CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #41 *ARREST*

[MemPat]

MemPat, it is both pronounced and spelled "Massy." JMO.

I learned a few pages back about a "roadside squat" and now I can't separate the two - RS and Massy.

 

[AvaGrace]

I think its likely that PF at least tried to burn the body in the trough. I just don't know if you could get a fire like that hot enough, and it would take a LONG time. So I am guessing there would have been quite a bit left that needed to be disposed of. I think it was reported that KK said he did that perhaps in a dumpster or in a river? Does anyone remember that?

Sorry for this graphic post. The temperature needed to turn human bones into ashes is 1400 to 1800 degrees Fahrenheit. The body needs to burn at this temperature for 90 to 120 minutes. Even then you may still have a few pieces that may need to be crushed.

 

[MyBelle]

^^THIS. All lies are sins and the big whoppers this told are all about covering her ass. Anyone who thinks she won't go right on lying is is insane. That's what really bothers me about the female prosecutor in the last presser. She almost appeared to feel sorry for KK when explaining her dry run killing visits with "she just couldn't go through with it". Give me a f-ing break. That woman is snowed by KK. Oh sure, KK drove thousands of miles, on multiple trips to stalk Kelsey to murder her and, oh, sure, KK cleaned up a ghastly murder scene (and brought her own supplies to do it), and oh, sure, KK attended the moving and burning of Kelsey's body and, oh, sure, KK stole Kelsey's phone and sent phony texts to delay any investigation, and oh, sure, KK destroyed her own phone along with Kelsey's and, oh, sure, KK lied her ass of to LE but, hey, she just couldn't actually go through with doing the killing, herself and she's like totally telling the truth now and being so cooperative. *****, please.

:vomit:

The jury isn't going to buy the act, either.

JMO

 

[dixiegirl1035]

"Defense attorneys also highlighted a lack of blood or other physical evidence detected in Frazee’s truck..."

Cops: Man tied sweater around fiancee's face, beat her to death with bat before burning body

Lack of blood is tied into the bank video? To confirm what she said, and if she was in a tote, there wouldn't be no blood in the vehicle

 

[raja]

I wonder if the few spots she left were fingerprints belonging to PF.

 

[heartgoesout]

No I don't have phone records. No, I cannot say anything without a doubt.

I was just having a moment of levity.

jmo

Me either. : ) That's why I'm questioning and questioning.
I want the truth.

 

[MemPat]

Lack of blood is tied into the bank video? To confirm what she said, and if she was in a tote, there wouldn't be no blood in the vehicle

I still bet there was a truck wash somewhere in this time frame.

 

[gitana1]

That is DEFINITELY going to BE his defense. Assuming that the defense can't find holes in the technology to make it possible that KK was there in WP herself on the 22nd.

It would have to be more than holes in technology to allow her to have been there on that date.

She would've had to have had a broom to get to CO by the afternoon of 11-22 and back to ID by the 23rd in order to borrow a car in ID and turn right around and go right back to CO just to clean the crime scene and then race back once again to ID on 11-25.

Surely her ex knows where she was on Thanksgiving. They live together. And she already feels like she has to lie about going to CO to him so I don't think he's going to cover for her.

KK there during the murder doesn't make sense. KK there after the murder to clean help cover up the murder, does. IMO.

 

[Dave F.]

I’m not sure it even matters weather or not kk was there or not(which she wasn’t). As far as PF denial of involvement

Via video surveillance

KB enters the home.

PF enters the home.

PF leaves the home

KB is never seen leaving the home alive again!

No contact with anybody etc.

KB blood is found on cleaning items at ma fs

Medical document dated December 12th no KB listed as contact signed by PF

Pretty definitive IMO

PF is not going to walk away from this

Investigator Slater didn't say KB's blood was on the Swiffer mop. What he said was that it tested positive under the Luminol (he used a brand name), but the Swiffer wasn't covered in the warrant, so they left it there. Then, they included it in the second warrant and now have it in their possession. He did not elaborate further, which I took to mean it has not been tested yet. That may be part of the destructible evidence testing that the Asst. DA explained they would collaborate with defense of later. IMO

 

[Sheila Terranova]

I root for the murderer to be charged and convicted of murder. Without KK's cooperation and plea deal there would be no murder charges.

