CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - *Arrest* #62

[Safeguard]

I feel he did. SF may have a warrant waiting for her.

We don't know obviously what Crazy Frazy's Ma knew, but look at the things he said outside the comfort of the franch, I can see him running Kelsey down to Ma, in the comfort of her own home.

I feel strongly she knew. She was probably hearing lots of crypic little things, at the very least, " My problem with that little $*&%$ will be over soon" ect...

I am quite sure his mother has learned how to speak Psychopath by now.

 

[Steelslady]

BBM:

I think the prosecution's theory of the case is that PF was experiencing financial stressors that were cumulative.

He took out that 70k loan, which he was in default status on.
He was paying KB child support up until a few months before he murdered her, then he stopped.
He was paying for her medical insurance.
He and his siblings were fighting over the dad's estate.

I think PF blamed KB entirely for his financial problems.

KB became the focus of his rage and resentment over his financial struggles.
His thoughts likely became obsessive:
"If KB wasn't around, I wouldn't have these problems."
"I have to get rid of her."
"I'm going to kill her. Once she's gone, problem solved."

JMO.

I thought Kelsey had medical insurance for Baby K and herself. Didn't Patrick talk to DOSS because they said something about where Kelsey was missing, they would be discontinuing the insurance for Baby K?

He also stopped paying child support back in either June or July, from what was said in Twitter comments from the trial. He was already talking about killing her before then.

The Berreth's were going to help them buy a ranch of their own, but when Patrick got frustrated about something, he told Kelsey just to rent another apartment. That's how Kelsey ended up getting that condo- her parents helped her and I believe it was to make sure that Kelsey wouldn't have to keep moving from place to place, especially with the baby. I think the Berreth's were worried for Kelsey and tried to make life easier for her, with all of her family being so far away.

I think Patrick just couldn't make up his mind how to get rid of Kelsey. He obviously did some research to come up with no body, no crime crap. He started dissing Kelsey to others, claiming child abuse, going to a lawyer to draw up custody papers, saying she was an alcoholic and God knows what else, but he confused his stories, depending on who he talked to. It was like he couldn't make up his mind how he was going to kill her off, but he was going to do it, no matter what.

I also think that he played Krystal a little bit, too- probably told her once Kelsey was gone, they would get married and more BS.

I'm surprised, to be honest, that Krystal, who is a nurse, didn't tell him that doing this at the condo was not a good idea. That blood would go all over the place, even on his clothes, plus having to remove Kelsey from the condo would have been risky. As a nurse she would know that blood can splatter everywhere from car accidents and sporting accidents.

Then the fool thought up a burglary attempt, but the dumb bunny took her body away, which made it even more suspicious, as no burglar is going to take a body with them.

I just think he wanted both women out of his life, he was done with them, and figured out a way to do it. I think he was going to try and set up Krystal for this. After all, she came down after Thanksgiving to do the clean up. It makes you wonder if he told his lawyers that Krystal did it, as that is where the defense plans on going with this- that Patrick is innocent, that Krystal came and killed her, and without Kelsey's body, they're going to say there's no proof that Patrick killed her.

Even Krystal admitted that Patrick wanted her to take Kelsey's body with her back to Idaho.

 

[moonlessnight]

"Even Krystal admitted that Patrick wanted her to take Kelsey's body with her back to Idaho."

Oh - I missed that part. what a - PF. I think you are probably right - he had set up KK to take the fall for the murder. He'd probably claim KK was jealous of KB and killed her.

I thought Kelsey had medical insurance for Baby K and herself. Didn't Patrick talk to DOSS because they said something about where Kelsey was missing, they would be discontinuing the insurance for Baby K?

He also stopped paying child support back in either June or July, from what was said in Twitter comments from the trial. He was already talking about killing her before then.

The Berreth's were going to help them buy a ranch of their own, but when Patrick got frustrated about something, he told Kelsey just to rent another apartment. That's how Kelsey ended up getting that condo- her parents helped her and I believe it was to make sure that Kelsey wouldn't have to keep moving from place to place, especially with the baby. I think the Berreth's were worried for Kelsey and tried to make life easier for her, with all of her family being so far away.

