CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #21 *ARREST*

[MsBetsy]

I don’t know about you, but to me, it is a chore to change an address. Too much busy work and hoping all the changes go through correctly.

As a new mother, driving four hours round trip to work daily, juggling daycare for baby K, she or PF passing the post office in the exchange of baby, changing her PO box was probably the least of her worries, IMO.

In Kelsey’s mind there was something still workable in the relationship or she would not have bought the townhouse in May. JMO.

I think she bought the Townhouse for security and to have a stable environment for her child close to her father. She was trying to make it work for both of them. Imo

 

[Mauig’ma]

I wish PF mom wouldn’t interfere with custody. How could she after all that’s happened ? I understand she’s helped raise her up until now but she needs to put her feelings aside and do what’s right for her grand daughter. Moo

 

[Concernedmamaof3]

That's a preliminary hearing. I think he will enter a plea at arraignment.
Colorado Criminal Procedure in First Degree - Guides - Avvo
MOO

Wow- Massguy was right when he said this trial could take years.

 

[Herat]

I wish PF mom wouldn’t interfere with custody. How could she after all that’s happened ? I understand she’s helped raise her up until now but she needs to put her feelings aside and do what’s right for her grand daughters. Moo

This might tell us A LOT about the Frazee family dynamics. Maybe possession of the baby is the real goal here.

Maybe that’s why KB bought a place close to PF and kept strongly in possession of her, at night, for example

I’m thinking KB didn’t make as much money as we think. Full-time child care is really expensive. It would seem that this difficult work / commute situation is more affordable than going it alone from PF closer to her work, and free to start a new life without him.

 

[1mtroyal]

I think it is important to restate something said back a little bit on this thread. Kelsey was last seen LEAVING Safeway at 12:27. My other source of this is the timeline listed at the beginning of this thread. So, the case should be closed on this issue. No, I don't think there is an available video. IMO

 

[KBB87]

I think she bought the Townhouse for security and to have a stable environment for her child close to her father. She was trying to make it work for both of them. Imo

If they had really been broken up for months, which I think a lot of us have suspected given their separate living arrangements, and she bought that townhome after their breakup, he’s even worse than I thought.

That would mean she was bending over backwards to accommodate him and his lame lifestyle as he was plotting to have her killed.

I mean you’ve got to be a real to resent someone who is going out of their way to make like easy for you, IMO.

 

[MsBetsy]

I wish PF mom wouldn’t interfere with custody. How could she after all that’s happened ? I understand she’s helped raise her up until now but she needs to put her feelings aside and do what’s right for her grand daughters. Moo

She likely thinks that is the right thing, since she was one of the main caretakers. Now PF has taken all three away.
I'm hoping Kelsey's family will be given custody but I can't imagine she won't get some kind of visitation time. Whatever they decide, I bet she will keep up the fight for as long as she can. Imo

 

[enelram]

So what would her job be like? 9-5? Work on an hourly wage? Or does she get a schedule that varies?

Ads for Doss flight instructors just say it's Full Time, w/10% travel.
She was most likely a classroom instructor like an intern while
she was working toward her certification. I have no idea about the
hours or schedule, ads just say 1st shift.

 

[InvSmith]

Police: Dad tried to have fiancee killed three times before she vanished

This so blew me away, Kelsey never had a chance.

This is completely true but now her daughter does.

 

[Inthedetails]

If they had really been broken up for months, which I think a lot of us have suspected given their separate living arrangements, and she bought that townhome after their breakup, he’s even worse than I thought.

That would mean she was bending over backwards to accommodate him and his lame lifestyle as he was plotting to have her killed.

I mean you’ve got to be a real to resent someone who is going out of their way to make like easy for you, IMO.

Yep. Which is one reason I think he killed for no other motive than he was tired of her in his life and wanted her gone. She's accommodating. He's cold.
jmo

 

[tmar]

I think this just came down to he didn't want to be tied down and she was making him feel like he had to be. He knew if she left him he would be having child support, visitation messes, daycare expenses, etc. I will bet money he discussed all of this with someone in the know. Now if Kelsey were out of the picture, he can stay living with his mother and have full time day care for free.

