CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #48 *ARREST*

[Seattle1]

Does anyone think that PF was not really in the truck with Slagle when the package was picked up from KB's? Is there any evidence other than Slagle's word that PF was there? Maybe Slagle only said that PF was with him waiting in the truck as an alibi for PF? Although I can't really think of what PF would be doing-- but perhaps it was something that kept him out of town and he didn't want the police to find out where he was after the fact. He also went to the first press conference (seemingly in PF's stead) which seems to prove that PF did in fact have advance notice of the presser. Or at least he had enough notice to ask his "father figure" friend to go (My speculation only). I have always thought PF just wanted to avoid being asked to comment on KB being missing because he knew he would slip up. But sending someone else makes me wonder where PF was and what was he doing while the sheriff was saying "You would have to ask Patrick".

MOO.

If PF was not with RS as he stated in SW Attachment, he could be charged with providing false information to LE. I think PF was likely in truck with RS, and waited in the vehicle when RS was picking up package. MOO

 

[MassGuy]

There is no way to prove KK lied after she was given the plea deal. Because what she told LE is hearsay. She claimed PF told her he murdered KB on 11/22 using a ball bat. No way to prove that is a lie.

Sure, they have the lies PF told LE and CB and his cell phone data. But is that enough to convict him of premeditated, first degree murder? It is quite a stretch of imagination to believe it is when there is a woman who isn't just a known liar and current lover to the defendant but who has admitted she attempted to murder KB THREE times.

There is no evidence of the body burn. That's why they are at the landfill.

JMO

You left out a ton of evidence there, but it’s definitely a lot to type.

The only way one can make a case against KK, is to ignore that evidence, shift the timeline, and basically hate her until she somehow becomes a killer.

I think she’s vile, but the facts don’t change. The evidence is the evidence.

If she ain’t there, she ain’t there.

The fact that they are searching the dump, is not evidence that law enforcement believes she wasn’t burned.

They believe she was, and her remains are now at the dump.

Whole bodies end up in landfills, so do burned and dismembered ones.

 

[ab01]

Maybe I am looking at this incorrectly but if she typically used location, then there was a reason she shut location off, as they said, at and around the time of KB's murder (paraphrasing). To me, that was significant. Or am I looking at it incorrectly? She at least thought it seems that she would not be "tracked". What was the necessity?

I believe the significance is that she turned it off bc she was going to participate in cleaning up a crime scene and or disposing of a body. In and around the time of KB murder was put in to cover a broad time by LE. MOO

Luckily LE can still see ping data from her phone and or the burner phone she was using during this time frame. MOO

 

[ilovechili]

It’s more “reading between the lines.”

Law enforcement got her Google account information from KK’s ex husband.

When they applied for a search warrant, they found data for most of November and December, but the dates surrounding the murder had no data.

I think it’s a safe bet that it wasn’t there, because she turned it off, or deleted it (if deletion is possible).

From the affidavit:

How convenient is all I have to say. Who does that without a reason? Just saying...

 

[Eleanor Rigby]

The deal was not an incentive to lie, I don’t understand that point of view.

A lie would take her freedom away for a very long time.

They do not have simply the words of a liar. To insinuate that, or to flat out say it, one has to willingly ignore a great deal of evidence:

They have the lies PF told to trustworthy people (Doss, CB, LE).

They have video evidence of a lie (PF returning to KB’s house).

They have damning cell phone data.

They have physical evidence found at KB’s home, and very intriguing physical evidence at PF’s home (bloody sheet, cleaning supplies with presumptive blood).

They have video evidence of the tote.

They have incriminating evidence that backs up both the body burn, and storage locations.

They have witness statements.

And god knows what else...

Did you super sleuthers conclude that there's a good chance there is highway camera or other CCT evidence documenting KKL's drive to Colorado and back to Idaho? I remember a lot of discussion about that many threads ago after the info came out about KKL driving her friend's car to clean up "her mess." However, I can't remember the outcome of the discussion. That kind of evidence about the dates of her travel would be indisputable, IMO.

 

[MassGuy]

How convenient is all I have to say. Who does that without a reason? Just saying...