I think Patrick just couldn't make up his mind how to get rid of Kelsey. He obviously did some research to come up with no body, no crime crap. He started dissing Kelsey to others, claiming child abuse, going to a lawyer to draw up custody papers, saying she was an alcoholic and God knows what else, but he confused his stories, depending on who he talked to. It was like he couldn't make up his mind how he was going to kill her off, but he was going to do it, no matter what.

I also think that he played Krystal a little bit, too- probably told her once Kelsey was gone, they would get married and more BS.

I'm surprised, to be honest, that Krystal, who is a nurse, didn't tell him that doing this at the condo was not a good idea. That blood would go all over the place, even on his clothes, plus having to remove Kelsey from the condo would have been risky. As a nurse she would know that blood can splatter everywhere from car accidents and sporting accidents.

Then the fool thought up a burglary attempt, but the dumb bunny took her body away, which made it even more suspicious, as no burglar is going to take a body with them.

I just think he wanted both women out of his life, he was done with them, and figured out a way to do it. I think he was going to try and set up Krystal for this. After all, she came down after Thanksgiving to do the clean up. It makes you wonder if he told his lawyers that Krystal did it, as that is where the defense plans on going with this- that Patrick is innocent, that Krystal came and killed her, and without Kelsey's body, they're going to say there's no proof that Patrick killed her.

Even Krystal admitted that Patrick wanted her to take Kelsey's body with her back to Idaho.

 

[Best of What's Around]

I thought Kelsey had medical insurance for Baby K and herself. Didn't Patrick talk to DOSS because they said something about where Kelsey was missing, they would be discontinuing the insurance for Baby K?

He also stopped paying child support back in either June or July, from what was said in Twitter comments from the trial. He was already talking about killing her before then.

The Berreth's were going to help them buy a ranch of their own, but when Patrick got frustrated about something, he told Kelsey just to rent another apartment. That's how Kelsey ended up getting that condo- her parents helped her and I believe it was to make sure that Kelsey wouldn't have to keep moving from place to place, especially with the baby. I think the Berreth's were worried for Kelsey and tried to make life easier for her, with all of her family being so far away.

I think Patrick just couldn't make up his mind how to get rid of Kelsey. He obviously did some research to come up with no body, no crime crap. He started dissing Kelsey to others, claiming child abuse, going to a lawyer to draw up custody papers, saying she was an alcoholic and God knows what else, but he confused his stories, depending on who he talked to. It was like he couldn't make up his mind how he was going to kill her off, but he was going to do it, no matter what.

I also think that he played Krystal a little bit, too- probably told her once Kelsey was gone, they would get married and more BS.

I'm surprised, to be honest, that Krystal, who is a nurse, didn't tell him that doing this at the condo was not a good idea. That blood would go all over the place, even on his clothes, plus having to remove Kelsey from the condo would have been risky. As a nurse she would know that blood can splatter everywhere from car accidents and sporting accidents.

Then the fool thought up a burglary attempt, but the dumb bunny took her body away, which made it even more suspicious, as no burglar is going to take a body with them.

I just think he wanted both women out of his life, he was done with them, and figured out a way to do it. I think he was going to try and set up Krystal for this. After all, she came down after Thanksgiving to do the clean up. It makes you wonder if he told his lawyers that Krystal did it, as that is where the defense plans on going with this- that Patrick is innocent, that Krystal came and killed her, and without Kelsey's body, they're going to say there's no proof that Patrick killed her.

Even Krystal admitted that Patrick wanted her to take Kelsey's body with her back to Idaho.

I get the sense it was his back up plan to pin it on her - not his primary plan - which was to make it somehow look like CB took off and killed herself? Or just disappeared. Either way, he has failed spectacularly.

it was a crazy way to kill her if you are thinking clinically - I am wondering if he ever fantasized about beating someone to death. It is such a gruesome, difficult, and messy way to do it - that I can only think he must have been excited by the sick idea of it. There are zero benefits to him otherwise that I can see to choose that method, and we know it wasn’t spur of the moment - picking up the first thing you see kind of rage. . Feel terrible/dark to even discuss this but I am trying to make sense of it.

