CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #50 *ARREST*

[dixiegirl1035]

Nah apparently some believe that May only wanted to have SF testify to bring up charges of Illegal burning against SF based on evidence and witness testimony that PF had done himself. Apparently the DA was unethical bc he has no intentions of trying to prove a timeline of events and or possible crimes against PF. And apparently some have the opinion that they know that the judge was thinking it was unethical, Even though the judge stated in his own words that now was not the time. Apparently we are suppose to believe that PF preliminary hearing was a scheme by May to bring charges against SF for Illegal burning.

MOO is that May was merely trying to prove that PF had lied about his whereabouts on thanksgiving and that he wanted SF to say that there was a fire at the Franch......

The judge said ahh thats not necessary mr May you have plenty of evidence and witness testimony to hold PF over for trial....MOO

My MOO is that May was telling everybody in the community and anybody that was watching, that folks will do anything to cover for family?.

Whether it be her testifying and clarifying Thanksgiving arrival time for sit down dinner with or without the sweet potato casserole without pecans...( and she agrees with her son who is a law enforcement officer who said his brother arrived after 2:30, and perhaps described what was brought for dinner)

 

[dixiegirl1035]

It's my opinion that is the reason for the judge's decision. The DA KNEW it wasn't the time or place.

Actually, I agree!

And I think it was a fabulous move to Telegraph what is going on with the people involved in that family.


It is absolutely ethical in my opinion. And absolutely extremely strategic and I loved it!

It just shows that May is going to do anything to expose ANYBODY in the family that tries to cover up. In my opinion.

Thank you for bringing up something which many of us have forgotten!

 

[OldLadyBlues]

Yeah. We are all hoping for the same thing, that Kelsey’s family can recover as much of her body as possible.

Looking at this logically, I think the reality here, is something along the lines of what we hope for.

It’s always dangerous to conflate hope with reality, but I don’t think we’re doing that.

As you say, he is impatient and “special,” and coupled with the time it would have taken, I don’t think he was able to achieve what he hoped to achieve.

There may be a lot to recover.

My point of reference in fires such as these is from a local murder of a 4 year old foster child by his foster parents and a second female. They tried to incinerate him in an outdoor fireplace situation and no matter what they did, they couldn't keep the fire hot enough, long enough. When he was finally found, quite a bit was left to their horror. I am SO hoping this is the case here.
These were 3 similarly "special" idiots as well with the foster couple getting life, the second woman getting off on a plea agreement.

 

[ab01]

Actually, I agree!

And I think it was a fabulous move to Telegraph what is going on with the people involved in that family.


It is absolutely ethical in my opinion. And absolutely extremely strategic and I loved it!

It just shows that May is going to do anything to expose ANYBODY in the family that tries to cover up. In my opinion.

Thank you for bringing up something which many of us have forgotten!

I agree the DA definitely had an angle and I believe that angle was to say ahhh ok, we can't make her testify to things your son did in a preliminary hearing. But when trial comes, are you going to lie on the stand or bite your tongue and make the judge force you to answer certain questions.

Nothing unethical at all!

The line in the sand has been drawn IMO

 

[MassGuy]

My point of reference in fires such as these is from a local murder of a 4 year old foster child by his foster parents and a second female. They tried to incinerate him in an outdoor fireplace situation and no matter what they did, they couldn't keep the fire hot enough, long enough. When he was finally found, quite a bit was left to their horror. I am SO hoping this is the case here.
These were 3 similarly "special" idiots as well with the foster couple getting life, the second woman getting off on a plea agreement.

That’s horiffic.

There’s a couple things in particular, that make me think that the situation is similar here.

The relatively short amount of time he allegedly burned her body.

The fact that clumps of plastic were found, but apparently no bones.

If she was incinerated to the point of small bone fragments, I would have expected some to be found with that plastic.

If she wasn’t burned to that point, it would make sense, as he’d be able to easily dispose of a burned, but not (completely) destroyed body.

