CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #50 *ARREST*

[nwmouse]

Apologies to all the moles out there for the unkind comparison to KK.
Y'all are much cuter than she is.

JMO.

Thank you...from all the mole-people.

 

[MsBetsy]

Or it is powerful evidence she doesn't want to talk to anyone. Adults can disappear themselves and many have done it which is why LE hesitates to get involved right away. KK's use of KB's cellphone was intended to delay LE getting involved and it worked.

JMO

How could it be interpreted as "powerful evidence she doesn't want to talk to anyone?"
Her last message indicated that she intended to make sweet potato casserole for PF, telling him if he wanted pecans to pick them up.
Earlier she discussed Thanksgiving plans and Christmas shopping with her mother. She talked about plans to get a tree.
All cell phone communication ceased after that. PF was seen last at her door at around 3:30 that day. Her cell phone travelled with him for the next two days. Kelsey was never seen or heard from again.
How would the jury interpret that as disappearing herself?

 

[nwmouse]

How could it be interpreted as "powerful evidence she doesn't want to talk to anyone?"
Her last message indicated that she intended to make sweet potato casserole for PF, telling him if he wanted pecans to pick them up.
Earlier she discussed Thanksgiving plans and Christmas shopping with her mother. She talked about plans to get a tree.
All cell phone communication ceased after that. PF was seen last at her door at around 3:30 that day. Her cell phone travelled with him for the next two days. Kelsey was never seen or heard from again.
How would the jury interpret that as disappearing herself?

Unless you're an ex green beret or in the Witness Protection Program its hard for anyone to disappear. Especially with a baby they adore, the need for money to pay for food, gas etc.
Its ludicrous to even think that someone like KB just decided to disappear into the wilderness like Ted K.

moo

 

[MemPat]

How could it be interpreted as "powerful evidence she doesn't want to talk to anyone?"
Her last message indicated that she intended to make sweet potato casserole for PF, telling him if he wanted pecans to pick them up.
Earlier she discussed Thanksgiving plans and Christmas shopping with her mother. She talked about plans to get a tree.
All cell phone communication ceased after that. PF was seen last at her door at around 3:30 that day. Her cell phone travelled with him for the next two days. Kelsey was never seen or heard from again.
How would the jury interpret that as disappearing herself?

Since she didn't take her car or her purse, she's on foot and hasn't bought food since November. I guess this would be the suicide PF planned after all?

 

[dixiegirl1035]

He returned to her house after he claims he last saw her.

He leaves with her phone.

If a jury is willing to discount the lies, the fake texts and phone calls, and the fact that Kelsey’s phone is at the same location as PF’s during this two day time period, then God bless them.

Lies mean something.

Cell phone data means something.

CCTV footage means something.

Deception means something.

If a juror wants to believe that KB was alive after the afternoon of the 22nd, they have to discount evidence to do that.

It’s there, and it would take willful ignorance to ignore it.

Another request. Do I have your permission to copy paste this one too in the future?

 

[mtnlites]

Unless you're an ex green beret or in the Witness Protection Program its hard for anyone to disappear. Especially with a baby they adore, the need for money to pay for food, gas etc.
Its ludicrous to even think that someone like KB just decided to disappear into the wilderness like Ted K.

moo

Ha ha, for me too. As in I can't even entertain that idea with a straight face-and I live in an area where adults DO come to live off-grid or "disappear" for a while. It is virtually impossible for adults to actually disappear for long periods of time without SOME sign that they did so: large chunk of money taken out of bank account; provisions made for housing or pets left behind; evidence of some kind of communication to friends, family, or co-workers; computer search engine history on a particular place or transportation options; etc. It's easy enough to "disappear" for a few days, even a week, but for a long period of time virtually impossible without some kind of evidence giving you up. Even without all those things, this isn't the movies. In real life people have to stop for gas, eat, buy diapers, and have actual cash to support their travels.

 

[nwmouse]

Ha ha, for me too. As in I can't even entertain that idea with a straight face-and I live in an area where adults DO come to live off-grid or "disappear" for a while. It is virtually impossible for adults to actually disappear for long periods of time without SOME sign that they did so: large chunk of money taken out of bank account; provisions made for housing or pets left behind; evidence of some kind of communication to friends, family, or co-workers; computer search engine history on a particular place or transportation options; etc. It's easy enough to "disappear" for a few days, even a week, but for a long period of time virtually impossible without some kind of evidence giving you up. Even without all those things, this isn't the movies. In real life people have to stop for gas, eat, buy diapers, and have actual cash to support their travels.