 

[Warwick7]

I thought Kelsey had medical insurance for Baby K and herself. Didn't Patrick talk to DOSS because they said something about where Kelsey was missing, they would be discontinuing the insurance for Baby K?

He also stopped paying child support back in either June or July, from what was said in Twitter comments from the trial. He was already talking about killing her before then.

The Berreth's were going to help them buy a ranch of their own, but when Patrick got frustrated about something, he told Kelsey just to rent another apartment. That's how Kelsey ended up getting that condo- her parents helped her and I believe it was to make sure that Kelsey wouldn't have to keep moving from place to place, especially with the baby. I think the Berreth's were worried for Kelsey and tried to make life easier for her, with all of her family being so far away.

I think Patrick just couldn't make up his mind how to get rid of Kelsey. He obviously did some research to come up with no body, no crime crap. He started dissing Kelsey to others, claiming child abuse, going to a lawyer to draw up custody papers, saying she was an alcoholic and God knows what else, but he confused his stories, depending on who he talked to. It was like he couldn't make up his mind how he was going to kill her off, but he was going to do it, no matter what.

I also think that he played Krystal a little bit, too- probably told her once Kelsey was gone, they would get married and more BS.

I'm surprised, to be honest, that Krystal, who is a nurse, didn't tell him that doing this at the condo was not a good idea. That blood would go all over the place, even on his clothes, plus having to remove Kelsey from the condo would have been risky. As a nurse she would know that blood can splatter everywhere from car accidents and sporting accidents.

Then the fool thought up a burglary attempt, but the dumb bunny took her body away, which made it even more suspicious, as no burglar is going to take a body with them.

I just think he wanted both women out of his life, he was done with them, and figured out a way to do it. I think he was going to try and set up Krystal for this. After all, she came down after Thanksgiving to do the clean up. It makes you wonder if he told his lawyers that Krystal did it, as that is where the defense plans on going with this- that Patrick is innocent, that Krystal came and killed her, and without Kelsey's body, they're going to say there's no proof that Patrick killed her.

Even Krystal admitted that Patrick wanted her to take Kelsey's body with her back to Idaho.

Ya know I watched a Death in Paradise who done it. The husband framed the mistress after killing the wife. He buried her under concrete at the new home. It wasn't until they started going over bank accounts they figured it out.
Came down to a paper trail.
Here we have a paper trail, cell phone trail and video trail.
It shocks me his stupidity...

 

[Safeguard]

I just think he wanted both women out of his life, he was done with them, and figured out a way to do it. I think he was going to try and set up Krystal for this. After all, she came down after Thanksgiving to do the clean up. It makes you wonder if he told his lawyers that Krystal did it, as that is where the defense plans on going with this- that Patrick is innocent, that Krystal came and killed her, and without Kelsey's body, they're going to say there's no proof that Patrick killed her.

Even Krystal admitted that Patrick wanted her to take Kelsey's body with her back to Idaho.

I've always thought that. That's why he wanted her to kill Kelsey. And only when he realized she wouldn't, he did it himself. I also don't think kk couldn't do it, I think she just had a sneaking suspicion that he was setting her up. I doubt that was her "line", she just wanted to be sure they were in it together.

 

[moonlessnight]

If KB was dead, would PF be the beneficiary or otherwise control her portion of some monetary award to baby K? If PF's dad willed baby K an inheritance that KB had partial legal control over, would he want her dead for that reason?

I have been wondering this, since at the beginning of the trial, they mentioned financial reasons were part of the motive for Patrick killing Kelsey.

But then I saw JM's testimony that he had been talking about killing Kelsey back in April of 2018, and try as I may, I can't make it fit the equation of the will being the cause. We do know from earlier interviews way back that Kelsey and Patrick couldn't get married and live together because Patrick was citing financial issues- something about the cattle prices. Had the father already been deceased and the will was an issue, I might think it had to do with the possibility that the money was left for the grandchildren. Then again, how would Patrick get Baby K's money- I would think that would be in some kind of trust fund until she turned a certain age.

