CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #33 *ARREST*

[MassGuy]

Two completely different women. One CANNOT equate KB with KL. KL had a choice. I understand abuse, but no one and I mean NO ONE could threaten me into participating in such a crime against an innocent woman. KL doesn't strike me as an innocent abused victim of PF. She participated by choice. KB was their victim.

Exactly. If KK is as involved as she appears to be, and her excuse is “I was scared, so I helped him,” then I hope the jury is bemused by that.

And throws the book at her.

That ain’t gonna fly.

 

[Gardener1850]

In one of the earliest interviews of KB Uncle in WA State, I recall him stating that Colorado (Grand Junction) was an opportunity for KB to pursue her dream job, and closer to PF. I've long believed that KB's job offer in Colorado was first, and this potential Colorado suitor (PF) was icing on the cake. MOO

Below is the video interview with her Uncle. The start of the video says KB moved to Woodland Park, CO in 2016. The reporter voice over later says her "big break" was at Doss Aviation in Pueblo as a flight instructor-- where she worked when she went missing (but we learned from other interviews she first worked at Springs Aviation in 2016). The uncle didn't say that Doss was the reason she moved there-- but the reporter said it/implied it was the reason she moved there. There is nothing about Grand Junction mentioned that I heard:

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Here's the quote about KB working at Springs Aviation in 2016:
"A former boss said Kelsey Berreth was dating Frazee when she started working as a flight instructor at Springs Aviation in Peyton in 2016. She was "a little reserved and sometimes soft-spoken" but often talked about her then-boyfriend, company owner Bobby Hosmer said."
Police: Colorado woman likely killed at home, fiance charged

ETA: And finally we have a friend saying KB moved to CO in March 2016 in this article (article requires subscription):
"They met in March 2016, said Kate Loucado, who worked with Berreth for a short time."
...
"In February 2017, Berreth told fellow pilot Kris Ackerman that she was getting married soon.
He last spoke with her in June 2017, when she told him she aspired to fly cargo deliveries or work as an airline pilot."
Who was Kelsey Berreth? Quiet life apparently ends in tragedy

 

[Irmese]

Again this case reminds me so much of Scott/Laci Peterson. Laci's mother thought they were a happily married couple, but as it turned out, there were clues that there was trouble brewing in their marriage. SP seemed disinterested in Laci's pregnancy, never wanting to feel the baby move. He'd had a previous affair in addition to the one he was hiding at the time of Laci's disappearance. CB reminds me SOOO much of Sharon Rocha in her interview. I think she knew that things weren't all sunshine and roses, but she thought they had a "loving" relationship overall, IMHO. In the beginning, I don't think she wanted to believe that PF could do anything to harm KB. And now, here we have similar indications that trouble was brewing. All MOO

I think that CB was aware of some of the problems in the relationship, but she was trying to be supportive of her daughter's choices even if she didn't agree AND at the PC she was hiding what she knew/suspected because LE wanted her to.
ETA MOO

 

[InvSmith]

Everything that you say makes perfect sense, except there are two qualifying factors:
A witness subpoenaed in another state cannot be extradited in a criminal proceeding. KK simply had to "take the fifth" and refuse to appear. This is not true of evidence, and it's not true in a civil suit. However, third party witnesses are not always hearsay in a criminal trial for Solicitation, so the RR's and the elusive BFF are both subject to testimony, and cannot "take the fifth".
In a "no body" murder trial, there is an extensive opening phase in which the prosecution attempts to establish proof that she is no longer living the life that is expected of her, and nor is she in the places that she would be expected to be. To do this, hundreds of witnesses can be called by the prosecution, and each one is subject to cross examination. Likewise, the defense can call anyone that ever knew KB. Any of these witnesses can later be called back, if there is anything in the testimony that would have bearing on the actual charges against PF.

I don't think she needs to be extradited; I think she needs to be transported. This person is not going to take the fifth, that happens in movies. She can be charged or she can testify. Having serve federal subpoenas (which we don't know if this case against KL is) she can be extradited. This happens every day. I think is a victim. I think she was solicited violating federal and state law and the phone transport was a federal offense. I think she talked from day one just like she did to her friend. I think clear and convincing evidence will be presented of threat to her children because he has such great character and that will take care of the doubts of her involvement. Don't get me wrong I think they are both guilty and should spend life in prison if the evidence presents that way.

 

[Dave F.]

I have a different take. I think that we haven’t been shown the video of her leaving the store because it isn’t of much evidentiary value. I mean, what’s the point of watching someone’s back as they walk away?

