CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #15

[cottonweaver]

I think she's sensationalizing it for ratings.

For sure. I took her implication to be that his priority was these/this OP over everything, even DP

I think she's reading here.
Srsly tho, I think she's also getting stuff from SM.

 

[Jennifer17]

I actually just think that he thought that they would just believe his story or even if they didn't, they couldn't prove that he killed them. Maybe he thought that any evidence would be destroyed by the oil.

 

[Rosemadder15]

She did not physically miscarry..she lost the baby, because her life was lost...

My husband and I were ecstatic when we had news of a third child...went for a scan at 15 weeks we were told the baby was dead and to go home and wait to miscarry (the way they handled this angered me! So nonchalant about it all)...

Anyway, my point is at 15 weeks miscarriage...there isn't just blood on the sheets..its COPIOUS...there would have been blood and tissue everywhere.

Agreed with life experience to back it up. At 15 weeks a miscarriage would have caused a lot of blood loss. SW had to have lost her life (for argument's sake - strangulation) which would have caused her loss of life, leading to the baby's loss of life, but probably no blood loss.

 

[OTPTarheel2018]

What if there was no plan?

What if his alter personality made the plan?? And carried it out? And told the detectives his story?

Assuming DID...
I’m sure this was discussed earlier.

I think he’s guilty.

And if the FBI is involved...I think I’ll look at the N.C. Missing Persons website this weekend.

JMO.

 

[MyBelle]

For sure. I took her implication to be that his priority was these/this OP over everything, even DP

I think she's reading here.
Srsly tho, I think she's also getting stuff from SM.

Wouldn't surprise me. In the Scott Peterson case, Nancy Grace was reading the tabloids. She insisted to Larry King that a truck driver had spotted Peterson's boat on the highway and recalled its name was Game Fisher. In reality, that was the model name of that particular boat, not Peterson's name for it.

 

[mickey2942]

I look forward to his explanation and it won't surprise me if he claims an accomplice disposed of the girls. Nothing will surprise me about this case.

Time to throw his mistress under the bus? I hope she has an attorney.

 

[Dum-Dum Sucker]

I 100% believe CW killed his whole family. His claim that SW killed the girls seems ridiculous to me, based on what we've seen and know about SW, the details he included don't seem accurate or likely, his reaction to her supposedly strangling them is nonsensical and implausible, the great lengths he took to cover up a crime implicate him further than what his story suggests, and on and on. But...I've watched his interviews a few times now and some of the things he says - specifically, the things he says regarding his own feelings - I don't know. They seem to have a ring to truth to them. And that's what confuses me.

There's some major dissociation going on. He says three times in one interview "I don't feel like this is even real right now/It doesn't feel like it's real/This doesn't seem real at all." Three times in the span of a few minutes. There's some psychological distress there, possibly some shock, but mostly it sounds like disbelief and denial of what happened, which I think would be less likely if the events were planned out. In another interview, "It's not something I can even fathom in my lifetime" and "It scares the living crap out of me right now just knowing that it's come to this." Then, the multiple mentions of it feeling like a "ghost town," and that staying in the house was "traumatizing," and that it felt like he was "living in a nightmare." It doesn't sound like remorse or regret to me, per se, but it sounds more like a violent episode escalated and he felt (for whatever reason - here's where logic completely fails me) he had to see it through to a terrible end.

Maybe I just can't let my brain go there; maybe it's wishful thinking. But I struggle with believing with confidence this was premeditated in a planned for weeks/months in advance kind of way. I don't know that he just snapped, but I do question if his actions went farther than his initial intentions. It seems like he almost shows some emotion when he speaks about his daughters. Not so much SW.

"I don't feel like this is even real right now/It doesn't feel like it's real/This doesn't seem real at all." "This is like a nightmare."

My take on CW's interview statements like the ones above and others is that the guy was tripping over his tongue to mimic what he guessed somebody would say whose wife and kids are missing.

Mere empty cliches is all the fool could manage, and with a **** eating grin on his face to boot.

 

[MyBelle]

Time to throw his mistress under the bus? I hope she has an attorney.