“You have a mess to clean up.”

She knew what that meant.

 

[MyBelle]

That would require having something called a conscience; something I see very little evidence of with Patty or his posse.



I too am undecided yet because there is not enough info. Her phone pings mean nothing to me it simply would show where her phone was, not her; just as we know KB's phone was with PF and it was not KB using it after a certain time on 11/22, this kind of thing is part of their modus operandi (is that the correct term lol?). I have a feeling KK was closer than some think, certainly not 12 hours away and I also have a suspicion that there was some attempt planned or made on 11/21.

I will say one good thing is that CB had voice contact with her daughter on Thanksgiving and that KB was seen that day. I for one would not believe the date of death if not for solid facts like that with the games these two played with evidence, phones, cars, etc. And with no body, there would be no way to determine time of death. I also still believe, however, the date of final death could be later than said as well but I am not sold on that thought.

In a case where almost all of the sights seen and dates and times come from the two involved who are known liars, it makes it difficult.

All speculation on my part and I certainly could be wrong.

BBM. I agree.

It is going to be difficult and I fear KB and her family aren't going to receive justice they deserve. I think the deal with KK has made their chances worse, not better. The DA didn't need KK. It was the Berreths who discovered the blood and LE had the cell phone data and KK's lies to LE. That would have been enough to remove baby K from his care and get PF arrested.

JMO

 

[MassGuy]

Did you super sleuthers conclude that there's a good chance there is highway camera or other CCT evidence documenting KKL's drive to Colorado and back to Idaho? I remember a lot of discussion about that many threads ago after the info came out about KKL driving her friend's car to clean up "her mess." However, I can't remember the outcome of the discussion. That kind of evidence about the dates of her travel would be indisputable, IMO.

It’s possible.

I’m thinking that phone pings will be the biggest form of evidence.

If she stopped at a gas station though, there would be footage and receipts to prove it.

She would have paid cash (probably), but her statement to law enforcement would have included details that would help them prove her alibi.

She lied previously. They’d need proof that she wasn’t doing it again.

 

[MyBelle]

Did you super sleuthers conclude that there's a good chance there is highway camera or other CCT evidence documenting KKL's drive to Colorado and back to Idaho? I remember a lot of discussion about that many threads ago after the info came out about KKL driving her friend's car to clean up "her mess." However, I can't remember the outcome of the discussion. That kind of evidence about the dates of her travel would be indisputable, IMO.

I'm not aware of any toll roads on the route which is where such cameras would be.

JMO

 

[Seattle1]

I didn’t mean to imply that it’s possible she was there that day. My memory’s failing right now, but I want to say we’ve seen evidence/documents saying she wasn’t.

Yes, and there's also much evidence when KK left Idaho with MG black VW, and when she arrived PF's gate to collect keys to KB's townhome.

There were also several individuals interviewed (including KK's dad) about KK's demeanor on 11/22 after she received call from PF requesting she come clean up a mess. I don't believe the real cowboys here would be willing to provide false information to LE. That falls right with KK. MOO

 

[MyBelle]

How convenient is all I have to say. Who does that without a reason? Just saying...

Of course! Turning off the location capability is one of the first things a domestic violence shelter does and then they supply the victim with a burner phone. At least that's what they did in 2013 when someone I know fled to a shelter.

JMO

 

[Sillybilly]

What is it that members do not understand about sleuthing PF's family?

Next person to do so will receive a 7 day thread reply ban.

 

[MyBelle]

You left out a ton of evidence there, but it’s definitely a lot to type.

The only way one can make a case against KK, is to ignore that evidence, shift the timeline, and basically hate her until she somehow becomes a killer.

I think she’s vile, but the facts don’t change. The evidence is the evidence.

If she ain’t there, she ain’t there.

The fact that they are searching the dump, is not evidence that law enforcement believes she wasn’t burned.

They believe she was, and her remains are now at the dump.

Whole bodies end up in landfills, so do burned and dismembered ones.

Can you cite some links about burned and dismembered bodies showing up at landfills? Because it makes absolutely no sense that a body is burned to destroy evidence and then placed in a location which can be successfully searched.

