CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #7

[Denvergirl]

A thought. Maybe the first call between mother/daughter involved requesting the recipe for something she planned to prepare for Thanksgiving. Something goes awry between Kelsey/boyfriend. Later the second call is placed to her mother. Kelsey vents. Mom asks what she plans on doing for Thanksgiving. She asks if she still plans on going to his home for dinner. Kelsey replies, "maybe Ill just go to to eat". In other words, how many of us knew Thanksgiving morning exactly what we planned on doing for Thanksgiving meal? I did. I think most Americans did. Why was Kelsey still " up in the air" about her evening plans? I'm leaning towards a big argument the day she disappeared.

A big argument, or as I have contemplated...she had plans with someone else but wasn't going to be forthcoming about that with her mom.

 

[Celt1997]

I'm new to this so I've missed a lot. Her phone pinging in ID - could someone have found a car or better still a tractor-trailer rig with ID plates and hidden the phone on it? If someone did do this, either it is just a coincidence they picked an out-of-state vehicle from the state she grew up in or they knew about her ID connection.

The problem is that (as far as we know) there was no "ping" trail on the way to Gooding. From what has been made public, it sounds like the phone was off the grid, then suddenly popped up briefly near Gooding, and then disappeared again.

Now, it's possible that LE does have more information about the phone "traveling," but we have not been made aware of it.

 

[ksprincess]

Quick question.

Have the following two statements been verified as fact.

#1. The mother's sister stated said they broke up on or just before Thanksgiving.
#2. The mother stated they have a happy, loving relationship.

Maybe Mom knows they broke up as well but had been told by LE not to disclose this information but her Aunt hadn't yet been told that LE didn't want that info out there. Reminds me of the Laura Wallen case where LE had told the parents they believed her boyfriend killed her but at LE's request parents did a press conference with him and her Mom held his hand and listened to him plead for her return. So Kelsey's Mom may just be saying what LE told her to say even though she knows otherwise. Or maybe Kelsey confided to her Aunt they broke up but hadn't told her Mom yet.

 

[Jethro4WS]

I'm watching some of the morning shows this morning as they update about this case and I find it so surprising that they are all identifying PF as KB's fiancee....despite the fact that KB's mom has been the ONLY one to use that term. Aren't I correct is saying that LE and PF's attorney have not used that term?

I know that the statements by PF's attorney don't use that term. However Woodland Park Police in a few of their releases have used that term. One example is the timeline post Woodland Park Police has on their FB page.

Woodland Park Police Department

 

[Esma]

I do think that if the guilty person isn’t PF, it is someone she or he knows, not a stranger. I dont think a stranger abductor would feel the need to text the fiancé or her work. I 100% don’t believe she left on her own accord or made the texts herself.

 

[Gardener1850]

1. This particular case seems to be loaded with statements being made and words being used to elicit a response or reaction from someone or a group of people. I am choosing to take the word "suspicious" as, "we have no idea what happened."

2. There has been more than one incident, fairly recently, when a commercial pilot flew a commercial airliner, full of people, into the ground or into the side of a mountain. For example...

"He was 27, loved to fly and apparently raised no suspicions or showed obvious signs that he was troubled."

This is the opening paragraph of a story about Andreas Lubitz. A commercial pilot that killed 150 passengers when he intentionally flew an Airbus into a mountainside in the French Alps.

Pilots, professional or otherwise are human beings too.

3. I personally have no clue as to what kind of people KB, PF, the mother, brother, police chief, anyone involved in this thing really are. Very little information provided make any sense when I piece it all together. None of us knows much of anything about any of this.

Someone here stated that KB was obviously the more responsible adult because she purchased the home she lived in. How does anyone of us know details of her home purchase? Lol. Maybe she inherited some money that allowed her to buy that place. Who knows? It was stated here that PF was more likely to have mental issues because anyone his age that lives with their mother must have issues! My mother lived with me for a long period of time after she fell and broke her leg. She was old and needed help. Maybe it's his home and the mother lives with him for whatever reason.

I guess I'm growing tired of seeing the same assumptions being made over and over in this case. I feel like making assumptions, being completely convinced one particular person is the only person who could've done something wrong, makes it almost impossible to see other legitimate possibilities in something like this. I have no clue what happened in this thing. I do not feel like I have any truly reliable and without a doubt information to lead me in one direction or another. And, with each day that passes the less sense any of this makes.

