CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #51 *ARREST*

[OldLadyBlues]

Wow!

Breaking:

New documents obtained by prosecutors in the Kelsey Berreth murder case could corroborate accusations by her fiancee and his lover that she harmed their young daughter.

It is unknown whether Frazee spoke with social workers about suspected abuse before Berreth disappeared. But the human services reports could support Lee’s statement about the motive – – to kill Berreth to protect their baby.

Kelsey Berreth murder case: Patrick Frazee claims Berreth abused daughter

So how else are you going to put a perfectly sympathetic victim on trial? My kids grew up with knots on their heads as they were learning to walk. And a burn can be a carpet or upholstery burn. IMHO, this is just the first attempt to make KB look bad.
Moo, Moo

 

[PommyMommy]

Thanks, PommyMommy, I had just left a sentence unfinished. I believe the great amount of blood under those floorboards helped make the case for murder.

Gotcha. Thanks for clarifying.

 

[MassGuy]

So how else are you going to put a perfectly sympathetic victim on trial? My kids grew up with knots on their heads as they were learning to walk. And a burn can be a carpet or upholstery burn. IMHO, this is just the first attempt to make KB look bad.
Moo, Moo

This is simply a poorly written article that was discussing that new court document today.

The gist of the document is that DHS investigated child abuse allegations at some point in the past.

It is my belief that these allegations were lies from PF.

We’ll have to wait until trial, but reading between the lines (no action taken by authorities), it is my belief that they found nothing.

What could prove big, is PF’s testimony during that investigation.

If I know PF like I think I know PF, he told more lies than we will be able to count.

He may have shot himself in the foot.

Again.

 

[PommyMommy]

Daniela Leon on Twitter
The search for #KelseyBerreth continues. Today @PoliceWoodland were treated to food as they continue to search a landfill for her remains. #patrickfrazee is due back in court next Friday.

 

[MassGuy]

Daniela Leon on Twitter
The search for #KelseyBerreth continues. Today @PoliceWoodland were treated to food as they continue to search a landfill for her remains. #patrickfrazee is due back in court next Friday.

Can you just imagine?

Spending hours digging through rotting filth, and then eating bbq!

I’ll bet these poor searchers took it home.

 

[NanZDrew]

CBS has asked to be supplied with a court transcript (from the preliminary hearing).

Court has yet to respond, but I think we’d all welcome having access to that.

Tweets are good, but the actual transcript is a hell of a lot better.

https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/04th_Judicial_District/Teller/caseofinterest/2018CR330/002/Transcrip Request CBS.pdf

I agree about the original being better. On the tweets, some things I thought were interesting from the arrest warrants were not mentioned and gave far more insight.

 

[kkdj]

I agree she poisoned the coffee imo
who in their right mind would tell LE you did such a thing . suddenly attempted murder charges are coming your way on a side note......

I absolutely think she poisoned the coffee.....otherwise, why did she bring it really? There was no other reason except to poison her. But, the DA can't prove it cause it's gone....so her little lie about her goodness (not being able to poison it...cough!) was released. jmo

 

[OldLadyBlues]

This is simply a poorly written article that was discussing that new court document today.

The gist of the document is that DHS investigated child abuse allegations at some point in the past.

It is my belief that these allegations were lies from PF.

We’ll have to wait until trial, but reading between the lines (no action taken by authorities), it is my belief that they found nothing.

What could prove big, is PF’s testimony during that investigation.

If I know PF like I think I know PF, he told more lies than we will be able to count.

He may have shot himself in the foot.

Again.

You're giving PF way too much credit, MG, at still having a foot to shoot.
When you have substantial lies being told about any sympathetic victim, you know as well as I do that you throw anything at the wall to see what will stick. Child abuse is like the crescendo that makes anyone stop and think. All I'm saying is I'm not surprised it was alleged and I look forward to hearing a lot more about it because it's like a dramatic courtroom show stopper, if you will.
MOO, MOO

 

[Charlot123]

I don't know who killed KB, PF, probably. But KK, what a horrible human being, to drive from ID to clean the mess. Can you imagine? I would not do it for a person who killed an animal, a bird, much less, a human.
He should go to prison, forever, as DP is a moot point these days. But KK's story and face should be known everywhere. She is true co-conspirator. It is sickening.

 

[NanZDrew]

Which is part of my point if the prosucution are relying on custrody as PF's motive it's weak there is no body & PF being a planner had all the time in the world to take KB to court not kill her. He loved the child, i think they both did that wasnt the problem. The problem was the re introduction of KK into his life .... I hate to say it because until we hear his defence we are all in the dark, but it sounds more likley a case of Fatel Attraction and the framing of PF.

Exactly. It is an interpretation of this document.

It goes to motive, and appears to involve statements by PF, “the defendant.”

Kelsey didn’t lose custody, so it appears that no action was taken.

