CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #30 *ARREST*

[cluciano63]

Motives are usually pretty standard..money, revenge, sex...custody is up there when murder is between couples, could also cross over with money. Jmo

 

[?mysterian?]

It's been reported:
-That a neighbor saw PF's car there.
-He had a frightening temper according to some.
-He picked up the baby from Kelsey's.
-If the evidence leads to him, and it appears it does, I'm still leaving him as the top perp. (LE did extensive searches at his place).
-Kelsey's body appears to be gone. He has the most means to do that.
-He also didn't tell Kelsey"s mom where Kelsey was, etc.
I'm not saying KK is innocent, but (for me) it's definitely a stretch to say pf is innocent.

PF also did not report KB as missing, IIRC.

 

[enelram]

Honestly I’m not sure. I just think with the little information we have, we have to consider that the motive may have been something way out of our current thinking patterns and reach.

I do think LE has uncovered the real motive of all involved and
shared that info in discovery docs...hence the wrongful death
suit.
Also the statements about mental abuse and maybe dv , mentioned in the civil suit, leads me to believe it was all
about control/pursuit of power. No woman was gonna
tell him what he could or coudn't do. Period.

 

[jaspermac]

If she was tucked away in a hospital, why would LE fight so hard to keep that affidavit away from PF? They said it was for the safety of witnesses, and I would assume she is Witness Zero. If she is in a facility somewhere, then there would be no reason to be concerned about her safety.

I am wondering if it was also to keep BFF safe not just KK. She knows alot and is running with the story that KK is terrified of PF.

The second thing I think is the witness protection, while they had enough info to use it as a good rationale, i think was invoked as a cover so the LE had more time to follow up leads without PF having information on the leads. So he couldn't get to them or have someone else get to them. But i could be wrong.

 

[Trudie]

Or were they sharing a rumor they heard?

M, the bestie, did tell the R’s there was a relationship.

I wonder if KK only told bestie her manure AFTER the fact. Anyone recall when the R's first started hearing about KK? Did M only begin confiding To Mrs. R after
thanksgiving?

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Early on numerous co-workers of hers at the hospital were
quoted as saying they were dating according to KKL.
I don't think there's any doubt w/ most of us and LE that
there was some kind of romantic tete a' tete going on.

Does anyone have a link please? Is that in the media thread?

 

[jaspermac]

M, the bestie did tell the R’s there was a relationship.

I wonder if KK only told bestie her manure AFTER the fact. Anyone recall when the R's first started hearing about KK?

October, at least re the plot.

 

[BelleinDixie]

I keep thinking of another case: the murder of stunningly beautiful Dallas pediatric dentist Kendra Hatcher, age 35, in 2015. She was dating Dr Ricardo Paniagua for about 6 months. What she didn't know about was the woman he dumped, Brenda Delgado. Delgado hired hitman Kristopher Love and getaway driver Crystal Cortes to murder Kendra.

Motives? Sentences?

Brenda Delgado - jealous rage of a woman scorned. Trial hasn't started, faces LWOP because after fleeing to Mexico the extradition agreement to return her to the USA requires that she not face a death penalty

Kristopher Love - triggerman received the death penalty October 2018. Delgado had paid him in drugs and cash.

Crystal Cortes - plea deal to testify against others, 35 years. Delgado had paid her $500 for her role.

Jennifer Escobar - roommate of Delgado testified for the prosecution that Delgado had solicited her in the murder plot, but she had declined

Dr Paniagua - knew nothing

Links:
Plot to kill Uptown dentist unlike any case Dallas detective has seen, he testifies | Courts | Dallas News

Gunman in Dallas dentist's murder sentenced to death

PF has been arrested, so in this case, I think we have to assume they have direct evidence of his involvement. Curious why he's charged, and she's not (yet).

 

[Esma]

I do think LE has uncovered the real motive of all involved and
shared that info in discovery docs...hence the wrongful death
suit.
Also the statements about mental abuse and maybe dv , mentioned in the civil suit, leads me to believe it was all
about control/pursuit of power. No woman was gonna
tell him what he could or coudn't do. Period.

I think you’re right that LE already knows the motives. Wish we had more info!

 

[MyTinkieGirl]

OK. So, in my mind, I came to this. Not much.

There's a reason PF felt he could ask KK to murder KB.
There's a reason he felt she wouldn't say anything about his asking her to commit murder KB.
Unfortunately, I believe there's little left of KB. I don't think it was nearby. I don't think anyone cares about the burning laws, etc. I know it's been mentioned before. Timothy Bosma comes to mind. The Eliminator. Sorry for the inference.

State Of The Art Incinerator:

I swear. I have friends who know things about me that might curl some peoples toes. There is no friend, ANYBODY, I would feel safe enough to even bring up the notion of killing someone. I cannot even fathom someone asking someone they knew to even think of doing this. I know other people think differently or do things for someone for love, but, he thinks so highly of himself that KK would do this because he asked? Keep it a secret because HE asked? There's a reason. KK's love for PF isn't doin it for me. I can't wrap my head around that. That's just me. I know it's been done before for the same reason. It's just a big no for me.

IMO, there must be something else incriminating PF in this murder besides KK's say so. There's a reason he's on one side of the bars and she's on the other. There's also a reason PF's lawyer needed more time to get stuff done. PF's lost his swagger - although it's probably real tough with ankle restraints. There's no steely eyed stare down. IMO. Maybe even HE was shocked by what he read.