1. Suspicious meaning:

suspicious
adjective

sus·pi·cious | \sə-ˈspi-shəs \
Definition of suspicious
1 : tending to arouse suspicion : questionable suspicious characters

2 : disposed to suspect : distrustful suspicious of strangers

3 : expressing or indicative of suspicion a suspicious glance

Synonyms
debatable, disputable, dodgy [chiefly British], doubtable, doubtful, dubious, dubitable, equivocal, fishy, problematic (also problematical), queer, questionable, shady, shaky, suspect

Definition of SUSPICIOUS

2. That airline pilot was German, not American. The US has stricter standards and, in fact he was prevented from getting an US pilot's license because of his mental health history: "the investigation into Lubitz found he had been treated for suicidal tendencies prior to his training as a commercial pilot and had been temporarily denied a US pilot's license because of these treatments for depression" If you read the rest of the info on him, you find there were all kinds of red flags and evidence he suffered from mental illness prior to the incident: Germanwings Flight 9525 - Wikipedia

Again, there is no evidence like that for Kelsey. Had she struggled with any of those types of things the FBI would have found evidence of that from her home, her employer, her computer, and from interviewing those in her life. They have not found that and have instead said the disappearance is suspicious. LE doesn't use the word suspicious in suspected suicide cases or voluntary missing cases.

3. We know about her home purchase and his lack of home ownership because our members found the records and posted links to them. I don't have time to go back and find the original links, but there is a lot of discussion about Kelsey's house purchase (with source links) in thread 2: CO - CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #2
PF does not own the home where he lives. The home and property that was searched by LE belong to his mother. We know this from the property records, also found by our members here: Teller County Property Records Database

 

[1wonderleads2another]

Yes, both are true. I have to wonder if the text to PF’s phone was a breakup text (not made by KB) and PF did not report her missing and told this to the mother when she called. Maybe the Aunt believes the text to be true but the mother doesn’t?

A big argument, or as I have contemplated...she had plans with someone else but wasn't going to be forthcoming about that with her mom.

When I was online dating Several different holidays my ex had our child, so on a couple of occasions I did go on a first date on a holiday. When you are at loose ends, and somebody intriguing offers to take you to a restaurant it sounds like at least a good way to spend the holiday. In my case I ALWAYS met the date in public, for at least the first date. But about 80% of my girlfriends also have done online dating and the majority of them have let guys pick them up at their house on the first date. (And have received an earful of what are you thinking , from me)

In other words it is completely in the realm of reason KB had a stranger pick her up under the guise of a restaurant meal.

 

[kkdj]

I've heard that PF went to KB's home to get their daughter and I've heard that KB dropped the little girl off to him at his home. Which is it? With her purse and cell missing it makes more sense that she went to his home.
However, her cars are at her home, correct?
I suspect something happened to her at the time of exchange of their daughter. Did she willingly hand over her daughter to PF that day? If it's true (as her aunt says) that they had broken up the day before, then this is a big question to me. KB's mother said she was maybe going to dinner that night. With whom, if she had broken up with PS the day prior?
Then, her cell pinged in Idaho. Where was PF at that time? Do we know?
Also, he is holding his daughter close every time I've seen any pics of him in the media. Why? I can think of several reasons he is doing this. Public sympathy, shield, protective of her, etc. Personally I would keep my child out of any media pics. That would be one of the ways I would protect my child. I would keep her out of the public eye.
jmo

 

[gypsysoul]

Maybe PF's attorney is just really good at steering the narrative to distance his client from Kelsey. I mean we are all talking about their broken relationship as fact. But, really who began that narrative? Where did it originate? PF's attorney - benefits his client. LE - heard from PF through attorney. And VI Aunt - heard from LE through PF attorney (I don't think she has stated where she heard this info)? --MOO

What facts do we have to back those claims? They lived apart - well, maybe Kelsey didn't want to live with her mother-in-law? I don't know many people who would. Maybe she tried that and it didn't go so well (hence the Florrisant PO Box)? --MOO

The creative use of the phrase "custody exchange" just further's the narrative, and it is technically correct if PF went to KB house to pick up their baby. But, directs the narrative to create distance (and plants the seeds for doubt) for PF. --MOO

So, maybe their relationship wasn't all CB thinks it was.
Or, Maybe PF has a really craft attorney who was spoonfed us all with the narrative that best suits his client. --MOO

 

[jillianelaine]

I think I've convinced myself for one reason or another, that there has not been a loving relationship between those two for a long time and that both parties are comfortable with the situation. Therefore, I get confused about what could have possibly made a detached partner angry enough to make someone disappear, besides a custody issue. And why should there be a custody issue if they have been living independent for this long and she landed her dream job with no intentions of moving away,... Then, I remember. I remember being quite comfortable in my decision to walk away from a two year relationship and feeling fine, actually quite good...until he found someone new and my life had remained stagnant. And then watching my life crumble. And wanting to smash something, anything. Even though I was perfectly fine all those months before. I wish I knew what she was shopping for, when she planned on making that recipe shed received from her mother, if the sweet rolls were for someone else, who she planned to have dinner with, whether he was picking p the baby because she needed someone to watch the kid that night,...

 

[Charlot123]

S'okay, it doesn't matter and it was just a clarification on what was true and what was rumor. Besides, we really shouldn't be sleuthing them anyway.

Everything I have read outside this forum (not much) speculates on her problems and what a great guy he is, and what other difficulties he has had. Everything also comes from CO.