I am curious, though, about the financial motive. It just doesn't make sense to me.

 

[riolove77]

Yes, that is her.

ETA: She has not been convicted of a crime yet. So, there is nothing they can/will do yet. I have no worries about her obtaining employment as a nurse while he license is still valid. A quick google will stop anything she tries to do.

yeah, a conviction will change things. I just got a conviction against a correctional officer who shot at a process server on her property. She’d kept her job in the prison but a department of corrections agent contacted me right after to tell me they were now moving forward with termination. They were just waiting on a conviction.

 

[Safeguard]

it was a crazy way to kill her if you are thinking clinically - I am wondering if he ever fantasized about bearing someone to death. It is such a gruesome, difficult, and messy way to do it - that I can only think he must have been excited by the sick idea of it. There are zero benefits to him otherwise that I can see to choose that method, and we know it wasn’t spur of the moment - picking up the first thing you see kind of rage. . Feel terrible/dark to even discuss this but I am trying to make sense of it.

This is the really crazy part to my mind too. He had to have such a rage. It's a lot harder than almost anyway he could've done it. (Just the sound that had to make! Never mind what it looked like!). *Shudder*
The horror that dwells inside this evil, evil creature just can't be underestimated. imo. I hope to God he doesn't get off like Casey Anthony, or OJ. He's a really sadistic dangerous black hole.

 

[susiQ]

Ya know I watched a Death in Paradise who done it. The husband framed the mistress after killing the wife. He buried her under concrete at the new home. It wasn't until they started going over bank accounts they figured it out.
Came down to a paper trail.
Here we have a paper trail, cell phone trail and video trail.
It shocks me his stupidity...

I'm gonna take a wild guess that PF watched that same episode but it didn't dawn on him that the show was about another idiot......who got caught!

 

[MyBelle]

Yes, that is her.

ETA: She has not been convicted of a crime yet. So, there is nothing they can/will do yet. I have no worries about her obtaining employment as a nurse while he license is still valid. A quick google will stop anything she tries to do.

KK entered a guilty plea. She hasn't been sentenced yet. An employment search will reveal the circumstances under which she left her last job. Sonic likely wishes she would go way far away.

JMO

 

[Artis]

Yes, that is her.

ETA: She has not been convicted of a crime yet. So, there is nothing they can/will do yet. I have no worries about her obtaining employment as a nurse while he license is still valid. A quick google will stop anything she tries to do.

She was charged and pleaded guilty to tampering with evidence, a felony. So, she's been "convicted" as far as that goes.

 

[Simply Southern]

KK entered a guilty plea. She hasn't been sentenced yet. An employment search will reveal the circumstances under which she left her last job. Sonic likely wishes she would go way far away.

JMO

Employer's are required by law to release date of hire and last day employed. Additional information can be construed as to defamatory and open for suit.

Potential employers do check social media.

Moo..

 

[Simply Southern]

She was charged and pleaded guilty to tampering with evidence, a felony. So, she's been "convicted" as far as that goes.

She has a plea agreement ...if she does certain things AND pleads guilty, the sentence will not exceed 3 years.

Her trial date is later in Dec., after PF trial.

I suspect she will cancel or not renew her RN license. If she's is inactive with the Board of Medicine, they will not put the charge on her record.

MHO...

 

[Simply Southern]

I get the sense it was his back up plan to pin it on her - not his primary plan - which was to make it somehow look like CB took off and killed herself? Or just disappeared. Either way, he has failed spectacularly.

it was a crazy way to kill her if you are thinking clinically - I am wondering if he ever fantasized about beating someone to death. It is such a gruesome, difficult, and messy way to do it - that I can only think he must have been excited by the sick idea of it. There are zero benefits to him otherwise that I can see to choose that method, and we know it wasn’t spur of the moment - picking up the first thing you see kind of rage. . Feel terrible/dark to even discuss this but I am trying to make sense of it.