 

[GordianKnot]

Extremely interesting information. Prior to WS, I never knew there was a pattern used to unload garbage at a landfill. With this company’s knowledge, this is LEs best chance at recovery.

I completely agree with you.

Back on Feb. 23rd, I posted the following:

Despite the overwhelming odds against it, I have the quiet conviction that what remains of KB's remains will be found.

Miracles do happen.

The information PommyMommy provided about NecroSearch's operation merely affirmed my pre-existing belief:

KB's remains will be found.

JMO.

 

[GordianKnot]

I agree the DA definitely had an angle and I believe that angle was to say ahhh ok, we can't make her testify to things her son did in a preliminary hearing. But when trial comes, is she going to lie on the stand or bite her tongue and make the judge force her to answer certain questions.

Nothing unethical at all!

The line in the sand has been drawn IMO

Yes.

What DA May did at that hearing was to fire a shot across the bow at Ma F.

She's been put on notice. He's going to be gunning for her on the stand.

JMO.

 

[susiQ]

Actually, I agree!

And I think it was a fabulous move to Telegraph what is going on with the people involved in that family.


It is absolutely ethical in my opinion. And absolutely extremely strategic and I loved it!

It just shows that May is going to do anything to expose ANYBODY in the family that tries to cover up. In my opinion.

Thank you for bringing up something which many of us have forgotten!

^THIS^!! I remember when that part of the preliminary was tweeted thinking what a freakin' genius DA May is, and how SF was NEVER going to get baby K, EVER. People who need to plead the 5th, have something to hide and I doubt ANY judge would ever give that precious child to someone who has something to hide. Baby K is safe and exactly where she should remain during her formative years. SF can kiss her hopes of ever having custody "good-bye!"

 

[dixiegirl1035]

^THIS^!! I remember when that part of the preliminary was tweeted thinking what a freakin' genius DA May is, and how SF was NEVER going to get baby K, EVER. People who need to plead the 5th, have something to hide and I doubt ANY judge would ever give that precious child to someone who has something to hide. Baby K is safe and exactly where she should remain during her formative years. SF can kiss her hopes of ever having custody "good-bye!"

And it could be communicating something to the lawyers who are involved in the civil case. But I will leave that there.

 

[acutename]

I believe if SF is called to testify she won’t be able to just simply plead the fifth to all questions. Say if the prosecution asks her when PF arrived at certain times etc, the judge can force her to answer certain questions unless it would incriminate herself. Moo

Generally the prosecution plays to that, and sometimes what the witness doesn’t say can be as damming as what they do say. For example I don’t recall etc.

I think she could be held in contempt of court....

 

[acutename]

SF knows that baby K was with PF exclusively from Nov. 22 on. She knows that there was a fire on her property on Nov. 24. She also knows that PF was late for dinner on Nov. 22 and arrived with baby K but not KB. Lastly, she is one of many who did not pick up the phone and call LE, which may be one of those immoral but not illegal things. SF has information. But I'm not seeing that she has committed or participated in an actual crime. IANAL, but I think she can be called to testify, and held in contempt of court if she fails to do so, or charged with perjury if she lies. And I really don't think the prosecution needs her testimony, so I think they will be weighing whether it is worth the aggravation to call her. MOO

maybe she knows or does not know something about the teeth

 

[OldLadyBlues]

That’s horiffic.

There’s a couple things in particular, that make me think that the situation is similar here.

The relatively short amount of time he allegedly burned her body.

The fact that clumps of plastic were found, but apparently no bones.

If she was incinerated to the point of small bone fragments, I would have expected some to be found with that plastic.

If she wasn’t burned to that point, it would make sense, as he’d be able to easily dispose of a burned, but not (completely) destroyed body.

There ya go!

 

[acutename]

BBM. It's really quite simple. The DA wanted to ask SF about an alleged fire on her property. Open burning of waste (such as plastic) has been illegal in Colorado for years. SF is the owner of the property which is why her attorney told the judge she would invoke the 5th.