I'm pretty sure LE is at the landfill to try to provide evidence to support KK's version of events. If KB isn't at the landfill it is because she was never at the landfill.

JMO

 

[bonjoviblonde]

ITAWY. There is nothing but KK's accusations and lies.

Do you think PF is innocent?

 

[Steelhead]

If PF told his ex-girlfriend that he knew where to hide a body if needed, then why didn't she ask him where that place would be??? That's the first question I would've asked him! Then, I would've immediately wrote it down and hid it somewhere in case I went missing!

Sad part is, even if she had asked, I don't think he would have told her that it would be in a landfill. Which makes me lose a little hope of them finding KB in one.

 

[GordianKnot]

BBM. I agree.

It is going to be difficult and I fear KB and her family aren't going to receive justice they deserve. I think the deal with KK has made their chances worse, not better. The DA didn't need KK. It was the Berreths who discovered the blood and LE had the cell phone data and KK's lies to LE. That would have been enough to remove baby K from his care and get PF arrested.

JMO

If the DA didn't need KK, he wouldn't have had any reason whatsoever to make a deal with her. That flies in the face of all logic.

It isn't enough to just get PF arrested. The DA needs a conviction, not just an arrest.
PF needs to go away forever.

As things stand right now, this is a no-body case.
Cell phone data alone would never be enough to guarantee a conviction against PF, especially given the fact that KB's phone data had the phone traveling to Idaho, when PF was in CO.

Blood evidence is helpful, but if it's just KB's blood in that townhome, that's not enough to secure a conviction against PF.

And PF ain't talking. So somebody else needs to....fortunately for Dan May, KK has a big mouth.

KK's testimony is absolutely critical to securing a conviction in this case.

It is KK alone who can and will testify to PF's calling her to tell her she needed to get her keister to CO because she had a mess to clean up."

It is KK alone who can and will testify to the scene she walked into at KB's townhome when she went to clean up PF's bloody mess.

It is KK alone who can testify to the bonfire at the Frazee ranch and the burning of the black tote which is purported to have contained KB's body.

It is KK alone who can and will testify to the multiple solicitations that PF made of her, and the specific plans he asked her to execute, e.g. poison Starbucks, baseball bat attack, etc.

The DA clearly thinks that KK's testimony is critical to securing a conviction with PF.

He's right.

JMO.

 

[Trocroc9]

If PF told his ex-girlfriend that he knew where to hide a body if needed, then why didn't she ask him where that place would be??? That's the first question I would've asked him! Then, I would've immediately wrote it down and hid it somewhere in case I went missing!

Sad part is, even if she had asked, I don't think he would have told her that it would be in a landfill. Which makes me lose a little hope of them finding KB in one.

I have a feeling PF’s older friend may know where KB is located.

 

[MassGuy]

Can you cite some links about burned and dismembered bodies showing up at landfills? Because it makes absolutely no sense that a body is burned to destroy evidence and then placed in a location which can be successfully searched.

I'm pretty sure LE is at the landfill to try to provide evidence to support KK's version of events. If KB isn't at the landfill it is because she was never at the landfill.

JMO

The body was burned to destroy what could be destroyed. Throwing the remains in the trash, actually isn’t the worst idea in the world.

This moron just didn’t think KK would rat him out.

That, or they found other evidence that indicates that’s what he did with her.

Dismembered bodies are usually found in dumpsters, and not found once they reach the landfill.

Dismembered body found in landfill identified as missing West Virginia | Atlanta: News, Weather and Traffic

 

[ilovechili]

It’s possible.

I’m thinking that phone pings will be the biggest form of evidence.

If she stopped at a gas station though, there would be footage and receipts to prove it.

She would have paid cash (probably), but her statement to law enforcement would have included details that would help them prove her alibi.

She lied previously. They’d need proof that she wasn’t doing it again.

That long after the fact you think the footage would still necessarily exist? And that she saved a receipt that they have?

 

[SandyQLS]

Do you think PF is innocent?

I think PF will get a hung jury.