CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #46*ARREST*

[ajaylee]

I think when striking the plea deal it was probably done after LE could already prove that she wasn't there when KB was murdered. Cell pings, Survelience video they had of PF coming and going etc.

I think It's very probable that LE told her listen we know you wern't there when KB was murdered we will give you this deal.

You have no reason to not be truthful and if we find that you are not being truthful we will charge you accordingly and void the plea.

KK would have no reason to outright lie at this point as she would be risking possible LWOP or min 20yrs, when if she just tells the truth she gets a slap on the wrist.

Why would she continue to lie?

I don't think she would tell a lie. I think she might omit some of the truth that might be helpful.

For example, PF might have said he was going to dispose of KB's remains at the landfill or a river. He might have given her more specific information about their disposal. If neither she or PF talk about it, LE will never know.

Technically, I guess that would be withholding information or a lie by omission.

 

[MyBelle]

I thought it was strange that the defense brought that up. For some reason, and I have no idea why, I think they were telegraphing something that they would want brought up at trial.

For some strange reason, I do hope that they do confirm that that tampon was from KB and not KKL. I don't know why I'm thinking that or I don't know where where I'm going with this, but it was just so strange that it was brought up.

Yes, it could be perhaps they were just talking about that it could be in the ceiling and on the walls and on the vanity and the door hinges on the rug from that, (pfffft) but it just seems so strange that they brought that up.

I am not not not going anywhere else with this, although I could.

You raise a good point. Somebody up thread commented that the trips KK made to WP may have coincided with KB's period. Maybe they coincided with KK's period?

I also hope they tested the blood because I thought it very strange that KB would leave a tampon in a bathroom trash with a toddler in the house. A tampon would have an odor and toddlers get into everything. No mention if that trash was behind a child-proof lock.

I think the only reason defense brought it up was because they don't want speculation that the reason PF killed KB was because she was pregnant again.

In the Jessica O'Grady case, the motive was that Jessica had just learned she was pregnant....and Christopher Edward's other girlfriend also was pregnant.

JMO

 

[MassGuy]

I think when striking the plea deal it was probably done after LE could already prove that she wasn't there when KB was murdered. Cell pings, Survelience video they had of PF coming and going etc.

I think It's very probable that LE told her listen we know you wern't there when KB was murdered we will give you this deal.

You have no reason to not be truthful and if we find that you are not being truthful we will charge you accordingly and void the plea.

KK would have no reason to outright lie at this point as she would be risking possible LWOP or min 20yrs, when if she just tells the truth she gets a slap on the wrist.

Why would she continue to lie?

It’s damn fortunate for KK, and in the interest of justice for PF, that 800 miles separated them.

Had KK lived closer to PF, it would be a hell of a lot easier for the defense to spin a story that makes KK the murderer.

Fortunately for the prosecution, they can prove that PF committed this murder when KK was back in Idaho.

I truly believe that KK is capable of murder, even if she did chicken out on three prior occasions.

But being capable of murder is one thing, and having the opportunity to commit a murder is another.

If she was in Idaho, she could not have killed Kelsey.

I believe that the prosecution can slam the door in regards to KK being the killer, especially considering the fact that PF’s actions (lies, surveillance footage, cell activity) is documented.

You cannot separate PF from this crime, even if you say that KK is the killer.

 

[oviedo]

It would not serve her to lie but when I consider who we are talking about and the fact she already has, I would not count on it but I see your points. We do not know the plea deal either.

In fact, have the exhibits been released yet? Or a hearing transcript, I mean the entire transcript, not the tweets and not the affidavit.

I agree it will be interesting to say the least with probably some surprising testimony and evidence. It still is looking like a he said/she said whether PF testifies or chooses not to.

Just praying for justice for all of the victims.

I checked the docket and no hearing transcript yet. or exhibits.

 

[Artis]

I didn't know KK went with him to get her body. How can anybody go to a person's place, view their battered murdered body and then go with him to burn it. This is beyond anything.

KK claims to have never seen Kelsey's murdered body. I don't believe her.