I believe the accusations to be false.

https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/04th_Judicial_District/Teller/caseofinterest/2018CR330/002/P-9 People's Notice of Department of Human Services Records in the District Attorney's Possession and Motion for Disclosure and Protective Order.pdf

Agree with you, MG. I believe the accusations to be false and were setting the stage and his alibi for what was to come. His lack of understanding technology, and telling others was his downfall. Some of his planning was clever. It is a bit frightening at how long and intense his planning of this crime was. He was very obsessed with murdering Kelsey and seemed to get off on the planning of it. I think it had nothing to do with KK. It was all about some reason, possibly not even rational, that he had begun to HATE KB. Maybe jealousy, maybe because he knew that she didn't love him anymore. I really don't think she did. I think she was trapped and terrified by him. She tried to make it work, because she most likely couldn't leave CO without complications due to custody. Seeing the lengths that he went to in order to set this up makes me think she suffered intense emotional abuse. He probably told her that he would get custody of the baby because she was mentally unstable. I think she really went through it, and all of the people that loved her were far away. It hurts my heart to think how she probably suffered long before he killed her.

 

[Sillybilly]

Thread is closed for review.

Check back later.

 

[Sillybilly]

Thread is open again.

This thread is dedicated to discussing Kelsey's case. Two entire pages of posts had to be removed.

Please do not derail the discussion by making posts all about you or other members.

If there are posts that are of concern, use the Report feature to let WS staff know and let us handle it.

 

[MassGuy]

I don't know who killed KB, PF, probably. But KK, what a horrible human being, to drive from ID to clean the mess. Can you imagine? I would not do it for a person who killed an animal, a bird, much less, a human.
He should go to prison, forever, as DP is a moot point these days. But KK's story and face should be known everywhere. She is true co-conspirator. It is sickening.

Agreed. All we can really hope for now is that PF gets life, and KK receives the max sentence, small as it is.

Public condemnation will be loud, especially when everyone hears what she did.

A lot of people know about this case, but I’d be willing to bet there are many people who have not.

They will.

 

[NanZDrew]

I’m thinking last summer, just prior to August.

If that’s the case, then everything makes complete sense.

Failed effort to get sole custody, followed by solicitation, culminating in murder.

My guess as well. Wasn't it August that KB sought treatment for depression and anxiety? Also, I have heard that depression is a flag in custody cases. CPS gets a little worried about the child with a parent going through depression. Wonder if he was using this to his advantage.

 

[MassGuy]

My guess as well. Wasn't it August that KB sought treatment for depression and anxiety? Also, I have heard that depression is a flag in custody cases. CPS gets a little worried about the child with a parent going through depression. Wonder if he was using this to his advantage.

I’m sure he was using everything to his advantage.

I’m very curious as to the lies he told, and what DHS concluded.

We’ll just have to wait for that answer.

 

[NanZDrew]

I believe we've been down this road.

What parent cannot relate to what was previously recounted by KB.

A toddler with an alleged bump does not always constitute actionable "child abuse."

A toddler allegedly touching a curling iron (hand burn) does not always constitute actionable "child abuse."

It can look good on paper for the defendant, until it's explained by investigator.

It's like a page out of Kramer vs Kramer (Billy falls on play ground).

MOO

Exactly, and she would have most likely just started walking and babies get plenty of bruises at that time period. PF certainly wouldn't be the first to make a false (or at least, exaggerated) report.

 

[GordianKnot]

I’m sure he was using everything to his advantage.

I’m very curious as to the lies he told, and what DHS concluded.

We’ll just have to wait for that answer.

Of course, we know that what DHS ultimately concluded was that Baby K. was better off with KB's parents in ID than with SF in CO at the ranchette, where she spent a considerable amount of her young life. There are likely some inferences that can be drawn from that.

But I know what you mean, and I agree that it will be interesting to see what DHS concluded r/t PF's allegations. These were not substantiated, of course.

It will be interesting to learn some day what PF's story was to DHS.

I suspect the whole genesis of his idea to make a false allegation to DHS was in that delivery room, when the hospital staff contacted DHS d/t his frightening outburst. He may have gotten the idea to call DHS himself to make an allegation on the basis of that experience and whatever ensued as a result.

JMO.

 

[ilovechili]

The prosecution is the one who found the accusations PF made against KB. The accusations were made in March, so that would suggest to me that something happened in March to set him off. I had thought it was August, since that was the date he first began asking KK to kill KB, but instead we find out it was in March.
If I remember correctly, PF had told people that KB undermined him with his child and he was upset about that. With the way PF plays his game, I wonder if something happened in March, maybe the baby was hurt or injured while she was in his care and KB became concerned about his ability to take care of the baby while KB was at work.
Has it been stated anywhere when the custody papers were originally filled out by PF? And what in the world happened in March?

Something did happen in March. That is the month KK told them she and PF rekindled their relationship. Interesting isn't it... However, that is simply my own individual opinion...

 

[MassGuy]

Something did happen in March. That is the month KK told them she and PF rekindled their relationship. Interesting isn't it... However, that is simply my own individual opinion...

The document was filed by the prosecution on March 20, 2019.

We don’t know when the DHS investigation occurred.

As PF began soliciting Kelsey’s murder around September, it stands to reason that DHS was involved prior to that.

 

[MemPat]

My guess as well. Wasn't it August that KB sought treatment for depression and anxiety? Also, I have heard that depression is a flag in custody cases. CPS gets a little worried about the child with a parent going through depression. Wonder if he was using this to his advantage.

I'm so amazed that depression would be a flag in a custody case as I doubt there are many parents who haven't experienced a period of depression and/or anxiety.

I'll go back and read but I thought KB spent only a day or two at the treatment center where she probably learned some basic techniques for self-healing and perhaps some tips on dealing with a manipulator.

I hope the court reports show files from the center and notes from the professionals there.

That might be our best window into the soul of the cowboy. MOO