MOO..
I think he thought one strike of the bat and she would be out.

Nope. My Dad fell down the stairs in the middle of night. He had a 8 inch wound to the back of head. A very large clot formed immediately and grew as he bleed. We had virtually no blood splatter just a large congealed amount of blood .
He was conscious and talking to me the entire time. Amazingly his only pain was his shoulder.

The bat...not a good choice. Moo

 

[scdiv]

And KK looks totally pathetic to me as she recounts her history with PF.

I mean, not ONCE does she ever say that he tells her that he loves her.

Some say that she was obsessed with PF, and maybe she was? But you would think that she would somehow imply that PF told her that if KB were gone that they would be together.

Not one time is this ever mentioned. PF chose HER because he thought she loved him enough to actually do it. Turns out, he was wrong, and I think that played into his rage. MOO

This was my thought too. I didn't get the sense from anything that was reported in KK's testimony that PF ever showed any love, affection, or desire toward her. In fact, she said the opposite - that PF didn't talk about his feelings for her. Yea, because he doesn't love you or care about you honey.

That's one reason this case is even more mind-boggling to me than some of the others. Usually the guy who committed the murder has some sort of misguided love interest with some mistress who emerges. Like I think idiot Chris Watts actually thought he was in love, sort of. Scott Peterson was still trying to woo Amber. I feel like the only interest PF had in this chic KK was to get her to drive down with a baseball bat and kill the mother of his child so he didn't have to do the dirty work himself. And then when he had to, he called her and left a dick message that she had a mess to clean up. (If my husband left me a message about my own dishes left in the sink and that "I had a mess to clean up" - I'd be out the door....let alone clean up his baby mama's murder scene.)

I just don't get the sense, imo, that there was any sweet talk of oh once KB is out of the way, we can be together, I love you so much, fake charm or seduction coming from him. Not much of a charmer or smooth talker this one. He was pretty much just an ass who ordered her to do his bidding and wasn't even nice or appreciative of her searching for teeth for him and cleaning up blood. And yet she did all this? For this jerk who couldn't even say please kill my baby's mother or ask nicely for her to come mop up splattered blood? It's so messed up on every level.

The other thing I'm not sure about or maybe have missed - what did KK think was the current state of PF's relationship with KB? Because it sure seems like KB thought she and PF were more or less together. They were going to do something together on Thanksgiving. He was going to her work party. They were going to look for a Christmas tree. KB's family was still using the word "fiance" early on.

What did PF tell KK his status with KB was? The whole "I got her to play a scented candle guessing game" implies trust and intimacy and an amicable if not romantic relationship. If KK knew that was the game, then wouldn't she know that PF was still at least pretending to KB that they were together?

I guess my questions are was PF lying to other people that oh they had broken up, these were custody hand offs not simply work/care taking switches, etc. But KB still thought he was her boyfriend/fiance? And did KK know that KB at least still thought PF was her boyfriend/fiance or not? (And PF was just going along with faking that until he could take her out?)

But yea, other than thank goodness he didn't harm his daughter, PF is truly one of the worst of these cases. Geez, he didn't even have some misguided love interest motive. Just so senseless. And for what, to save $700 a month? I have a hard time believing he truly wanted full custody of this child because he was so enthralled with being a father. Just everything that's already been stated in these threads - control, narc, sociopath, take your pick of terrible person personality disorders.

 

[Best of What's Around]

MOO..
I think he thought one strike of the bat and she would be out.

Nope. My Dad fell down the stairs in the middle of night. He had a 8 inch wound to the back of head. A very large clot formed immediately and grew as he bleed. We had virtually no blood splatter just a large congealed amount of blood .
He was conscious and talking to me the entire time. Amazingly his only pain was his shoulder.

The bat...not a good choice. Moo

He may well have been that cocky and stupid - I agree - after all he apparently told KK it would be an easy strike - but what a risk and how violent his choice was is astounding given she apparently loved him and thought things were well between them - meaning he played that role with her for some time. Chilling. Chilling and violent and incredibly stupid for someone who spent months thinking this through. Thank goodness his wits are no match for his evil.