She'll need one if her hair is found in his truck.

 

[bears10]

Yes I looked up weld jail and they had for " indigents" an alternative, it was a few dollars per week pack of the basics, some shampoo, toothbrush, a couple of snacks , it's on their site but I wasn't aware Def would pay out of their own pockets - had assumed his own family would pay that.

Yes families can pay out of their own pockets. If by def you mean defense I don’t see why the defense would pay for his commissary. He clearly has advocates who think he’s innocent, so I wouldn’t be surprised if they are putting money in his account.

 

[gitana1]

Mainly because I don't see what others see in the SM videos. He appears caring and loving toward the children, I don't see indifference. I don't think he faked it for that long. It's a stretch for me to think he killed the babies without provocation.

I'm probably wrong but I just don't see pure evil.

I don't see indifference either. He did seem like a loving father. Maybe a bit more distant toward the end in videos.

But does that make a difference? Family annihilators are almost universally known as good fathers and husbands, loving family men, before they kill their families. Which is why these cases so shock the conscience.

Sociopaths are charming. Narcisissts are charming. They can fool people.

"Newspapers acted as an invaluable source of information as very few of these 'family annihilators' had criminal records or were known to mental health services beforehand. Some were serving police officers."

Characteristics of family killers revealed: The male dominated crime most common in August

"For all intents and purposes these were loving husbands and good fathers, often holding down high profile jobs and seen publicly as being very, very successful."
https://www.google.com/amp/s/m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_5805eb48e4b08ddf9ece0fad/amp

Do you know how scott peterson was perceived prior to his murder of Laci and his unborn son? An extremely loving and devoted husband. A wonderful man. He had dozens of people write letters for him and/or testify for him at sentencing.

And chris coleman? A devoted husband and father as well. Prayed with his boys. Played endless rounds of catch with them. On the day they died, told them they could not stay at a friend's and garroted them in their beds.

Neil Entwhistle? Same. Many pictures of him smiling widely, beaming at this baby girl. Holdin f her. Playing with her. He shot her in the stomach and left her to bleed to death.

These people lack mental health diagnoses or criminal histories typically. It always seems to come out of the blue. So why should it be so hard for us to believe that he wasn't as into his family as he seemed? Because he looks sweet with his kids in videos on social media? Lots of them did. Before.

 

[OTPTarheel2018]

His use of "inclination" bugged me too.

I think he meant to say, "I have no indication."

But that doesn't totally work either because it implies he was supposed to have some information from her about where she is but mysteriously doesn't have it.

So maybe he meant to say, "I have no information but want to sound like I'm concerned to hide the fact that I actually do have information but I don't have another word so I'll just use 'inclination' since it sounds close enough."

He had no inclination to tell the truth.


jmopinion

Heard this eastern N.C. colloquialism all my life.

 

[MerryB]

What if his alter personality made the plan?? And carried it out? And told the detectives his story?

Assuming DID...
I’m sure this was discussed earlier.

I think he’s guilty.

And if the FBI is involved...I think I’ll look at the N.C. Missing Persons website this weekend.

JMO.

I think he's guilty, too. However, I am not convinced it was planned ahead of time. I'm open to various scenarios at this point. With that said, if he did, for example, get into an argument with his wife and kill her, he then made a conscious choice to kill his children. That's premeditation.

One thing I read in my new issue of People magazine this evening struck me: "Text messages and search histories were not deleted."

Now, this guy might not be the sharpest tool in the shed, but c'mon. If he deleted SM a week prior, he wouldn't have the sense to delete his search history or texts ahead of time if he was planning on murdering his family? This points strongly to unplanned IMO.

 

[cottonweaver]

Yes families can pay out of their own pockets. If by def you mean defense I don’t see why the defense would pay for his commissary. He clearly has advocates who think he’s innocent, so I wouldn’t be surprised if they are putting money in his account.

Agreed you posted that the defence was putting money in his pocket, in your OP.
It's not something that happens in the UK, that 's why I was asking you about it. (Asked is that a standard US system as I had assumed his family would pay , as in my reply upthread)
Where did the info on who is paying CW come from anyway?

