CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #17

[amysmom]

If the defense hires the right expert, I'm sure they can get CW diagnosed with just about anything you like.

BTW, have we seen any photos of his closet? Maybe that would help.

I have not but I have seen Shanann's SHOE closet..WOW! She bought them before she was married & almost ALL don't fit any more due to her Lupus but she said she hopes to possibly be able to wear them again some day.

The only other SHOE closet & amount of SHOES I've ever seen like it belong to very wealthy celebrities..I'm not sure what ALL of this says about Shanann..Not that it really matters but still.

 

[katydid23]

Agree with many points but also want to suggest that we should not assume just bc SW knew about his affair w/Anadarko co-worker that she wanted to separate. She was newly pregnant, had 2 small children, and was by all accounts in love with her husband.

True, we cannot assume she wanted a separation. To me, it depends upon how much she knew about his secret life. Sure, she was in love with him.

But she just voluntarily spent 6 weeks away from him, with her girls and her family in NC. So it seems like she was open to that possibility. And if she had found out there was more than just one AP,and perhaps a male he had met online, she may have opted for a trial separation. Even though she loved him...

If I was in a high risk pregnancy, had 2 small children, and my marriage was in turmoil, I'd want to go home for awhile to get my life stabilized. Even if I wanted to save my marriage, I might choose to retreat for awhile.

 

[katydid23]

SW was a divorced Catholic when she married CW. I am pretty sure SW did not marry CW in the Catholic church.

After watching SW's videos, I think SW had the ability to sell ice to eskimos. I agree the perfect family image helped her recruit, etc., but I think she could have transitioned to a new image of a successful, single mom and ended up with a huge following. JMO.

I agree. I bet many of her clients, were themselves, divorced or single parents. A success story, in spite of difficult divorce/separations, would be a fine transition.

 

[PrimeSuspect]

Two huge red flags are his changing versions. 1) His family disappeared; no affair 2) he saw Shanann strangling Cece on the baby monitor after having killed Bella who lay blue in her bed and he then strangled Shanann; an affair with a co-worker.

The importance of the initial statement to police can’t be overstated as the accused at this point is unaware of any evidence, including witness statements, that may be used against him. NU’s early intervention no doubt stopped him from disposing of the bed linen found on the floor in the master bedroom and in the kitchen trash can. Add to that the neighbour’s surveillance footage and the arrival of the police before he had time to clean up and it’s hardly surprising that he changed his story so quickly.

CW demanding DNA testing of the children is intriguing. His lawyer, Megan Ring, wrote that she wants to make sure DNA from the girls’ bodies is maintained and she has not been able to ascertain whether the prosecution is taking steps to do so. She said, ‘It does not seem clear that the coroner, pathologist, or anyone working on behalf of the prosecution team in autopsy plan to take swabs of the necks of the two decedent children’. She specifically asked for ‘several swabs of the neck’ to be taken, along with control swabs on other parts of the girls’ bodies.

If CW knows his DNA won’t be found on their necks (and no-one, including the police, believes SW strangled her babies), perhaps it’s because he didn’t strangle them but in fact smothered them. I’m looking forward to the autopsy results. I would have thought that if he had even the slightest shred of humanity, smothering would have been his preferred option. How a father could look into their eyes and see the sheer terror on their little faces as he murdered them is simply beyond my comprehension. These were his babies and they obviously loved him. There are many photos showing what appears to have been a once happy family. Only a monster could commit such a horrific and heinous crime, and we’ve seen no sign of remorse at all.

I’m finding it incredibly difficult to follow this case because it’s so distressing. Bella’s song haunts me every day.

Pregnant Colorado mom Shanann Watts was buried in shallow grave in oil field, court documents reveal | Daily Mail Online

Great Post as always, JJ.

Lets hope he dug a big hole for himself with his first statement and it's just downhill from here on in.
I agree there's a good chance he did smother the children and for the reason you've suggested.

Such a tragic and disturbing family murder, after Henri Van Breda I didn't think I could handle another distressing case but it's so incomprehensible, it's grabbed my attention and won't let go, there's a need to make sense of it all. CW is a monster!
I'm hoping this trial will have the same outcome, CW never experiences freedom again.

 

[MerryB]

True, we cannot assume she wanted a separation. To me, it depends upon how much she knew about his secret life. Sure, she was in love with him.

But she just voluntarily spent 6 weeks away from him, with her girls and her family in NC. So it seems like she was open to that possibility. And if she had found out there was more than just one AP,and perhaps a male he had met online, she may have opted for a trial separation. Even though she loved him...

If I was in a high risk pregnancy, had 2 small children, and my marriage was in turmoil, I'd want to go home for awhile to get my life stabilized. Even if I wanted to save my marriage, I might choose to retreat for awhile.

Yes, the 6 week trip could’ve been a separation, absolutely. I just don’t think we should assume it was. NU said SW told her she wanted to keep her family together. We know she was a fighter. We have to look at both possibilities.

