CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - *Arrest* #62

[katydid23]

Keep in mind that the defense said on the opening statement iirc that he didn't do it, and it didn't happen at the condo? Soooo, where is the follow up to that with KKL on cross or anyone else? On cross, they are allowed greater latitude on questions (e.g. leading questions)... so all is falling flat.

Goes to other cases where the judge has slammed the defense for stating a defense or information in the opening statements that they had no intention of bringing up.

Still listening for any crumb of what their alternative to PF is going to be.

Judge won't slam them for that until after they put on the defense case---if they don't bring it up then, they will look very weak.

 

[MsBetsy]

PF told JM the bloody nose came from a bar hitting her in the face. Which could be him leaking the truth.

I think he just made that up so he could ask the question about the blood being on the clothes after being washed.
If something like that happened to Kelsey the night before she probably would have mentioned it to her mom.

Imo

 

[MemPat]

I believe instead of “stupid”, you meant “moronicity”!

It was late.
You're right!

 

[srg]

I so love your input.

I believed her, too, simply because nobody confesses to what she did without having done it and the evidence backs it up.

You're kinder than I, though, as I see her going WAY out of her way to put herself in in PF's life and I don't think "morals" are a factor in her life, at all. While I know she was manipulated, I see her as a manipulator, as well.

I’ll take this as an excellent opportunity to clarify

While I have days I’m “kinder” than others, according to my kids, my opinion of KK is actually my clinical assessment based on my expertise. Not based on kindness.

It takes two to tango. Patrick danced with intention to murder Kelsey and needed a puppet. KK danced along, going deeper and deeper into murky waters, kept dancing and realized she’s drowning in quicksand.

KK will get her punishment, and I believe she will never do what she did again. Patrick would.

 

[Aydrianna523]

She did say she found a tooth and threw it away. Same woman who claimed she wanted to "leave clues" for LE. Sure.

Yeah, that thing about leaving clues was her planned alibi in case she missed something imo

 

[katydid23]

BBM:

"Well, exactly."

This is why I now no longer rule out the possibility of PF taking the stand.

It could happen. I mean that seriously.

Never underestimate PF's capacity for moroniocy.

JMO.

True. This Einstein did call the Idaho number, right when he was strolling away from the bloody crime scene. He is 6 fries short of a Happy Meal. For sure....

 

[MemPat]

His brother said that when PF finally got to T'giving dinner, he had changed his boots on the porch and did chores outside 50% of the time he was there.

Moo and IIRC

As one does while the family is gathered for Thanksgiving. Sure!

 

[Artis]

Yes iirc. And from that, I am hoping (praying that I am wrong about no remains) that they have the trough with some dna remnants.. if that makes sense. Because I fully believe that he tossed the rest of her remains in a fast flowing river. moo

If the ranchette hands did dump the contents in a river, wouldn't it seem that LE would have them show LE where they dumped them and then have a diver sift the river bed in that location? I would think bones/bone fragments would sink and not get washed downstream.

 

[katydid23]

I'm hoping the next few bombshells will include the DNA from the tooth. I have a feeling if its hers, it will literally bite him in the a$$

I wish. But I don't think they are going to find any DNA. I hope so, but IIRC, they only get DNA at the roots, and this is supposedly a part of a tooth. But who knows?

ETA: Looks like I am wrong--just saw article posted below by enelram....hope I am wrong...

 

[MemPat]

She also had her lawyer to negotiate for her.

And days were passing with BabyK in the care of the family from Hell.

I don't blame LE for accepting what KK and her attorneys cooked up if it meant saving that little girl.

 

[Aydrianna523]

I'll take a break whilst the thread discusses newbie reporter making statement about seeing CURRENT blood on Patrick in late December after missing and says it was due to a bar hitting her on the face* MOO

vs. testimony from media we have been following that states it was said Patrick said after the fact could it be seen on shirt/pants/boots from nosebleed and putting head down in November and questioning friend if washing would have removed it.

MOO

ETA, toned down post

Oh gotcha.

 

[MemPat]

So now I have two songs alternating in my head.

Julie Andrews as Mary Poppins singing, “Spiteful, stinking, un-pro-pi-tius, wrathful, mal-e-fic-ient...”

And Patrick Frazee as Bob Marley, going merrily about his business singing, “No body, no crime. No bo-dyyyy no crime.” He didn’t sing that for long, though.