 

[RickshawFan]

I also thought it was an odd choice of word. I reckon it's what they call a "malapropism"
He mixed up the words indication & inclination. IMO only

That. He’s probably trying to use a larger vocabulary than he’s used to. Possibilities: he’s been watching too much TV and he thinks people sound this way; he thinks it’ll be more convincing if he sounds official; he’s revealing more than he’s been asked about and he hasn’t had practice in saying this sentence. There are likely many more implications to this confusion between indication and inclination, because of the implementation of his stupidity.

He’s mixed up something concrete (an indication) with a process in his head ‘cos he’s thinking and not using concrete facts. In general, he thinks what he says or hears in his mind can substitute for what is.

 

[tmar]

He probably planned to come back and scour his house for evidence and pick things up and that plan was interrupted. The sheet was probably just a careless oversight on his part. Could be at that point he was in a panicked hurry. I can't believe that through it all he maintained his composure 100%. After the murders, I would think he had some mental clarity issues; more from a getting caught standpoint versus a what have I done standpoint. Should have made a to-do list I guess like alot of criminals do.

It would be great if he had a 'to do' list (of sorts), or parts of his plan, and it has been found: list of times/distance to drive to tanks, computer entries to incapacitate someone silently etc.
With so many lies, he has stated, he may also have notes/points for a reminder perhaps that he would use later, so he 'sticks' to a story.

 

[bears10]

Agreed you posted that the defence was putting money in his pocket, in your OP.
It's not something that happens in the UK, that 's why I was asking you about it. (Asked is that a standard US system as I had assumed his family would pay , as in my reply upthread)
Where did the info on who is paying CW come from anyway?

I did not say that the defense was putting money in his pocket. By *advocates* I meant supporters. I think it was a sarcasm thing that went over your head.

 

[Sillybilly]

As heartwarming as it is, posts containing or referencing the video of CW's mom have been removed. Yes, it was posted on Shanann's FB, but we just don't want to be sleuthing the family. There's just so much pain for those families, we don't want to exacerbate it by Gma finding the video of herself on Websleuths.

 

[cottonweaver]

It would be great if he had a 'to do' list (of sorts), or parts of his plan, and it has been found: list of times to drive to tanks, computer entries to incapacitate someone silently etc.
With so many lies, he has stated, he may also have notes/points for a reminder perhaps that he would use later, so he 'sticks' to a story.

according to ex teacher - a link upthread IDK which page now, think it was by Bill Carson - he almost had photo recall so maybe he thought he could handle all this detail??

 

[Stunned]

The affidavit says bed sheet. It also says that the pattern matches that of the pillowcases and top sheet found in the kitchen trash can. What I am saying is that it is safe to assume it is a fitted sheet, but I haven't seen that reported. It may have been and I've missed it, I just don't remember.
https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/19th_Judicial_District/caseofinterest/2018CR2003/001/Warrantless Arrest Affidavit.pdf

This bothers me soooo much!!!! Who the hell puts bed sheets from a crime scene in the trash for, I don’t know.....next pickup?What kind of mind does this?Why not in tanks with his poor daughters? This man is such a cluster!!

 

[Jennifer17]

I think he's guilty, too. However, I am not convinced it was planned ahead of time. I'm open to various scenarios at this point. With that said, if he did, for example, get into an argument with his wife and kill her, he then made a conscious choice to kill his children. That's premeditation.

One thing I read in my new issue of People magazine this evening struck me: "Text messages and search histories were not deleted."

Now, this guy might not be the sharpest tool in the shed, but c'mon. If he deleted SM a week prior, he wouldn't have the sense to delete his search history or texts ahead of time if he was planning on murdering his family? This points strongly to unplanned IMO.

I think that he really, really did think that he would get away with it and the police would believe his story that she ran off with the children. I am sure that he thought that they would not even look at his phone.
Remember that the day after they disappeared, he was talking to his friends about putting the house on the market. Just before he was arrested.
He was blindsided by it and by then it was too late to scrub his history.