CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #46*ARREST*

[Artis]

Yup. According to the affidavit, KK began cooperating and was interviewed on December 20.

Later that night, law enforcement returned to the Berreth residence.

A bunch of us thought someone had to be talking, and that person is now confirmed to be KK.

They were there because of her.

PF was arrested the following day.

Help me out, here:

11/25 Well check. Cops knock on door, no answer and they leave.

12/2 Forced entry well check, everything looks okay.

12/6 Kelsey's family finds blood, calls cops and what happened? They just took swabs to confirm it was hers? Why did it take until 12/20 for the serious search?

 

[Artis]

He worked at the dude ranch, where ever it was, that summer of 2006 when dynamic duo was first formed. He recently moved from Florissant to Divide. IMO

Wait, who moved?

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Help me out, here:

11/25 Well check. Cops knock on door, no answer and they leave.

12/2 Forced entry well check, everything looks okay.

12/6 Kelsey's family finds blood, calls cops and what happened? They just took swabs to confirm it was hers? Why did it take until 12/20 for the serious search?

Probable cause needed? Obtained with the interview with KKL? Surreptitious surveillance from the 14th through the 21st?

 

[MsBetsy]

NPD and ASPD are now interchangeable diagnosis according to some, and I think the latest DSM (5?) claims they are the same?

There is some overlap between the two disorders, as they are both "cluster B" but they are not the same.
Another disorder that also shows significant traits of Narcissism is Borderline Personality Disorder.
KK actually reminds me of someone with Borderline. She seems to be eager to please and shows signs of fear of abandonment, as well as narcissistic traits.
The problem is people with these kinds of Personality Disorders are so hard to diagnose. They don't go for help because they don't think anything is wrong with them. They blame everyone else for their actions. Imo

 

[MassGuy]

Help me out, here:

11/25 Well check. Cops knock on door, no answer and they leave.

12/2 Forced entry well check, everything looks okay.

12/6 Kelsey's family finds blood, calls cops and what happened? They just took swabs to confirm it was hers? Why did it take until 12/20 for the serious search?

It’s unclear as to the specifics of their earlier searches.

The affidavit does say that a CSI team found traces of blood in the bathroom, and used Blue Star.

It does not say if they used it in the rest of the house.

When they returned to the house on the 20th, after talking to KK, that’s when the case turned.

If they didn’t search the rest of the house for blood before that, which I don’t think they did, that’s bizarre and bothersome.

 

[Artis]

Laughable! If anything, I think it's the other way around. She couldn't please him, no matter how hard she tried. I really hope she did break up with him, injured his little ego.

He certainly has a big ego but that doesn't discount his perception as expressed to CB. It was obviously bugging him. We didn't know Kelsey and she may have been very intelligent and delivered some sharp zingers, being unhappy with the loser he was.

 

[Hatch]

I don't see it as necessarily being false. It depends a great deal on the dynamics of the two involved.

I don't consider myself a stupid woman, or easily swayed...and the man I fell for who turned out to be evil incarnate and NPD/Sociopath, wasn't the slickest in any respect...but he got to me overlook obvious red flags. Cognitive dissonance and suspension of disbelief at play.

Depends a lot on one's own personality, life experiences, current outlook and needs.

So, KK may have seen him as good looking and enticing, until she REALLY saw him.

The first time she witnessed a rage and mad fit I suspect she saw the real PF on more than one occasion. I expect baby K saw some also.

 

[Artis]

I wonder if kk May have actually been frightened of PF after seeing the crime scene? I’m not excusing her actions in any way, but I will say that would seem to back up what she told her friend. Moo

ETA and I realize she still helped him move a body , dispose of it etc, but I do wonder if she thought different about him after the fact? It’s one thing to fantasize about wanting someone gone, but I would assume there becomes a gravity of the actual act of murder after the fact.

This is why I think she lied about seeing Kelsey's body. I don't think the crime scene phased her but seeing the results of a bludgeoning might have shocked her.

 

[Hatfield]

It’s unclear as to the specifics of their earlier searches.

The affidavit does say that a CSI team found traces of blood in the bathroom, and used Blue Star.

It does not say if they used it in the rest of the house.

When they returned to the house on the 20th, after talking to KK, that’s when the case turned.

If they didn’t search the rest of the house for blood before that, which I don’t think they did, that’s bizarre and bothersome.

JMO
Based on the early LE news conferences before they honed in on PF, I ended up getting a strange sense that LE did not want to believe that their own "local F family" with a big local farmette and LE relatives could have anything to do with the "out of town" girl thats living in a condo. I would hate to think that they weren't considering him as much as they should have but it sure seemed that way when reporters asked them if they had talked with him yet and they indicated "not yet but they would like to soon" or something along those lines.

It may have just been the way the news reports were coming out but I did not get a good sense that they aggressively were pursuing that something bad may have really happened to her. From how quick and evidently badly they originally searched her home to the lack of aggressively trying to interrogate PF, it all came across to me that they did not want to think PF had anything to do with her being gone.

That all changed of course and then LE did a super job from that point forward.

 

[Artis]

BBM

More like she'd asked him to actually "man up".
A task woefully unsuited to PF.

Or that she'd voiced plans to relocate. ( In PF's small mind --"How dare she ?" )

At this time nothing this liar says is remotely believable .

Exactly. We've all known people who are sharp (mentally) and can make some cutting remarks (deserved!) and if she did that with him, it could enrage him. It was on his mind - even after he'd killed her. IOW he was STILL mad enough about it to to tell CB. These personality dynamics are not something we're likely to find out much about but they're part of all relationships. I think she was WAY smarter than he is and he knew it. Little digs here and there would only remind him of what a failure he was.