If KB made a purchase, the register "tape" will show the exact time and date, and the film of her leaving would be later on the same loop as the film of her entering, but in the top of the screen heading the other dirfection, with the date and time ticking away on the screen. THAT would be her last confirmed sighting.
PF told CB, when she contacted him to see if he knew anything about where KB might have gone, that he had their daughter and had picked her up Thanksgiving day. He also told CB in that conversation that he received a text from her on the 25th. Police and his lawyer reported that he was cooperating with them and delivering evidence that they requested, but no one ever claimed that he talked to them about the case. We know that his attorneys all have advised him not to.
I would guesstimate that there is NO shred of possible evidence of either KB of PF's travels on Thanksgiiving day that is NOT important. OMI

 

[Oregon]

Perhaps KB could have been taking advanced/professional/certification
pilot courses in other cities in CO before moving to WP. Which could account for being a short term roommate with her childhood friend.

 

[MsBetsy]

We have two girlfriends of the girlfriends saying both were abused/threatened.

And who knows how many animals if only they could talk.

I'm so relieved that Kelseys friend has shed some more light on the relationship between Kelsey and PF. Many of us assumed that his temper and treatment of animals might reflect how he treated people, especially women.
I would think eventually he would have treated his daughter poorly as she got older. Hopefully he will never have that opportunity. Imo

 

[justpeachy22]

I'm curious what steered the authorities to a landfill.

There's a lot of open land in that neck of the woods. More, PF has been living there with his mom for 20 years and working as a farrier, driving out to other ranches. His mother also owns two other pieces of property. It seems to me that if he wanted to dump a body, he would have many options besides dumpsters (always risky) and the land fill.

Obviously the authorities know all this, too. I wonder if they found a receipt or got a tip that led them to the landfill.

I have all along thought that he left her body in the mountains - very easy to do in his area. However, as a rancher, I am guessing he made a lot of trips to the big dumps (would I be right on this?), so perhaps taking her body with a dump run was just easier. Not sure.

 

[ajaylee]

I think that one of the risks with a dumpster is that it ends up at a landfill. One of the risks of the landfill is that they often use heavy equipment to shift and compact the trash - even more so at a transfer station.

Bodies have been accidentally uncovered at landfills before when the trash was being shifted and the bag the body was in broke open.

He had the time and local knowledge to choose a site and actually dig a grave, if necessary. That's an option not usually readily available when someone kills on the spur of the moment.

If that's the case, I'd expect him to avoid his mom's property and the property of any of his business clients.

 

[acutename]

Remember that the defense ONLY has to create a shadow of a doubt. The KK story has been inserted into the case by the press, and has not been repudiated by the prosecution. It is a tale of long distance romantic affair, tinged with at least the implied threat of abuse, culminating in the solicitation to commit murder. Now, that must be addressed in conjunction with this story, that PF was simultaneously carrying on a long distance, romantic affair, borderline abusive affair with KB at the exact same time. Not on the same day, but at the same time for six to seven months minimum. Logic rules that PF did not appear have the time, income or transportation to support this much activity. It's a crack that could very well lead to "shadow of a doubt" in court.

I would not loose sleep over this - he would not have had to see either woman very frequently and he "travels for work." Absence can make the heart grow fonder. Of course there may be some logistics to consider.

 

[MsBetsy]

Below is the video interview with her Uncle. The start of the video says KB moved to Woodland Park, CO in 2016. The reporter voice over later says her "big break" was at Doss Aviation in Pueblo as a flight instructor-- where she worked when she went missing (but we learned from other interviews she first worked at Springs Aviation in 2016). The uncle didn't say that Doss was the reason she moved there-- but the reporter said it/implied it was the reason she moved there. There is nothing about Grand Junction mentioned that I heard:

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Here's the quote about KB working at Springs Aviation in 2016:
"A former boss said Kelsey Berreth was dating Frazee when she started working as a flight instructor at Springs Aviation in Peyton in 2016. She was "a little reserved and sometimes soft-spoken" but often talked about her then-boyfriend, company owner Bobby Hosmer said."
Police: Colorado woman likely killed at home, fiance charged

ETA: And finally we have a friend saying KB moved to CO in March 2016 in this article (article requires subscription):
"They met in March 2016, said Kate Loucado, who worked with Berreth for a short time."
...
"In February 2017, Berreth told fellow pilot Kris Ackerman that she was getting married soon.
He last spoke with her in June 2017, when she told him she aspired to fly cargo deliveries or work as an airline pilot."
Who was Kelsey Berreth? Quiet life apparently ends in tragedy

There was some mention of Grand Junction but I don't know what the source was. I remember it was discussed very early in the case but I don't remember the specifics. Imo

 

[Love Never Fails]

We don't have proof that PF actually murdered her. As far as I can tell, we don't actually know where he was at all times on Thanksgiving Day after KB was seen at the market.

