CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #26 *ARREST*

[Elle*Bee]

Respectfully, my interpretation of this post was that PF’s family may not have attended the vigil because they have been led to believe KB had a history of going AWOL and abandoning her daughter. They may have thought this was another “stunt” of hers because of PF’s narrative. PF’s family may still believe (if they are delusional) he is innocent and KB took off on her own and set him up somehow. IMO

Thank you. Yes, this what I meant. You’re much more succinct than I.

 

[Gardener1850]

But yet, that is the exact assumption - that she did try to see the baby and was refused. Honestly, we don't know that she would want to be in PF's presence if she thought he had killed KB. We don't know if law enforcement had advised her not to attempt to go to where PF lived or even to contact him. We simply don't know if there was any attempt made to see the child by KB's mother.

You are correct we don't know, but neither do we know that no attempt was made to see the baby. To make the conclusion CB never tried to see the baby also requires quite a bit of assuming IMHO. In the same press conference I posted above the police chief said there was still the possibility KB could be alive at that time. They had not yet found evidence of her death nor evidence indicating PF murdered her. Although it's very possible the police suspected that was the case and communicated that to CB by Dec 14th, why would CB assume that KB was murdered by PF from the start, before she even arrived in Colorado Dec 2nd? Do you really think that CB traveled all the way from Idaho to Colorado to check on her daughter and made no attempt to contact PF while PF was supposedly claiming KB went on a trip to Washington to see her relatives and texted him on Nov 25th? Do you think there was no conversation or phone call in the first few days of Dec where CB asked to see Baby K? All she knew for certain before going to CO was KB was missing. All she knew for certain in the days after she arrived was there were cold cinnamon rolls, KB's make-up and luggage and cars had been left behind and her phone and purse were missing with her. And PF was not acting concerned. To assume she didn't even ask to see the baby in those first few days doesn't make sense to me.
MOO.

 

[v0x]

A pretty good article discussing life on death row.

Life on death row a matter of rules, routines, research

Interesting article,but it’s mostly about PA. Nothing about CO laws in there. Personally, I’m against the death penalty. I feel it’s hypocritical. IMO

 

[MsBetsy]

In regards to PF's sister filing a motion to intervene:

Yes, I remember that. That's why I asked if it is possible that PF's sister is intervening on "behalf" of her mother. I thought there was a misunderstanding due to innaccurate reporting since I believe a VA clarified that she was not actually asking for custody herself. But I'm not sure. I don't remember exactly what was said, since it was many threads ago. Also many are saying she IS asking for custody so it may be the case. Imo

 

[Elle*Bee]

My apologies, I miss understood what you were trying to say.

Apology accepted. I’m glad it was a misunderstanding. Sorry if I wasn’t clear.

 

[gngr~snap]

She's probably not going out in public, wherever she is. MOO

The comment about her being on "paid leave" makes me think protective custody/in hiding (helping LE vs, being in "custody " or guilty of any wrong doing.
I can't imagine why a nurse who was a willing accomplice would still be getting a paycheck.
Moo

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

Apology accepted. I’m glad it was a misunderstanding. Sorry if I wasn’t clear. [/QUOTE
((Hug))

 

[Irmese]

Personally, I don't believe that KB was planning to go to dinner with PF at all. What she told her mother is another story. And I don't think PF was stressed because it is nearly impossible to fit in time with someone on the side on the day of a major holiday like Thanksgiving. How would you explain disappearing for an hour or two during that day? Unless KB was killed shortly after arriving home from Safeway and KK was still not yet in town I don't see how it could work. I could see it if KK had family in the immediate area that she was visiting for the holiday but she doesn't have family anywhere near the area (despite people who have the same common last name) and a time period of being unavailable would not be noticed. But if you traveled over 14 hours to spend a holiday with someone I can't imagine that you would not be perplexed, confused, hurt, or even angered if they were to disappear for whatever hours would be necessary to do what PF is alleged to do. If they both lived in much closer proximity I could see how it would be possible to play both women. But not with the great distance, especially in time, to have KK come to CO or PF to go to ID I don't see how it could work for any length of time without it blowing up in his face.

Of course, I have believed for a long time that the relationship between PF and KB was long over and their only interaction concerned exchange of their child.

IMHO, I think it is very easy to juggle two gfs especially if they aren't liable to run into one another so distance would be an advantage. They could have been chatting online. Maybe her ex had the kids for TG and she made plans to drive down to see PF. She could have had her kids with her. Two of my friends met someone online and took off for greener pastures. Their husbands knew nothing. Their friends didn't know either. MOO.

 

[Charlot123]

I do not think that PF is very wordly. I think his life has been rodeos, shoeing, dogs, cattle, feed stores, etc. I beleive that KB was "in the way" and he just wanted her gone and wanted to keep the baby. I think he lacks social skills and critical thinking of issues beyond his mothers "ranch". I do not think it was due to life insurance or anything monetary. I think his world is and has always been small. It was more likely a selfish act for selfish reasons and he could not think of another way, as most people would. It could be custodial, but not monetary. IMO.