One last thing. I know nothing about this, but, if anything pointed to KK, wouldn't she be the one behind bars? I can't see it being that she's helping police, so they're not arresting her.

All of this is just some of my thoughts.

 

[Lhughessk]

I didn’t name her or anyone as scheming or scorned.

Then who were you referring to when you said this (snipped and bbm)

Until I see evidence against P, I think he picked his child up, returned to the ranchette & something went down @ the condo. Did he prearrange it? Or did a scheming, scorned woman?

You’re right. KK was probably delighted the love of her life found a brilliant, beautiful, confident woman & had a child with her. She had no reason to wish KB dead or to seek revenge on her former lover, did she? She only disposed of the phone out of fear.

Please link to a quote from KK where she referred to PF as the love of her life. Other than what somebody said that somebody said that she said. I mean, we might as well bring Facebook over here if we’re going to do that.

 

[jaspermac]

Well, I'm hoping for the best but expecting the worst, in spite of the date discrepancies noted after their second installment. If those stand as reported, that's big, IMO.

I was in shock re the dates at first. Thought for sure it was a reporter mistake. It wasn't.

Then the article is updated to say not only did they find out on Nov 26 but BFF told them on NOV 26 that the woman was now missing.

It seems impossible to believe because none of us would handle it the way they did. So we look for other answers to make the R's more like us, more empathetic, rational etc.

The reality is even if as someone postulated they messed up their dates by two weeks- that still puts it at Dec 2- before KB was announced publicly missing- which still means they knew before the police knew that she was dead and did nothing.

They have not come out and corrected the dates and they have been harrassed and had to change security on their website.

The other piece that I turn over in my mind is they are lawyers how could they get the dates wrong. They know dates are critical.

Finally, there is no question they have been interviewed by LE. It is highly doubtful that they have got their dates wrong when they have been interviewed by LE. They have shared this story before with dates, probably over and over.

So as much as this seems completely unbelievable and has to be a mistake. I am really leaning towards the fact that they have their dates right and they knew. But I have no problems being wrong. JMO

 

[LAHOLLA]

I see we are all still on the merry go round

 

[Esma]

OK. So, in my mind, I came to this. Not much.

There's a reason PF felt he could ask KK to murder KB.
There's a reason he felt she wouldn't say anything about his asking her to commit murder KB.
Unfortunately, I believe there's little left of KB. I don't think it was nearby. I don't think anyone cares about the burning laws, etc. I know it's been mentioned before. Timothy Bosma comes to mind. The Eliminator. Sorry for the inference.

State Of The Art Incinerator:

I swear. I have friends who know things about me that might curl some peoples toes. There is no friend, ANYBODY, I would feel safe enough to even bring up the notion of killing someone. I cannot even fathom someone asking someone they knew to even think of doing this. I know other people think differently or do things for someone for love, but, he thinks so highly of himself that KK would do this because he asked? Keep it a secret because HE asked? There's a reason. KK's love for PF isn't doin it for me. I can't wrap my head around that. That's just me. I know it's been done before for the same reason. It's just a big no for me.

IMO, there must be something else incriminating PF in this murder besides KK's say so. There's a reason he's on one side of the bars and she's on the other. There's also a reason PF's lawyer needed more time to get stuff done. PF's lost his swagger - although it's probably real tough with ankle restraints. There's no steely eyed stare down. IMO. Maybe even HE was shocked by what he read.

One last thing. I know nothing about this, but, if anything pointed to KK, wouldn't she be the one behind bars? I can't see it being that she's helping police, so they're not arresting her.

All of this is just some of my thoughts.

I’m not buying that it was her big love for PF that made her a willing participant either. There’s something else. No clue what it is, but this theory sits really low on my motive list.

 

[Trudie]

PF has been arrested, so in this case, I think we have to assume they have direct evidence of his involvement. Curious why he's charged, and she's not (yet).

Maybe the FBI put her on a Carnival cruise ship so she could get away & feel safe.
Maybe she’s traveling to a rodeo.
Or, she’s in a hospital & a doctor will not allow her to be questioned.

All I can come up with.

Yes, P is in custody. Based on what, we don’t know.

 

[jaspermac]

I see we are all still on the merry go round

Count on it, until Feb 19. And then they will probably throw us a curve ball and not release info. LOL

 

[LAHOLLA]

From outward appearances based on what little we have been told- I do think KK and PF probably had a confusing relationship and definitely seemed to be enmeshed in some way- MO

Let’s not overlook the fact that when PF met KB, KK was married to another man with two children of her own...

 

[LAHOLLA]

Maybe the FBI put her on a Carnival cruise ship so she could get away & feel safe.
Maybe she’s traveling to a rodeo.
Or, she’s in a hospital & a doctor will not allow her to be questioned.

All I can come up with.

Yes, P is in custody. Based on what, we don’t know.

Or maybe she is secluding herself in her home or a friend/family member’s home so she doesn’t have to face the public.

 

[Esma]

Or maybe she is secluding herself in her home or a friend/family member’s home so she doesn’t have to face the public.

That’s my best guess too.

 

[LAHOLLA]

That’s my best guess too.

That’s what I would do.