JMO

is the prohibited open burning criminal or a civil administrative violation?

 

[OldLadyBlues]

@MassGuy, want more similarities? After these idiots found too many remains of the child, they bagged them up and dropped them in the river from a high bridge.
This case haunts me and KBs gets way too close to it....enough to make me have to step away quite a bit. These cases possess a certain kind of evil that goes beyond comprehension and always seem to involve truly innocent people. IMHO

 

[acutename]

It seems to me that if I had been in PF's shoes (which I wasn't, thankfully) I wouldn't dispose of the remains at any of the places I tell KK about. Why take the potential extra risk?

I think LE has corroborating evidence of some sort that it is the landfill.

any chance they have video of one of his vehicles at or near the landfill?

 

[acutename]

I think LE is also looking for the items KK claims she threw away.

JMO

was there anything she separately "threw away," or was everything transported to the ranch to be burned?

 

[acutename]

It is your SPECULATION that SF knew a dead body was being burned on her property. She hasn't been named a POI or a suspect and I seriously doubt PF told her he was burning a dead human being.

The open-burning of toxic materials has been law in Colorado for quite some time. Didn't realize a link would be demanded. Here ya go:

What materials are not allowed to be burned?Tree stumps, tires, chemicals, plastic, cut lumber, construction debris , trash. Burning of these materials produces pollution that is harmful to the environment and the health of you and your neighbors

https://www.colorado.gov/pacific/sites/default/files/AP_OB_Open-Burning-Fact-Sheet.pdf

it says : "a sizable civil penalty of up to $10,000..." ergo not a criminal penalty

 

[jewelsmac]

I may be missing something ,as I so often am, but I never thought for a second that they burned the evidence and the body down to ash.

Seen a lot of discussion about the size of the metal container that they used to burn, the accelerant used, how hot it has to burn etc, etc . I don’t think PF thought he would achieve a complete cremation. I’m not sure why anyone would think that would be possible in the time that they had.

In my opinion they were just trying to obliterate as much evidence as possible.... burned enough to get rid of the smallerv evidence and make disposing of KB’s body manageable.

The fact that the area was searched and there was little leftover tells me they achieved that goal. Or thought they did.

but PF had to dispose of the rest of the body, and I’m hoping there’s enough to make it obvious in the landfill. MOO

 

[acutename]

That’s horiffic.

There’s a couple things in particular, that make me think that the situation is similar here.

The relatively short amount of time he allegedly burned her body.

The fact that clumps of plastic were found, but apparently no bones.

If she was incinerated to the point of small bone fragments, I would have expected some to be found with that plastic.

If she wasn’t burned to that point, it would make sense, as he’d be able to easily dispose of a burned, but not (completely) destroyed body.

the remains would have been visible the next morning

 

[MemPat]

I may be missing something ,as I so often I am, but I never thought for a second that they burned the evidence and the body down to ash.

Seen a lot of discussion about the size of the metal container that they used to burn, the accelerant used, how hot it has to burn etc, etc . I don’t think PF thought he would achieve a complete cremation. I’m not sure why anyone would think that would be possible in the time that they had.

In my opinion they were just trying to obliterate as much evidence as possible.... burned enough to get rid of the smallerv evidence and make disposing of KB’s body manageable.

The fact that the area was searched and there was little leftover tells me they achieved that goal. Or thought they did.

but PF had to dispose of the rest of the body, and I’m hoping there’s enough to make it obvious in the landfill. MOO

We can only hope PF googled how long it would take to cremate someone!

That stooge thought he was going to convince KK to take the body with her and dump it away from there if I remember correctly, so he probably went into the body-burning plan half-cocked.

After reading MG's piece about the body recovery success rate I'm feeling good about the chances of it happening for the Berreths.

The fact that so much time was taken to coordinate a plan increases my confidence.

How will we celebrate on WS when that news hits the airwaves?! Sonic for everyone!