CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #46*ARREST*

[k-mac]

I think a lot of the mistakes he made were bc he’s simply a narc. I truly believe that he just thought LE would see oh KB contacted work, told her mom she’d contact her later and they would just accept that she took off.

Why would they have any reason to question me? She just left and I have KF why would I know where she is.

He underestimated the abilities of LE!

He’s just that self absorbed!

kk and pf thought they were very clever.
they understood the text messages needed to be sent from certain phone towers etc but imo neither of them comprehended that the phones acted like a tracking device.
all of them.
she was turning the phone on and off on the trip back to Idaho but idont believe it was for evasive tracking. I think she knew enough to know if someone rang KBs phone or texted it it would appear location.

PF wouldn't have been carting KBs phone around with him if he realised. it was pretty dumb if you knew all this.

moo

 

[k-mac]

I wonder if kk May have actually been frightened of PF after seeing the crime scene? I’m not excusing her actions in any way, but I will say that would seem to back up what she told her friend. Moo

ETA and I realize she still helped him move a body , dispose of it etc, but I do wonder if she thought different about him after the fact? It’s one thing to fantasize about wanting someone gone, but I would assume there becomes a gravity of the actual act of murder after the fact.

and go get a feed straight after?
that action proves she wasnt sickened by the situation. imo

 

[BingoBongo]

A Psychopath is just the old term for Anti- social Personality Disorder. It was changed for obvious reasons (who wants to be called a psychopath?) But yes, the word pyschopath is still used to describe certain traits.
Mental Health Disorder is now more commonly used than Mental Illness for the same reason, imo. It just sounds better.

Here are (IMO) two good articles about the differences. One of them definitely reminds me of CW and PF.

How to Tell a Sociopath from a Psychopath

Narcissist or Sociopath? Similarities, Differences and Signs

 

[ilovechili]

Yet...

Pg 7, #48 of the AA

"...Lee purposely concealed this information prior to her fully cooperation and truthful statements to investigators on December 20, 2018."

I must be missing the relation of that to my post re suicide/baseball bat and PF at least continuing that scenario with KB (or the trip scenario, taking off)... I may be a bit slow at the moment because I don't get it...

 

[slashkiss]

I am still wondering why he decided to use a bat to kill her - that doesn't make sense with the scene he was trying to set of her leaving or possibly being suicide. Using a bat was messy and had the potential to spread evidence to nooks and crannys of the house and his person.

Also - He and KK's first attempt to kill her was with the poison coffee. There is no way I believe that KK didn't actually taint the coffee before giving it to her. I personally think KK handed her the poisoned coffee and for some reason it didn't kill her. Maybe she didn't really drink the coffee (I mean who drinks random drinks a stranger gives you in this day and age) or it wasn't enough to actually kill her. There is no way to prove whether she really "chickened out" that first attempt or not so I whole heartedly believe she got away with attempted murder. I do believe she couldn't go through with the metal bat attack because that is a far more confrontational and aggressive way to kill someone and not your typically females choice of murder weapons. I believe KK is a more passive and manipulating killer. She is every bit a killer because even if she didn't directly swing the fatal blows she had ever chance to prevent it and made the decision over and over again not to.

 

[Artis]

I thought le said they were able to trace a burner number back to kk? Am I mistaken?

I don't know and don't recall that but maybe?

 

[ab01]

Moo

I don’t think PF originally planned to murder kB on that particular day and in that particular manner.

<modsnipped information not substantiated with msm link> that he just lost it and all previous plans went out the window.

I think that would explain the reason that kk couldn’t come right away, I don’t think she was expecting it on that particular day.

Why he decided to go ahead and use the suicide story that he had previously thought out is beyond me.

My personal theory is that he didn’t have a better plan in his mind that he could spin.

He’s just not very smart. And on top of that; “ones anger tends to overpower ones intelligence”. - Chris Watts...probably

 

[PommyMommy]

I must be missing the relation of that to my post re suicide/baseball bat and PF at least continuing that scenario with KB (or the trip scenario, taking off)... I may be a bit slow at the moment because I don't get it...

Ooops, I should have emphasized the part of your post I was replying to.
I'll try again.