(Law enforcement may have evidence that we don't know about yet).

Defense could float the suggestion that he is guilty of nothing more (!) than helping clean up. He could claim that KB was already dead when he arrived and that he was only involved in keeping his mouth shut. He could hint that KK did the deed.

Question for everyone: is it your gut impression that PF's mom is calling the shots in their relationship or is he calling the shots?

At this point I think the only thing Ma Frazee is guilty of is raising a selfish, narcissistic, murderous son. No I don’t believe she is calling the shots.

 

[Dave F.]

I have all along thought that he left her body in the mountains - very easy to do in his area. However, as a rancher, I am guessing he made a lot of trips to the big dumps (would I be right on this?), so perhaps taking her body with a dump run was just easier. Not sure.

Several threads back, someone from the area pointed out that the dump at Cripple Creek is unattended. If they were searching that, I would wonder about a body. I agree that there are unlimited places to dump a body in the mountains. IMO

 

[Gardener1850]

delete

 

[Love Never Fails]

I'm not a lawyer, but I've been in court more times than I would have liked. One thing I have observed is that both witnesses and jury members seem to take their duties much more seriously than might be expected of them. For either murder charge that has been filed, the minimum sentence is life, with no eligibility for parole until forty full years have been served. PF was 32 years old when arrested, meaning that if he is convicted the earliest possible parole date would be in his 72nd year. That's a really cold, hard decision for twelve people to make about another human being, even if they each despise him. I believe a jury will do the right thing, but as you said: You don't take away a man's freedom based on a hunch."

I believe you are correct about human nature. I would be a terrible juror. I would always be looking for a way out for a defendant because prison has to be so dreadful being caged like an animal. On the other hand, if one acts like an animal then he deserves to be treated like one. I just hate the idea of having to condemn someone. And yet, here I sit believing PF to be guilty of a horrific crime and wanting him to receive the worst punishment. It is my hope the DA has proof to convict him. I sure don’t believe a person should go free just because they have a good defense lawyer ( OJ Simpson for example). I was called for jury duty only once and had the flu. I cannot imagine being in a courtroom and seeing what you have seen.

 

[MsBetsy]

IIRC it was from people sleuthing KB's friend's social media and those posts were removed.
MOO.

Ok, thanks. No wonder it gets so confusing.

 

[Dave F.]

In Colorado, child custody is all about what's best for the child. Secondary to that will be the need for the DHS to monitor the child's welfare to ensure that she is protected until she reaches adulthood. With that said, IMO it's a really complicated, lengthy and unpredictable procedure.

 

[Aydrianna523]

I will just point out that he very well may have been a kind, gentle guy in many people’s eyes, with a separate standard of behavior for KB. And perhaps for any other women he was involved with.

This is why it disturbs me to see on this site and elsewhere people say, in effect, they would never believe that someone they think well of could murder their partner in advance of seeing the concrete evidence. You don’t have to believe everything you hear, but it’s wise to come to terms with the reality that just because you think someone is nice doesn’t mean they are nice to everyone.

That’s precisely how people skate by in life hiding their capacity for evil.

Absolutely. It's selective niceness.

 

[Gardener1850]

Perhaps KB could have been taking advanced/professional/certification
pilot courses in other cities in CO before moving to WP. Which could account for being a short term roommate with her childhood friend.

KB earned her Commercial Pilot Certifications 9/22/2015 and her Flight Instructor Certificate 4/24/2017.

She would have gotten pregnant around Jan 2017.

So you may be correct in your theory-- she could have been training for her flight instructor Certificate during her early pregnancy when she was living with her friend.

ETA: But she was already living in Woodland Park in March 2016 based on other interviews so perhaps KB moved to WP in 2016, moved in with friend temporarily in 2017 only to do Flight Instructor Certification then moved back to WP? Or KB was in WP the entire time and friend moved in with KB temporarily? MOO.

Link to look up KB's FAA certifications: FAA Registry - Airmen - AirmenInquiry - Name Search

Does anyone know how long it takes to earn a Flight Instructor Certification for Single Engine Airplanes?

 

[PommyMommy]

Best friend of Kelsey Berreth says Patrick Frazee was 'emotionally abusive' and 'always mad' | Daily Mail Online

She went on to say that Frazee was 'borderline emotionally abusive,' while describing her childhood friend as a 'tough girl' who was smart and very much in love with her baby daughter K.

As for Frazee, Cogbun said: 'He was just always mad about something.'


Friends: 'The moment I found out she had been with him when she went missing, the first words that came out of my mouth was: "He did something to her,"' she said (Berreth and Cogburn above in their youth)