Nothing is coming from Kelsey's side. Silence.

So I want to know regular things about PF. Age. Education. Since her possible issues, mental problems, potential substances, were discussed, even here - the most reasonable question is, did he have issues? Mental, or alcohol-related? Prior kids?

I don't think we are not allowed to check on it.

Has anyone realized that we know very little about him, except for his family being in LE? This might be a red herring, though, and not relevant. Prior history of women breaking up with him might be very important.

And a totally random question. If he has that many relatives in LE, and farmers struggle, did he ever apply to LE?

 

[chuppa74]

For those of you who don’t live in Colorado, let me tell you the town she lives in is in a national forest. So why haven’t authorities organized any searches of the vast forest land? Because it’s too big??? From the reaction I have seen on social media, I would bet they would get gobs if volunteers to help search!!!

Regardless of if they think she left on her own or as a result of foul play... SEARCH THE WOODS!!!

If I lived in this area and was going to dispose of evidence, I wouldn't do it on my own property, regardless of the size. There are so many remote locations available that wouldn't be the first place to be searched. First post and all. Hi.

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

See my response above yours. Yup, we’re saying exactly the same thing. Maybe I’m grumpy bc I’m tired - but I’m getting a little pussy about not being able to get any info. Any!

Lol. A little whaaaat?

 

[Mom24]

I've heard that PF went to KB's home to get their daughter and I've heard that KB dropped the little girl off to him at his home. Which is it? With her purse and cell missing it makes more sense that she went to his home.
However, her cars are at her home, correct?
I suspect something happened to her at the time of exchange of their daughter. Did she willingly hand over her daughter to PF that day? If it's true (as her aunt says) that they had broken up the day before, then this is a big question to me. KB's mother said she was maybe going to dinner that night. With whom, if she had broken up with PS the day prior?
Then, her cell pinged in Idaho. Where was PF at that time? Do we know?
Also, he is holding his daughter close every time I've seen any pics of him in the media. Why? I can think of several reasons he is doing this. Public sympathy, shield, protective of her, etc. Personally I would keep my child out of any media pics. That would be one of the ways I would protect my child. I would keep her out of the public eye.
jmo

It's not really clear how the "exchange" took place. It does seem that he came to her home, whether or not we want to believe that there was a pre-arranged exchange or that he was picking them both up for the day. As to the break up? It's conflicting. My personal opinion is that KB may have told her family that things were on edge and she was planning to break up or had thought of cooling things down for a time, but that they're unsure if KB and PF worked things out and they don't want to put something out there that may not be true or may make things awkward if she is found alive. With so many possibilities, and PF's stonewalling, it must be hard for the family to know what to say to not make things worse. As a mother I'd be worried he was holding her somewhere and if he thought she was leaving, he'd harm her.

 

[bestill]

See my response above yours. Yup, we’re saying exactly the same thing. Maybe I’m grumpy bc I’m tired - but I’m getting a little pussy about not being able to get any info. Any!

haha

 

[BRRI]

See my response above yours. Yup, we’re saying exactly the same thing. Maybe I’m grumpy bc I’m tired - but I’m getting a little pussy about not being able to get any info. Any!

Meow.

 

[Mom24]

Everything I have read outside this forum (not much) speculates on her problems and what a great guy he is, and what other difficulties he has had. Everything also comes from CO.

Nothing is coming from Kelsey's side. Silence.

So I want to know regular things about PF. Age. Education. Since her possible issues, mental problems, potential substances, were discussed, even here - the most reasonable question is, did he have issues? Mental, or alcohol-related? Prior kids?

I don't think we are not allowed to check on it.

Has anyone realized that we know very little about him, except for his family being in LE? This might be a red herring, though, and not relevant. Prior history of women breaking up with him might be very important.

And a totally random question. If he has that many relatives in LE, and farmers struggle, did he ever apply to LE?

The post is in response to some posts that were removed due to sleuthing of family members, not PF.

 

[bestill]

Meow.

 

[SausagePizza]

Thread off the tracks.

 

[BRRI]

Everything I have read outside this forum (not much) speculates on her problems and what a great guy he is, and what other difficulties he has had. Everything also comes from CO.

Nothing is coming from Kelsey's side. Silence.

So I want to know regular things about PF. Age. Education. Since her possible issues, mental problems, potential substances, were discussed, even here - the most reasonable question is, did he have issues? Mental, or alcohol-related? Prior kids?

I don't think we are not allowed to check on it.

Has anyone realized that we know very little about him, except for his family being in LE? This might be a red herring, though, and not relevant. Prior history of women breaking up with him might be very important.

And a totally random question. If he has that many relatives in LE, and farmers struggle, did he ever apply to LE?

No criminal background. Involved in rodeo type events. Owns his company and had taken out loans for it, last one being 2016. He sells cattle, possibly horses. Lives at a property owned by his mom. Drives red truck. His company’s revenue is approximately 100k a year (prior to expenses).