA)

KRDO NewsChannel 13 / KRDO.com

 

[kkdj]

Her mother said they have never lived together. We know that she lived in another townhouse unit in her subdivision before buying her current home.
MOO

He traveled to Washington to bring her to CO. They must have already found her a place to live prior to her move then.