 

[Best of What's Around]

This was my thought too. I didn't get the sense from anything that was reported in KK's testimony that PF ever showed any love, affection, or desire toward her. In fact, she said the opposite - that PF didn't talk about his feelings for her. Yea, because he doesn't love you or care about you honey.

That's one reason this case is even more mind-boggling to me than some of the others. Usually the guy who committed the murder has some sort of misguided love interest with some mistress who emerges. Like I think idiot Chris Watts actually thought he was in love, sort of. Scott Peterson was still trying to woo Amber. I feel like the only interest PF had in this chic KK was to get her to drive down with a baseball bat and kill the mother of his child so he didn't have to do the dirty work himself. And then when he had to, he called her and left a dick message that she had a mess to clean up. (If my husband left me a message about my own dishes left in the sink and that "I had a mess to clean up" - I'd be out the door....let alone clean up his baby mama's murder scene.)

I just don't get the sense, imo, that there was any sweet talk of oh once KB is out of the way, we can be together, I love you so much, fake charm or seduction coming from him. Not much of a charmer or smooth talker this one. He was pretty much just an ass who ordered her to do his bidding and wasn't even nice or appreciative of her searching for teeth for him and cleaning up blood. And yet she did all this? For this jerk who couldn't even say please kill my baby's mother or ask nicely for her to come mop up splattered blood? It's so messed up on every level.

The other thing I'm not sure about or maybe have missed - what did KK think was the current state of PF's relationship with KB? Because it sure seems like KB thought she and PF were more or less together. They were going to do something together on Thanksgiving. He was going to her work party. They were going to look for a Christmas tree. KB's family was still using the word "fiance" early on.

What did PF tell KK his status with KB was? The whole "I got her to play a scented candle guessing game" implies trust and intimacy and an amicable if not romantic relationship. If KK knew that was the game, then wouldn't she know that PF was still at least pretending to KB that they were together?

I guess my questions are was PF lying to other people that oh they had broken up, these were custody hand offs not simply work/care taking switches, etc. But KB still thought he was her boyfriend/fiance? And did KK know that KB at least still thought PF was her boyfriend/fiance or not? (And PF was just going along with faking that until he could take her out?)

But yea, other than thank goodness he didn't harm his daughter, PF is truly one of the worst of these cases. Geez, he didn't even have some misguided love interest motive. Just so senseless. And for what, to save $700 a month? I have a hard time believing he truly wanted full custody of this child because he was so enthralled with being a father. Just everything that's already been stated in these threads - control, narc, sociopath, take your pick of terrible person personality disorders.

Excellent points - I still do not see this man who never seemed to love anyone in his life wanting to raise a toddler daughter. I wonder if we will learn anymore on that front. He seemed to use and manipulate everyone. Given he could not even clean up his own mess, how was he contemplating raising a child? I guess he assumed he would find someone else to do that for him? He does not seem to be terribly deep nor does he confide without manipulating that we know of - so I guess we are going to be left with a lot of unanswered questions. And I doubt Ma F is going to be shedding any meaningful light on that monster she raised.

 

[iambarb2]

Who is this in CT that you guys are talking about?

Isn't that the Jennifer Dulos murder case? Missing wife of real estate investor who made his money from the wife's family.

 

[Seattle1]

I get the sense it was his back up plan to pin it on her - not his primary plan - which was to make it somehow look like CB took off and killed herself? Or just disappeared. Either way, he has failed spectacularly.

it was a crazy way to kill her if you are thinking clinically - I am wondering if he ever fantasized about beating someone to death. It is such a gruesome, difficult, and messy way to do it - that I can only think he must have been excited by the sick idea of it. There are zero benefits to him otherwise that I can see to choose that method, and we know it wasn’t spur of the moment - picking up the first thing you see kind of rage. . Feel terrible/dark to even discuss this but I am trying to make sense of it.

Absolutely on the fantasy beating -- he covered KB's head with a sweater and was seeing SF's face with every swing of the bat.

MOO