 

[Deleted member 158085]

If he whipped his shirt off in the bathroom when cleaning up, it could have cast blood onto the ceiling. Maybe? I don't know...
MOO

If KK or PF took any hard-surfaced bloody item into the bathroom to rinse off in the sink, at just the wrong angle it could have easily sent blood droplets up to the ceiling. Trust me, I’ve had this happen before - just not with blood. (If there’s a way to make a bigger mess when cleaning, I’m the type to find it.)

 

[MsBetsy]

10:10 a.m.: Prosecutors asked Adams about a "black tote" that Frazee had in his possession shown on one surveillance video.

11 a.m.: Cheryl also said that Kelsey told her it was "nice to have her gun back" and that "she felt safe now," according to Slater. He learned from Cheryl that Frazee took Kelsey's gun after they had an argument over finances on Jan. 1, 2017. During that argument, Berreth allegedly said "Maybe I'd be better off dead" and pointed the gun at herself. Slater says Berreth got the gun back on Nov. 22, 2018.

Accomplice: Kelsey Berreth was blindfolded, beaten, burned by fiance

I'm still very curious about that statement Kelsey made to her mother about feeling safe now.
Was she afraid before? Is that particular area a dangerous place to live? The kind of place where almost everyone owns a gun for protection?
I really wonder if Kelsey had a reason to be afraid. Maybe she suspected something. She must have been a little disturbed, or at least suspicious when a stranger came to the door with a cup of coffee. Maybe she sensed that she was in danger. Imo

 

[MassGuy]

KK claims to have never seen Kelsey's murdered body. I don't believe her.

I think it’s absolutely possible that you are right.

This is the type of lie she might tell, as it is unprovable.

As that tote burned, I think it’s likely that she would have gotten a glimpse of something.

 

[ajaylee]

KK claims to have never seen Kelsey's murdered body. I don't believe her.

That's something else I don't think we'll ever know the truth about. It would be her word against PF's, who is also a known liar. Absent evidence, there's no way to know for sure whether or not she saw the body. If she did, I think she knows she could deny it to LE and probably get away with it.

 

[Ccging]

10:10 a.m.: Prosecutors asked Adams about a "black tote" that Frazee had in his possession shown on one surveillance video.

11 a.m.: Cheryl also said that Kelsey told her it was "nice to have her gun back" and that "she felt safe now," according to Slater. He learned from Cheryl that Frazee took Kelsey's gun after they had an argument over finances on Jan. 1, 2017. During that argument, Berreth allegedly said "Maybe I'd be better off dead" and pointed the gun at herself. Slater says Berreth got the gun back on Nov. 22, 2018.

Accomplice: Kelsey Berreth was blindfolded, beaten, burned by fiance

What’s interesting is if KB spoke or texted she felt safe “Now” after getting her gun back. We will never know for sure, but why did she not feel safe without a gun? Her neighborhood? Or if I suspect, because of PF either directly or indirectly.

 

[ab01]

I don't think she would tell a lie. I think she might omit some of the truth that might be helpful.

For example, PF might have said he was going to dispose of KB's remains at the landfill or a river. He might have given her more specific information about their disposal. If neither she or PF talk about it, LE will never know.

Technically, I guess that would be withholding information or a lie by omission.

I think the reason LE is at Midway is bc KK pointed them there....MOO

ETA: I haven't heard of any river searches happening..... also MOO

 

[ilovechili]

My guess would be he grabbed her hit her head on something hard even the floor. Injured her, then placed her where he wanted and hit her with the bat. Reason being this was a personal killing. Mostly, these are up close and personal. I don't believe the blindfold story.

I do not believe the blindfold either or it at least do not believe it occurred the way it was described. That was added in for some reason, imho. So he went to Walmart, all seemed fine and he came back (but shouldn't have been per his story as the baby was already exchanged) and went from zero to 60 in very little time and after putting the baby in a playpen first? Also t not so much rage that anything else was apparently broken, dented, hit, etc.? I am in overanalyzing mode and need to stop . A couple of things I read and watched showed me how many wonder these various things as I do as well and it got me going I guess.

