CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - *Arrest* #63

[Kapua]

Good interview, and look at the amount of views that she is getting, good for her and her career with social media!

What struck me was that the outline in the hay met the measurements of the tote.

That reminds me of the concrete residue in the exact shape of the buckets that Scott Peterson used to make homemade anchors to weigh Laci's body down in the bay. One thing these perps have in common is the belief that they will not be caught or convicted. MOO

 

[enelram]

I wonder if May will explain how the discolored
hay bale happened. Were there holes in the bottom of the tote? Did they show this yet?
Is it possible PF tipped the tote over on the side when using the forklift and liquids
flowed out onto the hay?

 

[Seattle1]

Interesting that they are going to call the mother of one of PF's ex-girlfriends. Looks like the prosecution has quite a few cards up its sleeve. MOO

Mrs C. gave Dateline interview. Confirmed PF behavior towards women consistent -- he only found new victims. MOO

 

[Lhughessk]

Of course. There’s nothing wrong with circumstantial evidence. Almost every case that goes to jury trial is based on circumstantial evidence unless the issue isn’t whodunit but how crazy or self defense.

People are confused that circumstantial evidence is not good evidence. It’s pretty much everything except a confession or a witness who saw the whole crime.

And I would argue that it’s superior to the direct evidence of a witness. Eyewitness testimony is unreliable.

 

[susiQ]

The way the prosecution is heading, I no longer think we’re going to hear from SF.

I don’t know where she fits in anymore.

Maybe that was the whole point of having her as a "possible" witness. Keep her out of that courtroom. That's "some kind" of justice Torture not being able to support her demon child. JMHO

 

[Lore Listener]

Of course. There’s nothing wrong with circumstantial evidence. Almost every case that goes to jury trial is based on circumstantial evidence unless the issue isn’t whodunit but how crazy or self defense.

People are confused that circumstantial evidence is not good evidence. It’s pretty much everything except a confession or a witness who saw the whole crime.

Just to dovetail with what you are saying, my family member--who was a judge--has said that circumstantial evidence is usually a lot more credible than eyewitnesses anyway, because human brains are just really unreliable.

 

[NuttMegg]

I wonder if May will explain how the discolored
hay bale happened. Were there holes in the bottom of the tote? Did they show this yet?

It could have tipped over when the fork lift placed it up there. I think it was a fork lift, (front loader of tractor?) anyway, however it was lifted up there mechanically it could have been heavier on one side.

 

[gitana1]

I guess I have quite a bit of confidence that there will be even more bombshell evidence presented in the next week or so. Everything we’ve heard so far represents just HALF of the state’s case.

Good point about JM. I guess I was thinking that the DA would have gone ahead and charged PF, which would have probably brought people like JM out of the woodwork afterward if not before.

Not sure SUSAN Powell is a great example. The fact there wasn’t an arrest didn’t mean there was never going to be one. Sometimes with no body cases it causes delays before arrest, but the end result is the same. it’s interesting to ponder. Would Scott Peterson have been arrested without bodies? Maybe when this is all over, Dan May can give us some insight on how they would have proceeded without KK.

Susan Powell is a great example. Husband wasn’t charged for three years. He was able to keep custody of his kids for most of that time. Then he was allowed to have visitation and murdered his children during it.

Not one thing suggested they were close to prosecuting the case.

No body cases are difficult and aren’t brought to trial unless they’re more than iron clad. I am confident that without Krystal’s cooperation there would be no prosecution for murder at this time and maybe never. That’s my opinion.

 

[AgeofAquaruis]

Part of me has been hoping for this. Let DA May leave her to stew outside the courtroom, wondering what is happening. She's already made it clear that she'll plead the 5th and I'm not sure that a mother's refusal to implicate herself or her son is really of any value at this point. Her nastiness towards KB was sickening, as was her refusal to give the Berreths access to their grandchild, but it is really peripheral to the murder.

Oh the Irony, another side piece. It must really burn her up, not being in the court room.

 

[Steelslady]

So it’s supposed to be three weeks. Defense will have their witnesses (that might be super short) and then any rebuttal witnesses. Seems like they should have continued on with whatever witness they had available, skipping over whoever isn’t there.

Looks like the Fung Wah bus is late bringing in the out of staters.

 

[gitana1]

Interesting. I wonder if attorney client privilege applies there. Since that attorney quit, and is not his defence Lawyer.

