CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - *Arrest* #65

[afitzy]

As I said, I would like to see them on a map.

@MyBelle,
Google Maps - Ranch

<modsnip: removed link that was to some place in Russia>

 

[oviedo]

I think this exact issue is sadly present in so many missing cases that I wish LE protocols would change to accommodate the fact that they may have to pivot quickly in the event that foul play has occurred. So often critical hours/days are lost due to the initial look at the scene in a missing case.
MOO

Yes and I do think much is lost when they don’t do this - one only has to look at our Missing forum ...IMO

 

[MsBetsy]

I’d love for PF to testify, and would take that over Ma any day.

I just think there is zero chance of him testifying, and that her testifying is more realistic.

I still think it’s an outside possibility, but I want her exposed for what she is, and what she did. You’re right though, she’s not necessary at this point.

We know PF was late for Thanksgiving. We know he spent half the time outside. And that fire is not in question.

It would be interesting to know what she would say PF told her about the pipe being left at the gate. Or bat, whichever it was.
And also what he said to her about the fire. And the truck being parked on the side of the house.

Imo

 

[afitzy]

As I said, I would like to see them on a map.

@MyBelle, Here is something in the area of Nash Ranch that might be of interest:
Nash Ranch: Near Cripple Creek & Royal Gorge - Houses for Rent in Canon City, Colorado, United States

 

[oviedo]

Curious why you'd like to Ma testify, MG. I don't see where she would add much. So she witnessed the fire but that's already well established that it happened, contained plastic and tooth fragments. If she actually knew PF was going to or did kill Kelsey, don't you think she'd just lie and say she didn't? As for anything implicating herself, she'll take the 5th.

Personally, I'd be way more excited if PF testified knowing he'd totally bury himself.

I’m not MG but I’d like to know if she was home when he brought in the mop and bloody sheet - did he bring it in thanksgiving night with the baby when he was 2 hours late? Or was it when he got ready for the burning ? Someone knows how that mop got there - plus I want to know what he said to her on the phone when he called her after beating KB to death (cell phone testimony he called mom and kk thanksgiving / we know he told kk she had a mess to clean up - what did he say to his mom?)
IMO

 

[BUF]

Sam Kraemer

@SamKraemerTV
·
3m

Someone I think we could see testify for the state tomorrow: Mark Pearson. He’s the Idaho man that Kenney says she gave Berreth’s gun to under a cover story.
@KOAA
#KelseyBerreth #PatrickFrazee #KrystalKenney

 

[Tippy Lynn]

Yes, although I'm not sure what else they could have done except to point out all the lies KK told and make her look unbelievable.
I'm still waiting to hear their explanation of where Kelsey was murdered and when.

I worried about it some but I can't imagine any future attorneys reviewing this case would be able to zero in on fault by these defense attorneys.

I guess they could discover they were deaf or something but the evidence spoke and if they couldn't get Patrick to plea, whatcha' gonna' do?

Of course, we know he could still plead while the jury is out and that wouldn't surprise me!

They don't have much to work with, but I would think they would at least try to come up with some questions for the witnesses.

I'm looking forward to hearing their explanation too.

 

[Artis]

I was furious about this too!

IMO, WPPD was buying PF's good ole boy story that KB was an unstable, drug/alcohol abuser that was prone to taking off and leaving her child.

Reportedly they saw no signs of foul play and did not consider the condo a crime scene until after CB2 discovered blood.

Upon confirmation of the blood evidence -- CB/CB2 were immediately escorted out of the condo without their personal effects.

All too often, missing persons are treated as though they disappeared of their own accord. An exception would be Shannan Watts. That Kelsey's vehicles were there should have raised a lot more concern.

 

[steeltowngirl]

I think this exact issue is sadly present in so many missing cases that I wish LE protocols would change to accommodate the fact that they may have to pivot quickly in the event that foul play has occurred. So often critical hours/days are lost due to the initial look at the scene in a missing case.
MOO

Would be meaningful if something good came out of all of this to address the situation of critical hours being lost when a person goes missing. Like a “Kelsey’s Law”.

Maybe Kelsey’s family will inspire that change in protocol.

 

[katydid23]

I’m not MG but I’d like to know if she was home when he brought in the mop and bloody sheet - did he bring it in thanksgiving night with the baby when he was 2 hours late? Or was it when he got ready for the burning ? Someone knows how that mop got there - plus I want to know what he said to her on the phone when he called her after beating KB to death (cell phone testimony he called mom and kk thanksgiving / we know he told kk she had a mess to clean up - what did he say to his mom?)
IMO

It would be interesting to know what she would say PF told her about the pipe being left at the gate. Or bat, whichever it was.
And also what he said to her about the fire. And the truck being parked on the side of the house.

Imo

I'd like to know the answers to those questions too---but I doubt she'd answer any of it honestly or fully.
She may testify for the defense, and some of that may be asked in cross---but it might be pretty narrowly defined. I doubt the defense will open many windows for the state.

 

[MsBetsy]

They don't have much to work with, but I would think they would at least try to come up with some questions for the witnesses.

I'm looking forward to hearing their explanation too.

