CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #7

[Wsimm]

Excellent post! Both of my sons are in their 20’s....oldest KB’s age. My husband and an I advise to a fault as do many of our peers with their adult children. We are fixers, we are wise and know best practices....always (said, with much sarcasm)! I agree this could be a parent/adult child relationship where over sharing wasn’t occurring and yet I can’t help but think KB’s mother knows more than she’s letting on....more than LE wants her to share!

From what I read KB’s mother say, it sounds like PF had financial difficulties. I can see her breaking up with him over finances.

To elaborate on my previous post, as a 20-something, my mother likes to believe she is helpful when in reality, her helpful advice usually involves something toxic or judgmental on her part.

Many women within my age group find that their mothers also are prone to giving unwelcomed advice that is judgmental and borders on “toxic”. The less we talk openly with them, the better we get along with our mothers. I say this as someone who always graduated Summa Laude (highest honor) and never have given my mother a reason to “worry”. The situation tends get worse as we have children as I’ve seen many of my friends in their mid-late 30s (I live in a big city where 99% of women work and postpone parenthood) complain about their mothers or in-laws giving unsolicited parenting advice under the guise of being “helpful” and the worst offenders have been known to threaten calling CPS as a way to control them.

I’m actually married as well and my monster-in-law is less judgmental than my mother but much more controlling and we don’t even have children yet.

If friends or even past (or present) love interests are speaking privately to law enforcement, that would be very helpful as there are a lot of women in their 20s and 30s that aren’t on the best terms with their mothers or MILs and most of them would not think they have a less than ideal relationship with them. Many women just try to “keep the peace” with them.
Given this, if there are any siblings, cousins, co-workers, etc. they may have more information than a mother or MIL. Social media and texts should also be looked into and LE is likely covering that. I believe friends may speak out as there’s more national pressure on the case.

Honestly, many working women and moms of today might not see their friends as often as they wish. Her friends may truly be in the dark.

 

[Charlot123]

I'm not sure KB and her mom texted each other. I'm thinking they called each other and spoke on the phone. That's a hunch, not fact. It's easier to send a text from someone's phone pretending to be that person, but you can't fake a phone call - hence, mom wasn't contacted.

jmo, hunch

Sometimes it is difficult to fake a text, either. I need two words to verify if it comes from my kid.

 

[MassGuy]

Excellent post! Both of my sons are in their 20’s....oldest KB’s age. My husband and an I advise to a fault as do many of our peers with their adult children. We are fixers, we are wise and know best practices....always (said, with much sarcasm)! I agree this could be a parent/adult child relationship where over sharing wasn’t occurring and yet I can’t help but think KB’s mother knows more than she’s letting on....more than LE wants her to share!

More than LE wants her to share, and probably more than she wants to share as well.

I think there’s a bit of both going on here.

 

[LietKynes]

You are so right. KB must have seen his mother every time she picked up their baby or dropped her off. I don't see him smiling in that picture with KB either. This could be another Watts wife murder.

Also ---- If PF had another person on the side... wouldn't LE have disclosed that by now ? Maybe he wanted out ?

 

[LietKynes]

Wait, what?

Police contacted Berreth’s fiancé, Patrick Frazee, who said Berreth dropped off their daughter at his home on Nov. 22. The last time he says he heard from her was Nov. 25 and their child is still in his custody, according to detectives.

I hate to beat a dead horse, but did she drop the baby off or did PF pick her up?

Who knows ?
Part of the confusion may be the manner in which msm has reported this case.

 

[Deleted member 235367]

Long time reader. I think I’ve read through all the posts here in all 7 threads and I don’t know if this has been posted. He doesn’t seem creepy. Patrick Frazee

 

[Ccging]

So we know KB moved to Colorado in 2016. We don’t know when she met PF. From what I’ve seen her P.O. Box in Florissant was prior to her home purchase? With that in mind and knowing she put her property back into the family LLC what if she was intent on moving closer to work? From what her cousin said the reason she moved was for her dream job. I’m just thinking out loud, but the work commute had to start to wear on her (it would on a lot of people especially a new mom, it had to be hard). I’m just wondering if this was a strong point of contention between PF and KB possibly?

 

[Charlot123]

Also ---- If PF had another person on the side... wouldn't LE have disclosed that by now ? Maybe he wanted out ?

Out of what? They were not married. Didn't live together, had some parenting plan. I can bet there was no official engagement, either. I would bet they both were pursuing some romantic interests, in itself, it is not the reason for any drastic measures.

 

[LAHOLLA]

My oldest is 24. We don’t speak daily. We mostly text. We may not text daily but if I send him more than two unanswered texts, I’m going to wonder what’s up. If he finally replies and tells me he’s going to be MIA for a few, you know I’m going to call him to see what’s going on.

THere are just so many things that don’t add up.

 

[Inthedetails]

For all we know, despite what anyone thinks they know, maybe he was used to KB vanishing for days at a time without contacting anyone. Maybe she has personal issues that would drive this behavior.

Snipped by me.

If PF has experienced KB disappearing in the past, that would be super useful information for LE to know. If she has personal issues that might explain her disappearance, that also would be useful in the investigation. What's the point of not helping in the investigation to find her, if he has information and he is innocent?