Darn if you do an ddarn if you don't. KB is in his way if she would like to get married (because I don't think she likes to be an unwed mother). If he does not marry her and she starts dating (only normal under the circumstances INO), then he gets angry because should she get married, she might move and take the daughter with her. It seems to be a no-win situation for her.

In real life, the fault is his - because as an adult male with some experience in dating, sorry, if he did not want to be straddled with the kid, he should have used protection. If he did want to have a kid, he should have taken the mom, KB, into the equation.

 

[tmar]

This was the most puzzling part to me ... whether the story was that Kelsey was on her way to Washington or that she just left town for awhile, how could she have done that without her car? Crazy! Even though PF had time to plan, it appears he lacked the brain to carry it out successfully.

Perhaps PF wants people to think Kelsey left with someone, in their car.
MOO.

 

[Crooked Chicken]

The comment about her being on "paid leave" makes me think protective custody/in hiding (helping LE vs, being in "custody " or guilty of any wrong doing.
I can't imagine why a nurse who was a willing accomplice would still be getting a paycheck.
Moo

Just a hunch, but my guess is that the employer put her on paid administrative leave due to the publicity in this case. Until such time it's proven that she was complicit in criminal actions, they can't let her go/fire her or not pay her.

 

[skycountry]

Thank you. Yes, this what I meant. You’re much more succinct than I.

Makes sense, I don't see PF as a controlling person, he did want others to see him as perfect, and probably groomed that perception to the max. I see him as the eternal victim, nothing is ever his fault, always someone else. Yes, he may even have portrayed KB negatively to his rodeo/farrier compadres, and his family, so he could shine and be the victim. The horse not winning the roping, was not his fault, so he almost kills it, etc. This is extreme behavior, and dangerous. IMO he had no control over his life, living at home with his mom, at his age, no place of his own, how was he in control? moo

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

Perhaps PF wants people to think Kelsey left with someone, in their car.
MOO.

I think he threw her purse,away, with her keys in it, DOH. So he foiled his own plan to ditch her car too.
Moo

 

[Irmese]

Well, I really didn’t take the post that way. You deal with what your child, no matter how old, tells you. He might have still been spending the nights with her but told his Mom he was staying over because she was out galavanting (sp?) around. You believe what you are presented with. His family could have totally been in the dark about her and their relationship

ITA.

 

[missy1974]

Yes, I remember that. That's why I asked if it is possible that PF's sister is intervening on "behalf" of her mother. I thought there was a misunderstanding due to innaccurate reporting since I believe a VA clarified that she was not actually asking for custody herself. But I'm not sure. I don't remember exactly what was said, since it was many threads ago. Imo

I do recall the discussion about it that day, but it was also the day that IN or KK was being talked about, so a lot of that discussion got lost in all of that IMO I recall that there were posts about maybe the sister saying she could help the mother (because of the talk about the mother's health), I'm not sure I believe that, I think it might be their back-up plan though. I do think she filed a motion to intervene, I think because the hearings have been closed, we don't know the specifics of what she is asking for other than what is in the decision:

Court reserves right to hearing re: paternal kin motions to intervene & to request contested custody hearing; TCDHS & GAL have discretion to set up kin visitation;

The above IMO means that babies paternal kin, grandmother and sister, have filed motions to intervene and are contesting the custody (which is currently with the maternal grandparents). Wording is everything .... KB's parent's are referred to as maternal grandparents... then when talking about PF's family, it's said as paternal kin (not grandparent, not aunt)

ETA: link to decision
https://www.courts.state.co.us/user...CR330/People v Frazee 18JV26 1_3_2019 ROA.pdf

 

[Deleted member 718]

Could we get some breaking news to save us from ourselves tonight?

And the ensuing fan fiction.

 

[Jethro4WS]

PF would have had plenty of time to attend the vigil, imo, almost an entire day.

I am only making the observation that there was not any statement made by his attorney concerning the vigil. I said nothing else on the topic.

 

[PommyMommy]

In terms of the vigil I don't believe PF's attorney issued a statement. The not enough notice statement had to do with the first press conference as far as I know.

Oh, that's right. Thanks for setting me straight, Jethro.

 

[greenpeace]

Been lurking but just a thought. What if CB's media narrative of an engaged loving couple was in order to fish out testimony from an Idaho gf, i.e. giving the gf the suggestion that PF was playing both her and KB. Once Idaho gf hears a different version of the relationship with KB, she gets upset and decides to come forward with information on PF. MOO.

 

[susiQ]

The comment about her being on "paid leave" makes me think protective custody/in hiding (helping LE vs, being in "custody " or guilty of any wrong doing.
I can't imagine why a nurse who was a willing accomplice would still be getting a paycheck.
Moo

I imagine for the same reason police officers under investigation get paid leave. They haven't been charged so it would be unfair to deny them their wage, and it's prudent not to have them on the job. Could you imagine the hoopla in the hospital if she was allowed to continue to work while being investigated? Yikes!