CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #36 *ARREST*

[The Saint]

@MassGuy,

I think PF planned the murder for the Thanksgiving holiday. It gave him the
the time to wrap things up when everyone else was off for the holiday.
imo

 

[The Saint]

Honest question. What’s the harm in waiting a a couple of days to find out the truth instead of throwing darts at the board with accusations?

I speculate on cold cases but some people just attack and wish ill will on people. Don’t understand the reason as it makes me not want to follow this case.

Why do you think the truth willl come out in just a couple of days?
This is a crime sleuth board. We are weighing the possibilities.
imo

 

[SandyQLS]

My money is on KK, and that information came second hand (from PF).

If so, it makes this potential plea deal alot more palatable.

If she cooperated to that extent, and helped them find evidence that they otherwise would not have, then that would be quite the contribution.

Ignoring of course, the fact that she could have stopped this damn thing in its tracks, and Kelsey would still be alive.

Except everything KK says that implicates PF also implicates KK. She would claim PF told her this and that, and she told LE where to look in the townhome for blood or brains. But if KK knows, she may be the murderer. We don't know yet how LE filled that gap or if they have that makes PF or another unknown person the physical murderer. I don't trust KK, not at all.

 

[The Saint]

Why would PF have to pay child support when he/his mother were providing child care 5 days (presumably) per week (while KB was working)? If he's simply broken it off with her, they could have shared custody and neither one pays the other. Simple.

Baby Girl was living in the condo that KB purchased with her parents financing the mortgage. It's possible that PF was not funding anything other than his mother providing childcare while KB was working. It is possible that KB asked PF to contribute money toward the condo payments and Baby Girl's expenses and PF flipped out.

 

[MassGuy]

Except everything KK says that implicates PF also implicates KK. She would claim PF told her this and that, and she told LE where to look in the townhome for blood or brains. But uf KK knows, she may be the murderer. We don't know yet how LE filled that gap or if they have that makes PF or another unknown person the physical murderer. I don't trust KK, not at all.

There would be evidence that supports her account, not just her word.

Weeks have passed, and investigators and the prosecution would have thoroughly vetted her account, and analyzed supporting evidence.

They have apparently concluded that her involvement was quite limited, although I fully expect that it extends further than what she will pay a price for.

I think the case against PF is solid.

 

[TJtennispro]

Why do you think the truth willl come out in just a couple of days?
This is a crime sleuth board. We are weighng the possibilities.
imo

Because court dates began. I realize it’s a crime sleuth board but some people are hoping people lose their nursing license and none of us know anything.

I just don’t think names should be trashed until we know more.

I’ll just stay off this thread. Carry on buy it makes outsiders not want to talk for fear of being attacked.

 

[SandyQLS]

@MassGuy,

I think PF planned the murder for the Thanksgiving holiday. It gave him the
the time to wrap things up when everyone else was off for the holiday.
imo

Or KKL planned it for the holiday because she wasn't working and had time to drive there and back to implement her plan. If she's caught, she blames it all on PF. If she's not caught, maybe she could win PF for herself.

I really do believe KKL is very involved and the mastermind behind it all. When I look at her achievements, she's the one capable of crafting this conspiracy, not PF. PF may be guilty as sin, but I think KKL is just as guilty.

 

[The Saint]

Because court dates began. I realize it’s a crime sleuth board but some people are hoping people lose their nursing license and none of us know anything.

I just don’t think names should be trashed until we know more.

I’ll just stay off this thread. Carry on buy it makes outsiders not want to talk for fear of being attacked.

deleted by me.

 

[MassGuy]

Because court dates began. I realize it’s a crime sleuth board but some people are hoping people lose their nursing license and none of us know anything.

I just don’t think names should be trashed until we know more.

I’ll just stay off this thread. Carry on buy it makes outsiders not want to talk for fear of being attacked.

This woman was solicited to commit murder, said nothing, and at the very least, helped a murderer conceal his crime.

I don’t think that wanting her to lose her nursing license, is any way off base.

She should be condemned for her actions.

It appears that she has struck a deal, and may not pay the full legal price.

Fine.

But the court of public opinion will not be so kind, nor should it.

A mother is dead after all.

 

[The Saint]

This woman was solicited to commit murder, said nothing, and at the very least, helped a murderer conceal his crime.

I don’t think that wanting her to lose her nursing license, is any way off base.

She should be condemned for her actions.

It appears that she has struck a deal, and may not pay the full legal price.

Fine.

But the court of public opinion will not be so kind, nor should it.

A mother is dead after all.

And a few days more is not going to reveal all.