It does.

 

[Seattle1]

I thought somewhere we saw that the friend wanted KK's truck and she instigated the switch ? rather than KK wanting the friends sedan ? anyone recall this?
MOO

Yes -- reportedly MG requested to borrow KK's truck for her move.

 

[gitana1]

Would the defense have been obligated to provide that information to the prosecution?

No.

 

[Niner]

Today marks Day 7 on the Patrick Frazee murder trial.

Oops - Somewhere along the way I have gotten the Day # wrong....

Trying to keep up here! fast moving.

Slagle was among eight witnesses called to the stand during morning testimony.

I only have 7... who am I missing?
Delynn Bird
Allison Wirght
Megan Garrison
Rodney Draper
Robert Slagel
Joshua Hayes
Tonya Atkinson

Is it Joseph Moore from yesterday? No one mentioned him in the tweets...

 

[ajaylee]

<modsnip: quoted post was removed>


I particularly agree in this case. So much of the evidence would have been lost if the investigation hadn't kicked into high gear when it did: the camera footage from KB's neighbor, the camera footage from local businesses documenting PF's, KB's and KK's whereabouts, the cellphone records, the bale of hay in the barn. There simply wouldn't have been enough evidence left to bring a case to court.

 

[gitana1]

Or to preserve a later appeal about ineffectiveness of counsel. Or both. And I can see how the PD lawyer wouldn’t be interested in delays; the sooner he gets this case behind him the sooner he can move on to cases that are private pay.

They asked for a delay. The request was denied.

 

[zea mays]

Part of me has been hoping for this. Let DA May leave her to stew outside the courtroom, wondering what is happening. She's already made it clear that she'll plead the 5th and I'm not sure that a mother's refusal to implicate herself or her son is really of any value at this point. Her nastiness towards KB was sickening, as was her refusal to give the Berreths access to their grandchild, but it is really peripheral to the murder.

I'm thrilled she's stuck out in the hallway.

I wonder if May will explain how the discolored
hay bale happened. Were there holes in the bottom of the tote? Did they show this yet?
Is it possible PF tipped the tote over on the side when using the forklift and liquids
flowed out onto the hay?

I still think that the blood/body fluids seeped out through the wheels. Probably pooled under the tote. Your scenario is possible as well.

Mrs C. gave Dateline interview. Confirmed PF behavior towards women consistent -- he only found new victims. MOO

Thank you. I couldn't recall which network she gave the interview to. Here's a MSM link to part of the interview if people are interested.
Dateline sits down with mom whose daughter dated Patrick Frazee

 

[gitana1]

If PF had any consultation

Unless things are far different in Idaho and Colorado than where I live, expired tags just gets you a ticket, not impounding.

Ok but do you want to risk getting pulled over when transporting a body?

Regardless, it appears testimony show the friend instigated the switch.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

I wonder too! Taking a shower and changing his clothes to another nondescript shirt and jeans?

Why didn’t he put a lot of the items he told KK to remove into the tote with the body? What on earth was he doing? I think she said he half-heartedly tried to clean up a little bit with wet wipes.

With all the blood that was in so many different and high places etc. in the bathroom, I would consider that indeed he did shower afterwards. And it was blood transfer from his body, and possible splashing during his shower that caused many of the areas that were processed.

I can think of one alternative but I just don't want to go there As to the blood and the bottom front scrape area on the toilet.... I just cannot make my mind go there that he actually moved the body there to wash off in the shower as I haven't seen that there are indications he moved the body from the lr/kitchen shared space to the downstairs bath before loading it into the tote.

So my mind just had to go that his pants brushed up against the toilet when he went to shower, which I think he may have done afterwards and changed clothes.

Still looking forward to the information in court as to how many grey t=shirts and jeans he had that were the same outfits. And awaiting his shoes to come back in as they have been mentioned 3 times iirc.

Perhaps he didn't put HIS clothes in tote just in case tote was found, it wouldn't point to him also?

 

[ajaylee]

Re: the hay bale stain.

I don't know if the entire stain is from bodily fluids. Wasn't there snow on the ground at the time of the murder? I thought there was and it was evidence that KB's car hadn't been moved. If so, the bottom of the tote could have been wet with both bodily fluids and contact with snow and the stain could be a mix of both.