Not directed at you, but generally it's interesting. There is often a greater outcry when women are involved in such crimes than there is when men are involved, even when the male had a greater and more sinsiter role.

Apparently this is because the cultural gender construct of women is as nurturer. Especially mothers. When women are involved in stuff like this, society panics because it shifts out worldview. It shifts our conception of gender roles.
The myth of the she-devil: why we judge female criminals more harshly

What we know indicates PF murdered KB. And while KK was heavily involved, she did not commit the actual murder. And yet I almost sense a rage so great about her and her involvement that it's almost as if it would be okay if PF got away with it just as long as KK didn't get a nice plea deal.

Speaking only for myself, hell no. I am heart sick about this crime. The pair remind me of the charming Virginia tech pair that murdered innocent little Nicole. My personal fury towards the horror KK committed in no way mitigates the double horror picturing PF's evil rage . He is the topmost villain. But, I think what we are picking up on, is he is safely in the clink, while KK roams freely. JMO

 

[k-mac]

BBMFF:

Agree, and to your bolded point: I'm genuinely baffled by the argument some are making that there is some type of (im)moral equivalency b/t KK's actions and PF's actions, i.e, she is just as bad or just as responsible as PF for KB's murder.

KK was unable to bring herself to swing the bat at Kelsey, for whatever reason.
Maybe she has some vestige of a conscience somewhere deep in that depraved heart of hers, maybe she was just afraid of the consequences.

PF was able and willing where KK was not. He swung the bat...with gusto. Repeatedly.
PF blindfolded KB and beat her to death while she was helpless and unsuspecting.

KK cleaned up the mess PF made, which is to say, she wiped up KB's blood.
So, KK did/does have KB's blood on her hands in that sense.

But PF is the violent, remorseless monster who sprayed KB's blood all over her walls.

No amount of Wet Wipes can wash KB's blood off his hands.

Their actions r/t KB are not comparable.

All of the above: JMO.

yep

just not buying her being intimidated by him. AT ALL.

I have in the back of my mind through all this doco dump 'do it...do it......do it.....we got this…...we got this.....do it....do it.....we got this…..'

imo PF fulfilled her wishes. because he wanted KK and KK wanted KB out of the picture.
after he had the audacity to knock her up with a life long commitment. that's a big burn. that's a big ego crusher hill to climb back the love of your life.
such a blessing Kaylee wasn't perceived part of the 'problem for elimination.'

I agree something was likely meant to happen over night when PF kept KB up all night and he lost his nerve.

her lying about him soliciting her rather than we conspired together truly p#*ses me off.
she admits so much but yet so little.
imo

 

[GordianKnot]

I learned a few pages back about a "roadside squat" and now I can't separate the two!

Fortunately, MemPat, you don't need to separate them!
Interestingly, the name "Massy" means "roadside squatter" in the language of a remote, primitive, and as yet undiscovered tribe living deep in some jungle somewhere.

At least, that's my rough translation.

 

[ajaylee]

I read that also, I'm assuming he wanted to use the forklift to bring it down because of possibly being excess bodily fluids and stench.

I think he used the tractor to get the tote to the top of the hay bales and then he climbed up and pushed it out of sight. IIRC, when he came back to retrieve it, he had to climb up and push it forward.

He's a fairly big guy, likely strong from what he does for a living, but ranchers don't need to waste energy or risk injury when there's a tractor ready to hand. I think he could have lifted the tote, but not carried it up or down a ladder.

IMHO.

 

[Hatfield]

Sorry for this graphic post. The temperature needed to turn human bones into ashes is 1400 to 1800 degrees Fahrenheit. The body needs to burn at this temperature for 90 to 120 minutes. Even then you may still have a few pieces that may need to be crushed.

Good information which is why I am pretty certain there was at least some remnants and remain fragments that he had to take away.

Even when I burn old dead trees that I have cut up, I am always amazed how I have to constantly stir it and turn it over to get the wood on bottom to burn. Its a constant and very time consuming effort to always stir and turn over the wood to get it to totally burn down. And that is just old wood chunks.

 

[k-mac]

I root for the murderer to be charged and convicted of murder. Without KK's cooperation and plea deal there would be no murder charges.