 

[Hatch]

And she would never thrown away Kelsey's tooth which would be proof positive to hang him. She's just a liar. Oh, and, btw, she could have taken pics of Kelsey's home before cleaning it, emailed them to herself and then deleted them from the phone. She may have taken pics but she destroyed her phone so LE could never see what was on it.

If she took pics I believe she just had to send them to one of her besties or saved them to savor with PF around the fire side burn .

 

[MassGuy]

JMO
Based on the early LE news conferences before they honed in on PF, I ended up getting a strange sense that LE did not want to believe that their own "local F family" with a big local farmette and LE relatives could have anything to do with the "out of town" girl thats living in a condo. I would hate to think that they weren't considering him as much as they should have but it sure seemed that way when reporters asked them if they had talked with him yet and they indicated "not yet but they would like to soon" or something along those lines.

It may have just been the way the news reports were coming out but I did not get a good sense that they aggressively were pursuing that something bad may have really happened to her. From how quick and evidently badly they originally searched her home to the lack of aggressively trying to interrogate PF, it all came across to me that they did not want to think PF had anything to do with her being gone.

That all changed of course and then LE did a super job from that point forward.

I genuinely don’t believe that was going on.

The CBI was the one that performed the forensic analysis after CB found blood, and they had a lot of influence here.

They wouldn’t play favorites with a guy, simply because he has family in law enforcement.

Lots of people have family in local law enforcement.

 

[Artis]

Hey, BB ~ the reason I reacted so emphatically that the person quoted in the article's statement was, "FALSE" is because they stated that "...for any gal, he's a very good looking guy, and he's got personality."

It's a complete falsehood to state that PF is a very good-looking guy "for any gal."
I'm a gal. So is @PommyMommy .
PF makes me and @ Pommy-Mommy both puke. (I know this b/c she used the projectile puking emoji).
We do not find PF physically attractive.
Some women absolutely would and do find him attractive, I absolutely agree with you about that.

But the claim that "any gal" is going to find PF a "very good-looking guy" is untrue.
Dude is no Adonis.

I won't even attempt to speak to the claim that "he's got personality" as I value my freedom here on WS.

JMO!

I find him okay in the looks department but people really ought to listen to him on his YT channel. Once he opens his mouth he's repulsive. Kelsey thought otherwise, apparently.

 

[BingoBongo]

I know this has come up before, but all of the personality disorders ARE mental health disorders, or mental illnesses, including Anti- social Personality Disorder. (psychopath) Those with ASPD very often have narcissistic traits. Imo

I keep saying this because I don't want any misconception, I am not in the field, nor trained, etc....but I don't believe ASPD is necessarily the same as psychopathy.

A lot of traits are shared by NPD, ASPD, Sociopathy and Psychopathy...but in varying degrees, varying behaviors (particularly as exhibited, or not, in childhood) and varying actions.

 

[Hatfield]

I genuinely don’t believe that was going on.

The CBI was the one that performed the forensic analysis after CB found blood, and they had a lot of influence here.

They wouldn’t play favorites with a guy, simply because he has family in law enforcement.

Lots of people have family in local law enforcement.

Yeah I would surely hope not. It just seemed real odd in those early news conferences.

I suppose they were just keeping a lot close to their vest as usually happens. And of course they didnt want to make PF panic since he still had the child.

 

[MassGuy]

Yeah I would surely hope not. It just seemed real odd in those early news conferences.

I suppose they were just keeping a lot close to their vest as usually happens. And of course they didnt want to make PF panic since he still had the child.

Yeah. They certainly didn’t want to tip their hand that early, and as we know, an arrest didn’t come until almost 3 weeks later.

He had a child in his custody, and they had a case to build.

Coming out to too strongly, would not be in the best interest of justice.

Or the child’s.

 

[Artis]

As all of these incredibly obtuse perps do, PF vastly underestimated the dedication and persistence of LE. They all seem to think that LE will believe their BS stories and not care to investigate if there's no body and no obvious blood. You can't make sense of it. It's like they live in an alternate Universe. MOO

No impulse control. Potential consequences take a backseat when the lizard brain takes over.

 

[Artis]

Do liars lie to other liars?

Does a bear... well, you know.

 

[MsBetsy]

I keep saying this because I don't want any misconception, I am not in the field, nor trained, etc....but I don't believe ASPD is necessarily the same as psychopathy.

A lot of traits are shared by NPD, ASPD, Sociopathy and Psychopathy...but in varying degrees, varying behaviors (particularly as exhibited, or not, in childhood) and varying actions.

A Psychopath is just the old term for Anti- social Personality Disorder. It was changed for obvious reasons (who wants to be called a psychopath?) But yes, the word pyschopath is still used to describe certain traits.
Mental Health Disorder is now more commonly used than Mental Illness for the same reason, imo. It just sounds better.

 

[PommyMommy]

Sam Kraemer‏ @SamKraemerTV
Kudos to the @SalvationArmyUS Fountain Valley Chapter for providing meals for the searchers at the Midway Landfill. (Photo cred: WPPD) @KOAA #KelseyBerreth #PatrickFrazee #KrystalKenney

Sam Kraemer‏ @SamKraemerTV
I did talk with a DA’s Office spokesperson today. So far, no updates on the landfill search. @KOAA #KelseyBerreth #PatrickFrazee #KrystalKenney

Patrick Nelson‏ @PatrickNelsonTV
Our @SamKraemerTV hustles hard to get our viewers every little nugget of information he can find in the #PatrickFrazee case. He's owning this story and is becoming an expert on this case. Follow him for updates, or if you have questions You rock Sam. #PositivityPosse