Yes, I agree, if you ask me it is insulting to all LE that she actually thinks they would believe that garbage as her actions show otherwise. I imagine they do not for one minute but it is the story of hers they have to work with and I guess at this point at least the goal is him and not her.

Respectfully snipped and bolded by me for focus

Yet...

Pg 7, #48 of the AA

"...Lee purposely concealed this information prior to her fully cooperation and truthful statements to investigators on December 20, 2018."

 

[Reachingfornettles]

I am still wondering why he decided to use a bat to kill her - that doesn't make sense with the scene he was trying to set of her leaving or possibly being suicide. Using a bat was messy and had the potential to spread evidence to nooks and crannys of the house and his person.

Also - He and KK's first attempt to kill her was with the poison coffee. There is no way I believe that KK didn't actually taint the coffee before giving it to her. I personally think KK handed her the poisoned coffee and for some reason it didn't kill her. Maybe she didn't really drink the coffee (I mean who drinks random drinks a stranger gives you in this day and age) or it wasn't enough to actually kill her. There is no way to prove whether she really "chickened out" that first attempt or not so I whole heartedly believe she got away with attempted murder. I do believe she couldn't go through with the metal bat attack because that is a far more confrontational and aggressive way to kill someone and not your typically females choice of murder weapons. I believe KK is a more passive and manipulating killer. She is every bit a killer because even if she didn't directly swing the fatal blows she had ever chance to prevent it and made the decision over and over again not to.

Kk claimed in her second attempt with the metal rod PF said to hit her in the back of the head ...it doesnt bleed as much.

 

[PommyMommy]

He worked at the dude ranch, where ever it was, that summer of 2006 when dynamic duo was first formed. He recently moved from Florissant to Divide. IMO

Wait, who moved?

PF lived in Florissant with his mama until LE moved him to Divide.

 

[Artis]

NPD and ASPD are now interchangeable diagnosis according to some, and I think the latest DSM (5?) claims they are the same?

Oh, and forgot - You may be thinking of ASPD and psychopath. They're often lumped together or used interchangeably. When they're not, there seems to be constant disagreement about it. I believe Robert Hare, the daddy on this topic, says all psychopaths are ASPD but not all ASPDs are psychopaths. An interesting thing with psychopaths is when shown photos of people with different facial expressions, they are unable to discern the emotions. They don't feel them, can't recognize them but do try to mimic. That has something to do with why their actions are so extreme. Only in those cases can they get any kind emotional charge.

 

[Artis]

"... After cleaning up, Lee said she put the trash bags near where Berreth’s Corolla was parked, loaded them into her car, and went to Sonic. From there, she returned to Frazee’s property. ..."



I think I have to get away from this whole thing for awhile. Reading about these psychopathic monsters is raising my blood pressure to the point that it’s actually dangerous. Maybe I’m a wuss but I just don’t know how people like this can be allowed to continue living. Maybe I am developing hangman’s attitude and that’s not good because it makes me just as bad as they are.

I've never heard that expression but knew what it was, right away. I used to do a lot of inner city (Los Angeles) animal rescue and what I encountered made me want to hunt down and kill animal abusers. A normal reaction that happens to a lot of people doing that work.

 

[gngr~snap]

I am still wondering why he decided to use a bat to kill her - that doesn't make sense with the scene he was trying to set of her leaving or possibly being suicide. Using a bat was messy and had the potential to spread evidence to nooks and crannys of the house and his person.

Also - He and KK's first attempt to kill her was with the poison coffee. There is no way I believe that KK didn't actually taint the coffee before giving it to her. I personally think KK handed her the poisoned coffee and for some reason it didn't kill her. Maybe she didn't really drink the coffee (I mean who drinks random drinks a stranger gives you in this day and age) or it wasn't enough to actually kill her. There is no way to prove whether she really "chickened out" that first attempt or not so I whole heartedly believe she got away with attempted murder. I do believe she couldn't go through with the metal bat attack because that is a far more confrontational and aggressive way to kill someone and not your typically females choice of murder weapons. I believe KK is a more passive and manipulating killer. She is every bit a killer because even if she didn't directly swing the fatal blows she had ever chance to prevent it and made the decision over and over again not to.