Of the few facts known to us: Both people lied to LE agencies and were caught in lies. Which leaves me far less to believe what is a farfetched story with almost too many details like someone's overactive imagination/more lies...

I agree though that killing that way is generally very personal and that type of crime, the perp wants the victim to see. Blindfold does not fit that scenario.

 

[slashkiss]

I find it odd that LE has surveillance of PF coming and going from the house on Thanksgiving but there wasn't any mention of KK being caught on camera during the clean up.

 

[ajaylee]

I think the reason LE is at Midway is bc KK pointed them there....MOO

ETA: I haven't heard of any river searches happening..... also MOO

Yeah, that's the other problem with discussing much of this - we won't know until the trial what LE actually has.

 

[lindaromas]

In a ... tote bag? *ducks and runs*

“IN A TOTE BAG”. Well, that just put an eerie thought in my head. Auntie per the affidavit the tote was described as black plastic with silver handles BUT...a tote BAG has been repeatedly mentioned. When I saw the Christmas tree bag I thought a body could easily be put in a bag like that. I believe it unzips on 3 sides. Could he have put the bag over her trying to keep splatter in the bag but didn’t get it completely zipped causing the splatter when done hitting zipped it up and place it in the plastic tote? If she wasn’t completely gone when they went to retrieve her that’s where the bullet went?
I don’t like thinking this way but I really want answers. Praying for the Berreths and I’m so sorry if they are reading all of these horrendous possible ways of removing their daughter from this world.

 

[ilovechili]

What’s interesting is if KB spoke or texted she felt safe “Now” after getting her gun back. We will never know for sure, but why did she not feel safe without a gun? Her neighborhood? Or if I suspect, because of PF either directly or indirectly.

To believe KK, she was being stalked by strange women offering coffee, play dates, with baseball bats, etc. That is probably a sample of what they were doing and here she is with a small baby and no gun a single woman, she probably was relieved to have it back. Half joking lol

 

[ilovechili]

I checked the docket and no hearing transcript yet. or exhibits.

Thank you so much for doing that.

 

[ab01]

I have often read that familiar murderers generally have in their minds what they think are well thought out plans.

They obsess about them thinking about very minute details etc.

But when it comes down to do it adrenaline fear and panic make it hard to have any sense of rational thought.

They can't think straight, they panic and that is why they generally screw up the order of things they had all planned out and end up making very many mistakes.

The one thing about familiar murder is, not only do they have to commit the perfect crime.

But Also they are the first ones that police want to talk to.

So you better be an excellent liar and socialpath with detatchment from your crimes.

Thankfully not many are very good at looking at a seasoned police detective in the eyes and fooling them.

@christopherWatts for reference

 

[MyBelle]

I'm still very curious about that statement Kelsey made to her mother about feeling safe now.
Was she afraid before? Is that particular area a dangerous place to live? The kind of place where almost everyone owns a gun for protection?
I really wonder if Kelsey had a reason to be afraid. Maybe she suspected something. She must have been a little disturbed, or at least suspicious when a stranger came to the door with a cup of coffee. Maybe she sensed that she was in danger. Imo

BBM. If a stranger came to my front door to thank me for returning her lost dogs, I would be frightened because I would know I never returned her dogs. I certainly wouldn't drink the coffee.

Plus, KK made two more trips to KB's but she abandoned the drug idea after the first visit. The next two were pipe and ball bat. Maybe they were caught on the neighbor's camera and warned KK? That is certainly something KB would discuss with her mom.

 

[MassGuy]

I find it odd that LE has surveillance of PF coming and going from the house on Thanksgiving but there wasn't any mention of KK being caught on camera during the clean up.

The system that the neighbor had, only stores 7 days of footage.

Somehow, and quite fortuitously, it caught PF in a huge lie, when he returned to the house.

If you had to chose, that’s the video you would want.

It’s damning.

So it’s possible that the footage of KK was deleted, or the motion activation wasn’t triggered for some reason.