Plus there are cameras everywhere, as well as the public who follow cases like this and are on the look-out.

Surely they would have spotted 110 pound civilian Kelsey Berreth whose face has been plastered everywhere?

Nope, no way she could survive off-grid as a civilian without special training.
Its a silly conspiracy theory that defies all logic in this case, imho.

I'm more inclined to believe the moon-landings were faked (and I don't) than KB deciding to move off grid without her child, parents, friends, money, credit cards, gps, survival equipment or a vehicle. In winter.

moo

 

[MyBelle]

How could it be interpreted as "powerful evidence she doesn't want to talk to anyone?"
Her last message indicated that she intended to make sweet potato casserole for PF, telling him if he wanted pecans to pick them up.
Earlier she discussed Thanksgiving plans and Christmas shopping with her mother. She talked about plans to get a tree.
All cell phone communication ceased after that. PF was seen last at her door at around 3:30 that day. Her cell phone travelled with him for the next two days. Kelsey was never seen or heard from again.
How would the jury interpret that as disappearing herself?

The jury will want evidence PF is responsible for KB's disappearance and also her murder. PF didn't end up with KB's cell phone, it was in KK's possession.

Not answering a phone isn't evidence of a crime. It certainly isn't evidence of death. And her phone didn't cease communication. Her mother received additional text as did PF and KB's employer.

JMO

 

[MemPat]

Ha ha, for me too. As in I can't even entertain that idea with a straight face-and I live in an area where adults DO come to live off-grid or "disappear" for a while. It is virtually impossible for adults to actually disappear for long periods of time without SOME sign that they did so: large chunk of money taken out of bank account; provisions made for housing or pets left behind; evidence of some kind of communication to friends, family, or co-workers; computer search engine history on a particular place or transportation options; etc. It's easy enough to "disappear" for a few days, even a week, but for a long period of time virtually impossible without some kind of evidence giving you up. Even without all those things, this isn't the movies. In real life people have to stop for gas, eat, buy diapers, and have actual cash to support their travels.

And this is a woman whose picture has been in the media all over the world.
Someone would have seen her.

 

[nwmouse]

How could it be interpreted as "powerful evidence she doesn't want to talk to anyone?"
Her last message indicated that she intended to make sweet potato casserole for PF, telling him if he wanted pecans to pick them up.
Earlier she discussed Thanksgiving plans and Christmas shopping with her mother. She talked about plans to get a tree.
All cell phone communication ceased after that. PF was seen last at her door at around 3:30 that day. Her cell phone travelled with him for the next two days. Kelsey was never seen or heard from again.
How would the jury interpret that as disappearing herself?

Furthermore, the winter in CO/ID/MO/WY/ND/SD is brutal.

Hard to survive in such low temps, especially for a 110 pound female with no specialist survival training.

Is it possible she hired a private jet that she flew (as a pilot) and had a ton of cash to pay for it without a credit card, a false ID and a fake flight-plan and flitted off to enjoy a sunny Florida winter?

Highly unlikely.

She disappeared because she was murdered.

I think the DA will prove she was murdered by PF and that KK will corroborate this as she copped a plea deal.

This is not a reach, its just logic put forward by many WS members.
imho. moo.

 

[jewelsmac]

The jury will want evidence PF is responsible for KB's disappearance and also her murder. PF didn't end up with KB's cell phone, it was in KK's possession.

Not answering a phone isn't evidence of a crime. It certainly isn't evidence of death. And her phone didn't cease communication. Her mother received additional text as did PF and KB's employer.

JMO

Didn’t he have her phone for a couple of days which is why there’s evidence of it traveling around in the same areas with his phone before it made its trek to Idaho?

 

[jewelsmac]

I’ve been wondering about her car keys. I realize it’s a small detail, but I was re-watching the dateline special when they were talking about that her car keys were missing but her cars were there. Why would they take her car keys?