Just back from getting help in California, KB was probably refusing to see or talk to PF any more than needed to give him the baby. KK was probably the only person at the time that could reach her!
IMO the coffee was tainted. PF wanted KB gone!
I bet she got counseling and was told to stay as far away from him as possible!
Any counselor will tell you do not walk, RUN from a narcissist!!!
Moo

 

[gngr~snap]

Kk claimed in her second attempt with the metal rod PF said to hit her in the back of the head ...it doesnt bleed as much.

This is an RN?
She actually said that?
In my experience heads bleed like crazy!
She is so full of lies, she has lost the nurse in her. Thank God she'll never be one again!
Moo

 

[Artis]

I know this has come up before, but all of the personality disorders ARE mental health disorders, or mental illnesses, including Anti- social Personality Disorder. (psychopath) Those with ASPD very often have narcissistic traits. Imo

Mental illness can be medically treated. Full blown personality disorders cannot.

 

[skycountry]

not relevant, DBM

 

[Dave F.]

I am still wondering why he decided to use a bat to kill her - that doesn't make sense with the scene he was trying to set of her leaving or possibly being suicide. Using a bat was messy and had the potential to spread evidence to nooks and crannys of the house and his person.

Also - He and KK's first attempt to kill her was with the poison coffee. There is no way I believe that KK didn't actually taint the coffee before giving it to her. I personally think KK handed her the poisoned coffee and for some reason it didn't kill her. Maybe she didn't really drink the coffee (I mean who drinks random drinks a stranger gives you in this day and age) or it wasn't enough to actually kill her. There is no way to prove whether she really "chickened out" that first attempt or not so I whole heartedly believe she got away with attempted murder. I do believe she couldn't go through with the metal bat attack because that is a far more confrontational and aggressive way to kill someone and not your typically females choice of murder weapons. I believe KK is a more passive and manipulating killer. She is every bit a killer because even if she didn't directly swing the fatal blows she had ever chance to prevent it and made the decision over and over again not to.

At PF's insistence, KKL said she delivered a Latte Machiatto from Starbucks to KB. The barista at the Starbucks located inside the Safeway store of Woodland Park has been very specific that KB always ordered a Chai Latte. The drinks look almost the same, but don't even smell similar! Odds are great that the Machiatto went straight down the drain. IMO

 

[Artis]

Probable cause needed? Obtained with the interview with KKL? Surreptitious surveillance from the 14th through the 21st?

I don't know. It was the Dec 6 inspection (IIRC) where blood was seen in areas where it shouldn't have been and I'm sure Kelsey's family would have consented to an immediate forensic going over as took place on the 20th.

I hope someone can answer this because it mystifies me (if I have these dates right). That's a full two weeks delay.

 

[MassGuy]

I am still wondering why he decided to use a bat to kill her - that doesn't make sense with the scene he was trying to set of her leaving or possibly being suicide. Using a bat was messy and had the potential to spread evidence to nooks and crannys of the house and his person.

Also - He and KK's first attempt to kill her was with the poison coffee. There is no way I believe that KK didn't actually taint the coffee before giving it to her. I personally think KK handed her the poisoned coffee and for some reason it didn't kill her. Maybe she didn't really drink the coffee (I mean who drinks random drinks a stranger gives you in this day and age) or it wasn't enough to actually kill her. There is no way to prove whether she really "chickened out" that first attempt or not so I whole heartedly believe she got away with attempted murder. I do believe she couldn't go through with the metal bat attack because that is a far more confrontational and aggressive way to kill someone and not your typically females choice of murder weapons. I believe KK is a more passive and manipulating killer. She is every bit a killer because even if she didn't directly swing the fatal blows she had ever chance to prevent it and made the decision over and over again not to.

“That doesn’t make sense,” is PF in a nutshell.

As for the coffee scenario, I don’t believe it was poisoned, although I do believe that KK was fully capable of doing so.

Had she in fact poisoned it, the plan would require additional steps on the part of PF.

These steps were apparently not taken.

Her alleged apology to him for not poisoning the coffee, and his anger in response, rings true to me.

She just wanted to see her enemy in person.

 

[acutename]

Oh, and, you wouldn't destroy a cell phone by shooting it, lol! You'd smash it to pieces with a hammer.

just trying to figure out where the missing bullet from MG's gun might have gone