 

[The Saint]

I'm not convinced that NK wasn't an accessory or accessory-after-the fact in Watts case.

I'm also not convinced that KKL's involvement in Kelsey's murder was limited to using KB's phone to text KB's employer, KB's mom and PF and then throwing the phone away.
imo

 

[Artis]

I know it’s frustrating, but don’t give up on this case yet.

KK is not a co-conspirator. Legally, that requires her to have accepted his solicitation and for them to have planned the crime together, and at least one of them to have taken a solid step towards the plan. We know this didn’t happen because PF is charged with solicitation and not conspiracy. And I’m of the opinion he’s charged with exactly what he did.

If the court charged and convicted on moral grounds, she would most certainly be getting life in prison. But it doesn’t. I believe the DAs case has so far shaped up so show that KK was solicited more than once, declined each time (but didn’t report it), PF then carried out the murder himself, and then involved her in the aftermath. I think she took the phone home with her on 11/24, sent the messages and tossed or destroyed it on 11/25.

This whole situation angers us so much because she KNEW before and helped AFTER. This means she’s a horrible human being in every possible sense. But if there’s no evidence to show she accepted his solicitation or agreed to a plan to murder or helped him murder or helped him get rid of the body...they can’t charge her with it. No evidence = no conviction.

She’s getting a pretty good deal, it sounds like, from what we know. This seems to us so incredibly backwards. This person knew before AND helped after, and she gets a deal?? But the truth is, if she would only be legally liable to an accessory after charge otherwise, and they give her tampering in exchange for whatever evidence she has that the DA deems worthy of this exchange, then they’re making the right decision.

I'm sorry to belabor this but I asked something, earlier - not of anyone in particular - and it went w/o comment.

Isn't what we know KK did worth several charges? I mean when you want to put the squeeze on someone prior to a deal, don't you first compile a list of every possible charge before you go cutting any deal? Specifically, I'm thinking possible charges (bear with me because I'm just speculating) such as:

Accessory after the fact.
Obstruction of justice.
Theft of evidence.
The current "tampering" charge.
Destruction of evidence.
Transporting evidence across state lines.
Some kind of wire or telecommunications fraud for the texts.
Etc...

Meaning, a pile of charges like that would add up to some serious time and allow a prosecutor to, say, offer to drop one or two/10 years behind bars, in exchange for testifying against Frazee, but STILL charging her with enough to send her to prison for at least 10 years? I mean like she gets her choice between 20-30 (no deal) or 10 years for testifying.

Granted, some of what I've listed as example charges might be (usually) federal type offences but aren't there state equivalents?

 

[justpeachy22]

I'm sorry to belabor this but I asked something, earlier - not of anyone in particular - and it went w/o comment.

Isn't what we know KK did worth several charges? I mean when you want to put the squeeze on someone prior to a deal, don't you first compile a list of every possible charge before you go cutting any deal? Specifically, I'm thinking possible charges (bear with me because I'm just speculating) such as:

Accessory after the fact.
Obstruction of justice.
Theft of evidence.
The current "tampering" charge.
Destruction of evidence.
Transporting evidence across state lines.
Some kind of wire or telecommunications fraud for the texts.
Etc...

Meaning, a pile of charges like that would add up to some serious time and allow a prosecutor to, say, offer to drop one or two/10 years behind bars, in exchange for testifying against Frazee, but STILL charging her with enough to send her to prison for at least 10 years? I mean like she gets her choice between 20-30 (no deal) or 10 years for testifying.

Granted, some of what I've listed as example charges might be (usually) federal type offences but aren't there state equivalents?

Well of course she “deserves” all of these charges, but this is why people hire defense attys, right?! if She got 10 years for testifying her atty wouldn’t be worth squat IMO.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Honest question. What’s the harm in waiting a a couple of days to find out the truth instead of throwing darts at the board with accusations?

I speculate on cold cases but some people just attack and wish ill will on people. Don’t understand the reason as it makes me not want to follow this case.

You are too good for this (sleuthing) world.

 

[thesaint]

I'm sorry to belabor this but I asked something, earlier - not of anyone in particular - and it went w/o comment.

Isn't what we know KK did worth several charges? I mean when you want to put the squeeze on someone prior to a deal, don't you first compile a list of every possible charge before you go cutting any deal? Specifically, I'm thinking possible charges (bear with me because I'm just speculating) such as:

Accessory after the fact.
Obstruction of justice.
Theft of evidence.
The current "tampering" charge.
Destruction of evidence.
Transporting evidence across state lines.
Some kind of wire or telecommunications fraud for the texts.
Etc...