LE describes the disappearance as suspicious. A family is in anguish over disappearance. A baby is without her mommy. And he says nothing.

Yes, his behavior doesn't match what people expect. That is true.

jmo

 

[1wonderleads2another]

Supposing that PF is innocent....

But On December 2 he had a very confrontational accusatory conversation with KB’s mom (moo)

Then during his initial interview with the police he was treated in a very accusatory manner and he told them everything he knows (assuming that he and KB were not close and the relationship was 99% coparenting) ....He literally could’ve told the police every single piece of information he has on KB (possibly not much) and they still might’ve been saying ‘well when you’re ready to talk son come to the station ‘ and ‘ when you’re ready to tell the truth we will be ready to speak to you’

If would be extremely frustrating And scary if you felt like you told LE everything ,even in a very short interview, and they didn’t believe you. Why go back in? Are you gonna sit there for five hours while they ask you the same three questions 2000 times?

Aka KBs mom AND police may have immediately accused him.

Then what ? if you are innocent PF? Especially if your LE Relatives and lawyer are telling you anything you do will make you look guilty so do as little as possible. They might’ve told him if he pled publicly for the return of his daughters mother he’ll look guilty ....if he post information about her disappearance on social media he’ll look guilty....

And let’s face it Even if he had pled for her return , posted like crazy on social media, hung 5000 flyers, plenty of people who think he’s guilty now would still think he was guilty

 

[MassGuy]

Long time reader. I think I’ve read through all the posts here in all 7 threads and I don’t know if this has been posted. He doesn’t seem creepy. Patrick Frazee

A lot of (potential) killers don’t seem “creepy.”

It’s by no means a requirement.

 

[Deleted member 169742]

Awesome thought!!!

I might spend a month looking her ... but I could get lucky

 

[Ccging]

I might spend a month looking her ... but I could get lucky

I’d try to find him first, if she was gone a lot and busy with work and he was caring for the baby he’d have more time to be alone and maybe start looking for someone new? KWIM? Just a thought....

 

[MyBelle]

I was wondering this also. And if she moved for her job initially why not move to Pueblo to be closer??

We haven't been told where KB lived prior to May, 2018 when the townhouse was purchased and I think we don't know because it is key to the investigation.
I think child care dictated where she lived. JMO

 

[Inthedetails]

yes yes yes!!! the not texting mom thing is just.... Anyway. if she left on her own , you think she would have given mom some kind of story when she talked to her just before she disappeared.

Does the mom text?

jmo

 

[Deleted member 169742]

I think KB and PF were never engaged. Simply, she got pregnant (it can always happen), and to both of them, the pregnancy might have been a total accident. But they decided to keep the baby (not only religious people do it). And - being responsible people - they probably read books that emphasized the importance of both parents being in a child's life from day one. This is why they stayed together through pregnancy and delivery. Hence, the "fiance". And they might have planned to stay together longer, but time had shown them how different they were. She wants to fly, and he lives in a farm with soil and manure. Nothing in common. They grew apart.

It is my feeling that this is what happened. And it is possible that PF is a very good and devoted parent, and might be a nice person. And so is KB. And they tried to do the best for the kid.

Now, how does it all factor into Nov 22nd? I don't know. Either PF is telling mostly the truth except for them breaking up, or something happened accidentally, and there are people who know it was an accident, and try to cover it up - feeling sorry for PF, perhaps?

And his biggest fear is losing the rights for the daughter.

This is what I am thinking about. It is possible that someone helped him, also, more impulsively than thinking about the consequences. And now there is a web of lies and misconceptions, and it goes on.

I am not seeing any parallels between CW and PF. PF, if anything, is not too successful, not too young, definitely not sexy, dude, probably ripe for the family and honestly attached to his kid. I doubt he is controlling, maybe he has impulsive anger and never realised it was a problem.

He should sit down with the LE and talk.

I am almost positive that if PF is involved, it was not intentional.

Either or both could have outside love interests ... an unseen player, that harmed her

 

[Deleted member 169742]

Also ---- If PF had another person on the side... wouldn't LE have disclosed that by now ? Maybe he wanted out ?

Maybe the Love interest did away with KB? To get PF on the rebound

 

[WhimsicalWillow]

In the interview with the Mother, she said that KB worked long hours and was very busy. Sometimes she was hard to get in contact with busy of her schedule.

There have to be people in KB’s social circle that talked with her more than her mother and I wish we could hear from those people.

IF PF’s did not do it, I’d hope that he and his attorney would find a better way to answer questions that could lead to where KB is.

IF I were PF and was not involved, I’d be very worried about being arrested for a crime I didn’t commit but I’d also be very worried about the mother of my child and request my attorney provide brief written statements to help LE.

We have to remember that KB’s baby depends on PF financially and if PF is innocent, we wouldn’t want to hurt his business.

 

[Inthedetails]

I’d try to find him first, if she was gone a lot and busy with work and he was caring for the baby he’d have more time to be alone and maybe start looking for someone new? KWIM? Just a thought....

If she has an outside love interest with her busy schedule, I want to know how she managed it. Maybe waved at the same driver on her long commute every day?

Just a hunch that if either had another relationship going, it would more likely be him.

IDK if he did....wouldn't necessarily be surprised (though kinda surprised it hasn't leaked out yet if he did).

jmo