Initially being close to her daughter's father may have been important for Kelsey.
With time the relationship with PF had deteriorated, added to Kelsey's long commute to work, she may have been discussing with PF that she would move.
This caused PF to begin devising his plan to have Kelsey murdered.
Then PF would be free of Kelsey, and have free child care.
MOO.

 

[Ultra Violet]

Didn't you indicate earlier that you got the p.o. box information from White Pages? (Sorry if that was another poster). If so, long does it take for this to be updated on the internet? I'm sure it varies, but I just checked white pages for someone who moved 1 1/2 years ago, changed states, and got a new driver's license, and the old address is the only one showing up. It could be that Kelsey used the Florissant p.o. box address when she first moved to CO and any change just hasn't pushed through yet on the internet.

I don’t know about you, but to me, it is a chore to change an address. Too much busy work and hoping all the changes go through correctly.

As a new mother, driving four hours round trip to work daily, juggling daycare for baby K, she or PF passing the post office in the exchange of baby, changing her PO box was probably the least of her worries, IMO.

In Kelsey’s mind there was something still workable in the relationship or she would not have bought the townhouse in May. JMO.

Both of these posts bring up valid points about her PO Box. Without talking to someone who knows her personally, how do we know that is the only address she is using to receive mail? Or that she was not having it forwarded to her somewhere more convenient?

I saw someone mention that the PO Box was used on her aviation licence. But isn’t it also possible that she just kept it there to avoid the hassle of changing it or having to disclose her home address for privacy reasons? Many people choose to have business address as something other than their home address. Could she be getting her bills and other personal mail at home or a closer address?

She just moved back in May and had a toddler, it might be easy to leave things the same for now. The forwarding window is six months, but you can always send the forwarding request again if you do not list it as a permanent change.

We have recently moved and are still getting mail at our former residence, our current residence, and our longtime PO Box. So that is three addresses depending on type of mail or who the sender is. It would not be a stretch for Kelsey to also be getting her mail elsewhere, have it forwarded to her, or have another arrangement.

 

[InvSmith]

Do we know if KB had full custody? Also, can’t people take the custodial parent to court to review the custody?

This is a good question and my understanding from prior discussions here was that the birth certificate did not list him as a father (no father listed). There were no rights inferred. Is this right? Not sure how we came to this but the child is KB???

 

[susiQ]

If there was a hit man that did the deed, PF may not know where the body is. You know, everyone covers their own ***.

Hmmm. His truck was seen there between 12:30 - 1 p.m. Who really knows how long it was there? Maybe LE from cell info? We know PF ended up with the baby. By all indications from CB, Kelsey was having a day that included her baby (maybe looking for xmas-tree with PF) and possibly some vague plans with PF for dinner. Maybe KB allowed PF to take the baby to look for a tree? Maybe while she was alone, someone came and did the deed. Walked to the house? Did he have a key from PF? Did PF know she was about to head into the shower? He could have then taken baby K to mom's, told her they broke up and she needed some time away and she's leaving the baby with us. Tells mom he's got some errands to run, help out a buddy, whatever. I wonder if anyone saw his truck there in the early evening? Did anyone in the neighbourhood see someone that looked out of place that day? Maybe the deal was, PF had to get rid of the body? Honestly, the possibilities are endless and without some more "crumbs" we are destined to rehash the past threads

 

[MassGuy]

Initially being close to her daughter's father may have been important for Kelsey.
With time the relationship with PF had deteriorated, added to Kelsey's long commute to work, she may have been discussing with PF that she would move.
This caused PF to begin devising his plan to have Kelsey murdered.
Then PF would be free of Kelsey, and have free child care.
MOO.

I suspect that you may be right about this.

It’s reasonable to believe that there was a trigger here, and something like that would explain the logic behind an inherently illogical act.

 

[InvSmith]

Is anyone local to know of searches are ongoing or are they essentially focused in Idaho?

 

[KBB87]

Is anyone local to know of searches are ongoing or are they essentially focused in Idaho?