ETA: I messed up multi-quote. This was in response to @MemPat and @whoizzit.

Waving my parasol at you as I ride by on the carousel!

 

[Nudgee]

Ha! I’m definitely not an “expert.” But @gitana1 might know.

Even if they couldn’t do anything legally, had this guy come forward, two things could have happened:

PF would have known that law enforcement was aware of these statements, and thought twice about murder.

KK would have probably ran for the hills.

Back to the Dalia Dippolito case as an example.... I'm not real familiar with all the details since I wasn't paying attention back then so don't quote me on things, but it was on our news daily (so is the PF case when they go over what is coming up on Court TV). My husband was called for jury duty on DD's last appeal (think it was the 3rd or 4th appeal.... thankfully, after hours in the courtroom with her and the attorneys, he was not selected for the final jury) Anyway, someone tipped off LE of her desire to pay for a hit man to kill her husband. Based on this, LE set up a sting operation with an undercover LE officer posing to be a part of the "hit". They went through all the motions with DD, including the payment exchange and recorded conversations. They even mocked the death of her husband. You would have to watch some of the videos (especially of her reaction when they told her her husband was dead). Her husband (at the time) was alerted to the sting operation and thankfully is safe today. She is in jail.

Same could have been the case with KB, if someone had only stepped forward. It would have saved KB's life and busted PF for good..... and no one would have been hurt. So sad

 

[MsBetsy]

It is so dangerous for him to take the hot seat. It opens the door for the prosecution to interrogate him in front of the jury, about almost anything he has ever done. He doesn't have the proper answers to most of those questions.

And that story would not be very believable. he talked too much smack about KB to all his friends. So he cannot now pretend it was someone else's idea to kill her.

Yeah, that's pretty much what everyone said when I asked "what if" he testifies?

I figured he doesn't have anything to lose so why not put the blame on KK?

Why not complicate things and put so much doubt in the jury's minds that they can't come to a decision?

They are claiming KK committed the murder on a different day but have not provided any evidence to support that.

I guess we will have to wait and see what the defense is going to do and how they plan to prove that PF did not do it.

Imo

 

[MassGuy]

Yeah, that's pretty much what everyone said when I asked "what if" he testifies?

I figured he doesn't have anything to lose so why not put the blame on KK?
He is already going down so I thought he doesn't really have much to lose.
So why not complicate things and put so much doubt in the jury's minds that they can't come to a decision?

They are claiming KK committed the murder on a different day but have not provided any evidence to support that.

I guess we will have to wait and see what the defense is going to do and how they plan to prove that PF did not do it.

Imo

I can’t wait for the defense to present their argument, it’s bound to be absolutely hilarious.

 

[Aydrianna523]

And days were passing with BabyK in the care of the family from Hell.

I don't blame LE for accepting what KK and her attorneys cooked up if it meant saving that little girl.

That's of top importance in all this for sure!

 

[MassGuy]

If the ranchette hands did dump the contents in a river, wouldn't it seem that LE would have them show LE where they dumped them and then have a diver sift the river bed in that location? I would think bones/bone fragments would sink and not get washed downstream.

Yes, and there probably wouldn’t have been a landfill search.

 

[katydid23]

The defense is not up. The prosecution is presenting their case. The defense is allowed to ask simple questions of clarification, but there has been no "cross-examination yet. How many simple questions of clarification did Adam Steigerwald rapid fire at KK in a very short time? Three dozen or so? He clearly doesn't believe a word that she said, and his turn to examine her story in depth is still coming. IMO

There hasn't been any cross examination yet? Don't they have their chance at cross right after every witness?

It is true, his chance for a deep dive is coming soon. But 60 more witness with even more bombshells are up first.

How is he going to call KK out as a liar, after so much evidence corroboration comes into the trial first?

 

[enelram]

I wish. But I don't think they are going to find any DNA. I hope so, but IIRC, they only get DNA at the roots, and this is supposedly a part of a tooth. But who knows?

ETA: Looks like I am wrong--just saw article posted below by enelram....hope I am wrong...

Yup, you're wrong. That article is long and hard to follow if you don't like scientific reading but it does say they can extract dna from all 3 parts of a tooth- the pulp, dentin and
enamel. I think that's correct.

 

[Kapua]

I can’t wait for the defense to present their argument, it’s bound to be absolutely hilarious.

I predict that the defense will adopt the "hole-poking" approach. But you can't poke holes in solid steel. MOO