Not directed at you, but generally it's interesting. There is often a greater outcry when women are involved in such crimes than there is when men are involved, even when the male had a greater and more sinsiter role.

Apparently this is because the cultural gender construct of women is as nurturer. Especially mothers. When women are involved in stuff like this, society panics because it shifts out worldview. It shifts our conception of gender roles.
The myth of the she-devil: why we judge female criminals more harshly

What we know indicates PF murdered KB. And while KK was heavily involved, she did not commit the actual murder. And yet I almost sense a rage so great about her and her involvement that it's almost as if it would be okay if PF got away with it just as long as KK didn't get a nice plea deal.

think g1 it is simply because like CW, he is where he belongs.....he will never get out of prison.
we as an entirety are satisfied with this.

its watching a co conspirator/love rival who had the most reason to want KB out of the picture not getting just desserts.
we are not satisfied with this

 

[Artis]

Again, the night before the murder, PF's behavior is very strange

He has an ulcer. What is KB going to do for him that his own Mother, an RN can't do? Why does he make KB come out there on a cold winter night to give him some meds? Some over the counter stuff, likely. Why does he send her out after cows on a different property for at least 3 hours in the middle of the night? Is SF aware both KB and Baby K are there that night?

Baby K was clearly around him or his mother. Why did KB then have to wearily take Baby K back about 4 am and drive from his place to her own, then text him only 5 hours later.

He had to be in the last few hours of planning the murder the next day. He'd already thought of a bat or an iron rod, as we have heard from KK, so he was well prepared mentally to batter this woman to death. LE hasn't noted that he was texting KK or she was texting him that night. Why not let KB have an accident out in the dark in a remote part of the pasture?

And the next day is weird too.

And then the massive overkill, if KK is to be believed. And the almost ritualistic destruction of her remains in the burn pit on his very own property. Didn't he think LE would come out there and notice that immediately? And he appears to have let KK participate in the burn

And the burn didn't need to be hidden from his mother

And his own brother, a sworn law enforcement officer, seems to give him an alibi that doesn't pan out on reviewing the cell phone records.

And his mother pleads the 5th.

Somebody ought to obtain Ma's cell phone records.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

I still bet there was a truck wash somewhere in this time frame.

Interesting, as I have gone through the bank teller to get coins at Christmas time for grandkids. I wonder if he went to get cash, or coins to the wash. That's speculation upon speculation, just saying

 

[mrstfs]

People keep mentioning that KK could’ve prevented this. IMHO, she didn’t want to prevent it because she helped plan it. I don’t think KK killed KB. I think she helped plan it.

I don’t understand how they’re charging him with soliciting murder with no evidence of solicitation other than KK verbal input.

I don’t think there’s any solicitation. I think PF and KK planned this. PF did it. KK cleaned up.

MOO

 

[Mauig’ma]

I root for the murderer to be charged and convicted of murder. Without KK's cooperation and plea deal there would be no murder charges.

Not directed at you, but generally it's interesting. There is often a greater outcry when women are involved in such crimes than there is when men are involved, even when the male had a greater and more sinsiter role.

Apparently this is because the cultural gender construct of women is as nurturer. Especially mothers. When women are involved in stuff like this, society panics because it shifts out worldview. It shifts our conception of gender roles.
The myth of the she-devil: why we judge female criminals more harshly

What we know indicates PF murdered KB. And while KK was heavily involved, she did not commit the actual murder. And yet I almost sense a rage so great about her and her involvement that it's almost as if it would be okay if PF got away with it just as long as KK didn't get a nice plea deal.

You nailed it right on the head!!

 

[Trocroc9]

I respect everyone’s opinions on here but I can’t let it go that KK is more involved than her side of the story. This is an example why I think there is more to it:

From Affidavit Line 49: “On or about December 4, 2018 Lee told Chad she could not find her cell phone and asked him to take her into town to purchase a new one”.

Line 50: Chad knows Lee has a google email account and had her account information stored in his phone contacts under the name Krystal Lee as “Marlee *****@gmail.com”. Investigators applied for and were granted a search warrant for this account. During a review of that account investigators found Google location data for most of November and December 2018. However, the dates surrounding the murder of Berreth contained no location history.

So tell me why is that time period conveniently erased?