Well, if they really gave it their best shot than I would say the defense was pretty weak.
I expected more, but then again its not over yet.

Imo

 

[Aydrianna523]

Would be meaningful if something good came out of all of this to address the situation of critical hours being lost when a person goes missing. Like a “Kelsey’s Law”.

Maybe Kelsey’s family will inspire that change in protocol.

Yes!

 

[katydid23]

All too often, missing persons are treated as though they disappeared of their own accord. An exception would be Shannan Watts. That Kelsey's vehicles were there should have raised a lot more concern.

The big difference between these two cases was that Shanann had a powerful advocate, her best friend, who got the cops moving in the right direction. If she hadn't sent the alarm bells that morning, CW would have had time to stage the crime scene, maybe be able to move her car somehow, set up more time in between to build his own alibi.

PF tried all of the above, and failed miserably because he is such a stooge.

 

[Medstudies]

@MyBelle,
Google Maps

It’s so nice when sleuthers here can find answers so fast and share the results.
Thanks!

 

[Megnut]

It's going to be a long night. Who is left to testify? And it's someone from out of state, right? The guy who KK gave KB's gun to? A hiker who found a burner phone or KB's keys? Toddler K? A 3 year old testified in the UK...

I don't know what anyone could tell us from the wellness clinic KB went to...except to confirm she was there. Doesn't seem bombshelly.

I have zero experience with criminal trials, but the judge's action today tells me that this witness has something to say or something to show that removes all doubt.

How about an expert in extracting DNA from liquified fat?

MOO

 

[MassGuy]

Would be meaningful if something good came out of all of this to address the situation of critical hours being lost when a person goes missing. Like a “Kelsey’s Law”.

Maybe Kelsey’s family will inspire that change in protocol.

The issue here was that not only were critical hours lost, but days were lost.

That was the point of PF’s deception, and he was successful at that.

We learned from the Mackenzie Lueck case for instance, that privacy issues slowed down the ability of law enforcement to obtain search warrants, which also delayed the discovery that they were in fact dealing with foul play.

So any law that changes protocol, will have to strike a balance with privacy. That’s a tough hurdle, as most people value privacy here.

 

[Seattle1]

As we approach coming full circle for KB - this is a summary from one of the first pressers:

Summary of PC:
23 days since KB last seen -- LE don't believe this is intentional,
Search warrant includes several agencies -- warrant sealed,
Asking PF to sit down with investigators,
Suspect/POI? LE not willing to commit,
Wells Fargo fund for family set up,
DA confirms Woodland Park work and partners FBI, CBI, Teller County Sheriff, and Multi States cooperating,
Looking for help from the community with any info beginning with 11/22/18 Thanksgiving,
Woodland Park PD is contact for this investigation

Media Q/A:

Hope is that KB is still alive
Judge had enough info to sign off on search warrant
No briefing on any findings yet (at residence)
Confirming PF has not sat down with investigators (he was last person to see KB)
PF communicating through his attorney
Case is taking toll on WPPD -- rough investigation
Cannot comment on search of PF truck
Text msg to PF from KB phone -- can't comment
CB has not seen the baby girl/granddaughter
LE has seen the baby -- no word/reason on whether baby will be taken from PF

CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #6

 

[GoJacks]

As I said, I would like to see them on a map.

Sorry, I don't know the address of the red barn but if you google, PF's address is easy to find.

Also, since you have opposing views of many, I'd be interested in hearing your take on the DNA evidence of yesterday/today.

 

[oviedo]

The issue here was that not only were critical hours lost, but days were lost.

That was the point of PF’s deception, and he was successful at that.

We learned from the Mackenzie Lueck case for instance, that privacy issues slowed down the ability of law enforcement to obtain search warrants, which also delayed the discovery that they were in fact dealing with foul play.

So any law that changes protocol, will have to strike a balance with privacy. That’s a tough hurdle, as most people value privacy here.

So IMO family and friends must be the advocate no matter how silly we think we may look to LE - we can look to our own technology (phone location apps like Snapchat life360 etc) having a key to our homes given to close friends and family - knowing your people (I text or call my regulars) and knowing and trusting your instincts all can help - if anyone I know went missing - I would be absolutely a PIA for LE and the news media until I knew they were safe - but I’m a sleuther- maybe I’m weird? But I have told friends and family these stories we follow - if something happened to me I’m certain they would be advocates - maybe each of us should make sure there are people who would do the same ? In honor of Kelsey?

 

[steeltowngirl]

It's going to be a long night. Who is left to testify? And it's someone from out of state, right? The guy who KK gave KB's gun to? A hiker who found a burner phone or KB's keys? Toddler K? A 3 year old testified in the UK...

I don't know what anyone could tell us from the wellness clinic KB went to...except to confirm she was there. Doesn't seem bombshelly.

I have zero experience with criminal trials, but the judge's action today tells me that this witness has something to say or something to show that removes all doubt.

How about an expert in extracting DNA from liquified fat?

MOO

Not Toddler K. She was barely one at the time. Hurts to even think of the trauma it would cause her, if it were even possible.

Sam K tweeted it may be Mark Pearson, the guy KK gave the gun to.