 

[Hatch]

You're not a junior anything!
Do you know who sells scented candles? Gee, I wonder about that. KB's friends? It doesn't seem that PF bought any at Walmart, and the SW executions do not report any. Hmmm, I am stumped. JMO

I do not believe we had a report of everything that was taken out of KB condo. The whole candle scenario , I am skeptical about until we know LE confiscated candles. IMO since that is supposedly an event that took place right before PF struck KB with a bat, I think that definitely would of been on their list of items to look for, but not necessarily in the SW.( DA may be holding that info on the QT).

If the candle scene actually took place, IMO that would point to KB and PF perhaps having a romantic moment with lit candles. PF most likely would not have revealed that info to KK as such but mentioned candles in his own version of prior events to the bat being used. ( But then there is the sweater story also.)

If there was lit candles burning prior to the murder perhaps there is some blood spatter in one of them, I would assume PF would of blown them out prior to leaving the condo , a spatter of blood perhaps embedded in the wax.

I doubt we will ever know exactly what happened the minutes or seconds before PF commenced to murder KB.

I cannot see PF confessing details to clear his conscience as CW did as heart wrenching and sickening as that was to hear.

IMO CBI and LE collaborated everything KK told them.
That would include candles being in the condo, unless PF placed them in the tote.

I am a fence sitter on the candle story at this point, because that info outsiders have not been privy to.
Junior Sleuther no doubt.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

The jury will want evidence < respectfully snipped>

PF didn't end up with KB's cell phone

<snip>

Law enforcement has given me enough information to believe that he had her phone for a couple of days.

I think that is logical.

What are your logical thoughts on the phone pings together for two days?

 

[jewelsmac]

I feel like the candles have become this week’s cinnamon rolls. Who’s to say he ever had candles ..ever. Perhaps he walked in with the bag that didn’t contain candles ..but he said it did.

The point is is he blind folded her, that’s what’s being said.

And she trusted him enough to let him.

 

[MemPat]

I’ve been wondering about her car keys. I realize it’s a small detail, but I was re-watching the dateline special when they were talking about that her car keys were missing but her cars were there. Why would they take her car keys?

I think you can refer back to MG's "Dumbass" post for that answer.

 

[MyBelle]

Actually, it is evidence.

And the prosecutor will hopefully weed out potential jurors and have peremptory challenges for people who do not understand such legal facts of the court and trial.

Moo

Respectfully, that is your opinion.
We'll agree to disagree.

 

[MemPat]

I do not believe we had a report of everything that was taken out of KB condo. The whole candle scenario , I am skeptical about until we know LE confiscated candles. IMO since that is supposedly an event that took place right before PF struck KB with a bat, I think that definitely would of been on their list of items to look for, but not necessarily in the SW.( DA may be holding that info on the QT).

If the candle scene actually took place, IMO that would point to KB and PF perhaps having a romantic moment with lit candles. PF most likely would not have revealed that info to KK as such but mentioned candles in his own version of prior events to the bat being used. ( But then there is the sweater story also.)

If there was lit candles burning prior to the murder perhaps there is some blood spatter in one of them, I would assume PF would of blown them out prior to leaving the condo , a spatter of blood perhaps embedded in the wax.

I doubt we will ever know exactly what happened the minutes or seconds before PF commenced to murder KB.

I cannot see PF confessing details to clear his conscience as CW did as heart wrenching and sickening as that was to hear.

IMO CBI and LE collaborated everything KK told them.
That would include candles being in the condo, unless PF placed them in the tote.

I am a fence sitter on the candle story at this point, because that info outsiders have not been privy to.
Junior Sleuther no doubt.

Surely these two dummies would have thought to throw the candles into the tote since they would have his fingerprints all over them and they would burn well. Surely.

 

[jewelsmac]

I think you can refer back to MG's "Dumbass" post for that answer.

Yes I feel we should create a flow chart in which all questions about PF lead to a box marked “dumbass”

 

[MassGuy]

Yes I feel we should create a flow chart in which all questions about PF lead to a box marked “dumbass”

Haaaa. It’s rare to have a case like this, where the killer’s very efforts to misdirect law enforcement, end up making their case for them.

The digital evidence is so extensive, that it cannot be explained away.

It’s quite impressive.

For his next trick, PF will manage to cast a vote against himself at trial.