Searches for Kelsey or evidence? There are no searches for her that I’m aware of.

 

[girlhasnoname]

You’re really getting to something that’s bothering me.

Her home / work / POB / baby care situations are just not efficient, and she strikes me as an efficient person.

And they are not efficient because she is bending over backwards to give PF access to the kid and provide what for her is efficient child care. Because they HAVE NOT parted ways in Jan 2018, as he described. She HAD NOT moved on....

^^ THIS ^^

 

[tmar]

I have been following the case as well as the discussion from the beginning, but only now found the courage to participate. My heart goes out for KB’s family - I cannot imagine what they are going through.

A couple of things I have been contemplating upon:

• I believe LE might have perceived PF as a suspect from very early on, but made it seem that they are not seeing PF as a suspect by releasing the statements LE and KB’s family have been giving. I think all of these could have been very carefully considered, as they possibly had been also considering the daughter’s safety.
• Regarding this, on Dec 18th, when PF’s friend was interviewed on Inside Edition, I am not quite sure if her statements were 100 % pairing with her real thoughts (clip found here:
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  ).
  This assumption is based on an interesting article in which an FBI agent of 30 years tells how to detect if someone is lying (source: You can tell someone's lying to you by watching their face — here are 12 dead giveaways), and to me it seemed that many of these characteristics (e.g. rapid blinking, direction where one is looking, head shaking, etc.) could have been indicating a lie. To me the friend seemed very nervous, and I thought maybe she was asked to tell these things in order to keep PF “calm” while they needed a bit more time with the investigation before making the arrest. Of course I am not a professional agent, so this is just MOO.
• In addition, based on the heartbreaking quotes KB had added to her Pinterest account (if discussing this is not allowed due to it not being MSM, I totally understand), I have the feeling that their relationship had not been going well for quite some time.

All of these are of course just MOO. Thanks everyone for the great contribution, it has helped a lot in understanding this very sad and complicated case better. I wish KB’s family strength in going through this nightmare, and that they will get closure, even though it cannot bring their sweet daughter back.

Welcome Eevie.
What a great first post.
I agree, that LE suspected PF, and requested family, not to 'needle' PF.
This was similarly noted with KB's mother's interviews: keeping PF calm.

 

[SoVeryMe]

I'm sure he told a lot of people he broke things off with her, especially if he was trying to hook up with other women. They may have still been in a relationship back then but I still think Kelsey would have been the one to want to break things off. She could not have known him very well when she got pregnant but it would not have taken her long to see him for what he really was.
I wonder how long his past relationships have lasted, we haven't heard from one person who had a serious relationship with him. I'm guessing he had some significant issues with commitments and likely they didn't last long.
He cheated on an ex girlfriend while she was in the hospital. This may have been a pattern for him. Another reason not to stick around. Imo

I agree with Kelsey possibly being the one to want to break things off. Has it been factually verified they were engaged and planning a wedding?

I’m personally not so sure if they were in fact on a romantic relationship in the past few months. KB had a home, career, child.....she certainly seemed to be setting up a life for herself and her daughter. Nothing from what I’ve gathered (although minimal at best) has indicated they shared similar goals or had been making plans for a future together. Growing up on a “ranch” I find it hard to believe he would move into a 700 sf condo, I think for a career mom it was perfect for KB and little K.

Having a child is a transition for any relationship, let alone a new one. To me it seemed as if they were co parenting and trying to establish what worked for them as co parents.

PF certainly has a history of telling untruths....or things to reflect KB in a poor light, she didn’t seem to be close to any of his friends or business associates. The dynamic of their relationship is just strange to me and as harsh as it sounds I don’t think KB served a purpose in PF’s life any longer so he wanted to just get rid of her. Maybe he was resentful of her career and success and didn’t like the role her became in her life? Was he chauvinist at all and felt like it wasn’t his role to care for their child while KB was building her career? I’m not victim shaming at all, my heart breaks for KB and and family.

It’s so difficult for me to wrap my head around how such a beautiful, intelligent and driven young woman could get wrapped up with someone so sinister and dark.