Based on the minimal level of involvement required to catch such a charge in other cases, Accessory/Accessory after seem(s) like a no-brainer, esp at the initial charging stage.

Obstruction et al also seem like things with which you could at least initially charge/arraign KK. Don't know why the DA seemingly has landed on rather specific, granular charge. I assume the DA at least got a proffer from KK's attorney, so they know what she brings to the table. But you have to wonder how much KK knows about the actual crime when the DA, even with KK's apparent cooperation, presents alternative theories that leave open the possibility of unknown-to-LE participants.

 

[Artis]

Because court dates began. I realize it’s a crime sleuth board but some people are hoping people lose their nursing license and none of us know anything.

I just don’t think names should be trashed until we know more.

I’ll just stay off this thread. Carry on buy it makes outsiders not want to talk for fear of being attacked.

I'm not a regular and nobody has ever attacked me when I've posted about presumption of innocence. I understand revulsion at lynch mob mentality but I don't think that's going on here.

Whatever the degree of KK's involvement, you need to take ito account that we KNOW that she knew PF was plotting the murder of Kelsey Berreth and she chose not to go to police and save Kelsey's life. That alone is enough to say she is not fit to work with ANY vulnerable people or have access to medical facilities, products or patient information. A bank wouldn't give her a job as a teller knowing this stuff and she sure as hell should never be able to practice nursing again.

 

[Artis]

Well of course she “deserves” all of these charges, but this is why people hire defense attys, right?! if She got 10 years for testifying her atty wouldn’t be worth squat IMO.

Not sure you got what I was saying which is if you can slap her with, say, five serious charges that could result in, say, 30 years, and you offer to knock off a couple or three and she only gets 10 years, that's a good deal for her. IOW, you don't have to let her walk with a slap on wrist to get what you want.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

Oh, I do think he planned on killing her that day as KL had come to town. For some reason I keep getting the sense that she knew it was going down that day.

Maybe, KL already knew the baby girl (and vice versa) and was the suitable person "to care" for little K during PF's "robbery/murder" of KB. One-year-olds sometime like to be driven around in a car, taking a nap in a toddler car seat, ....

 

[katydid23]

Not sure you got what I was saying which is if you can slap her with, say, five serious charges that could result in, say, 30 years, and you offer to knock off a couple or three and she only gets 10 years, that's a good deal for her. IOW, you don't have to let her walk with a slap on wrist to get what you want.

Realistically, those 5 charges would never get her 30 years. Rapists and killers don't always get 30 years.

JMO IMO MOO

 

[Niner]

Friday, February 8th:
*Plea Deal hearing (Advisement) (@ 8:30am MT) - CO – Kelsey Berreth (29) (last seen Nov. 22, 2018, Woodland Park; phone pinged 800 miles away in Gooding, Idaho on 11/25/18 @ 5:13pm, reported missing Dec. 2, 2018; not found) – only for *Krystal Jean “Lee” Kenney (32) charged (2/4/19) with tampering with physical evidence.
2/2/19: is scheduled to appear in a Teller County courtroom on Friday, Feb. 8. She will enter a plea deal with prosecutors. She was believed to have disposed of Berreth's cell phone in the days after she was last seen alive. The probable cause statement has been sealed.
*Patrick Michael Frazee (32) “fiancé” arrested (12/21/18) & charged (12/31/18) with 1st degree murder & 3 counts of solicitation to commit 1st degree murder & 1st degree felony murder (death during attempted robbery). Held without bond.
Was a suspect as of 12/15/18. Search warrant executed 12/14/18. Search & arrest warrants are sealed. The little girl, who had been staying with her dad up until his arrest, is now in protective custody & will be reunited with Berreth’s family. 12/27/18: The court continued the temporary custody of the minor child with maternal grandparents, but the Teller County Dept. of Human Services will retain legal custody.
Most recent stuff:
1/4/19 Update: New judge (Scott Sells) takes over the case (judge rotation). Prosecution says they are now comfortable sharing the arrest affidavit with Frazee. They still want them sealed to the public. The court is also hearing a motion regarding the testing of a specific piece of evidence. Prosecution says that piece of evidence is not as critical as they first thought. Judge will pass ruling on consumptive testing until 2/19 hearing. Frazee waived his right to prelim within 35 days. Lots of info in arrest affidavit, Defense asks to move 1/29/19 date. Preliminary hearing for Frazee has been moved to Feb. 19th per request of Frazee’s attorney. Both parties agreed on this date. KKTV11News has confirmed that Kelsey’s parents have filed a wrongful death lawsuit against Frazee.
2/7/19 Update: Baby K stays with her maternal grandparents. Next disposition hearing on 4/4/19.