 

[Waterdog]

It seems so WRONG to me that Shanann & her beloved children were buried with the last name 'WATTS"..It is their legal name but under the horrific circumstances of their deaths I strongly feel that Shannan's maiden last name should've been used instead..Is there a reason why that couldn't happen?

Probably wanted to keep it the same as her children.

 

[Mo Thuairim]

And was catholic ,so not sure if her beliefs on marriage would include divorce , just a thought . I also think the perfect family image projected a success formula that gave her sales and recruitment opportunity for success . It’s a lifestyle that most consider iconic.

She was already divorced so her Catholicism wouldn't have factored into her decision to leave Chris or not. But perhaps her being divorced once already would make her very reluctant to initiate another divorce without trying really hard to solve their problems first...

 

[MerryB]

I have not but I have seen Shanann's SHOE closet..WOW! She bought them before she was married & almost ALL don't fit any more due to her Lupus but she said she hopes to possibly be able to wear them again some day.

The only other SHOE closet & amount of SHOES I've ever seen like it belong to very wealthy celebrities..I'm not sure what ALL of this says about Shanann..Not that it really matters but still.

SW turned a spare bedroom into her “Cinderella Closet” (pink) but also had a closet in the master (purple) per her SM posts. All were extremely organized. Are you referring to the walls of shoes?

 

[MerryB]

She was already divorced so her Catholicism wouldn't have factored into her decision to leave Chris or not. But perhaps her being divorced once already would make her very reluctant to initiate another divorce without trying really hard to solve their problems first...

Agree. Plus they had/were having children together.
ETA: IMO wanting to do the work to save your marriage is not a bad thing. She may have not known the extent of what was going on.

 

[RavenCC2020]

I think SW was being covertly abused. I've thought this from the start of this case. For one, he was having an affair, or affairs.

I also think the way he pursued her (from SW's video) was a red flag. In her video, she talks about being very ill when he started to pursue her, and she kept putting up roadblocks, but he kept coming back. JMO, he wasn't respecting her boundaries.

More will likely come out. JMO

True and men like him who like to be in control yet are weak individuals will actively seek out someone they feel are weaker then themselves. I mentioned this before, he misread Shannan from the get go. He took her current down trodden state at the time to be her overall character. He had no idea how resilient she was. She always made a comeback because she was strong and determined to. He had no idea that there was a very positive, energetic upbeat person soooooooooooo unlike himself that he would soon be dealing with. He could no longer be the knight in shining armor/hero he enjoyed being.

 

[Mo Thuairim]

Agree. Plus they had/were having children together.
ETA: IMO wanting to do the work to save your marriage is not a bad thing. She may have not known the extent of what was going on.

Yes, given the girls and her pregnancy and the fact that she clearly loved him and was on her second marriage, I think she would have been very motivated to work on the relationship, even if she found out about some cheating. We don't yet know the full scope of his extramarital shenanigans but it seems to have been extensive. I'm not sure she could forgive him cheating on her with multiple partners but it is unlikely that she knew that.

 

[passionflower]

When I found my X had an affair.....no more sex. I was scared of what STD I might get. She was trash.......
So why did SW get pregnant if she knew??? Just a personal thing. Did she think she could keep him? But did she want him?

 

[Starkville]

True and men like him who like to be in control yet are weak individuals will actively seek out someone they feel are weaker then themselves. I mentioned this before, he misread Shannan from the get go. He took her current down trodden state at the time to be her overall character. He had no idea how resilient she was. She always made a comeback because she was strong and determined to. He had no idea that there was a very positive, energetic upbeat person soooooooooooo unlike himself that he would soon be dealing with. He could no longer be the knight in shining armor/hero he enjoyed being.

That makes sense! If he thought she was vulnerable and needed him, maybe he liked being the hero, the savior. And then she grew stronger and didn’t need him anymore...

Although I really don’t think she was a weak person at all. She seemed very strong and capable.

She got more done in a day than I do all week!

 

[Thepoet]

Probably wanted to keep it the same as her children.

Jeffery MacDonald's family were buried under his name, but after he was convicted Colette's brother changed all the gravesites to Stevenson, the family name. I believe SW's family can do the same.

 

[passionflower]

On the 6 week to NC he went also for a week. Wonder if someone counseled her to go back to mend the marriage or get ready for the divorce. How sad.

 

[NanZDrew]

I would put Andrea Yates in a separate category from people like CW. She was clearly suffering from extreme mental illness and delusions. Deanna Laney out of Tyler is another example in that same category. These women come under the delusion that their children must be killed in order to save them. It is very sad.

ETA: After I posted this, I saw that NanZDrew made the same connection.

Agree. I would put CW, Darlie Routier, and Susan Smith in the same category. Very similar behavior after the deaths.

 

[ZsaZsa]

When I found my X had an affair.....no more sex. I was scared of what STD I might get. She was trash.......
So why did SW get pregnant if she knew??? Just a personal thing. Did she think she could keep him? But did she want him?

Not sure she "knew" or was still hoping it wasn't true.
Shanann Watts 'Didn't Want to Believe' Husband Chris Was Cheating: Friend

 

[PhoneJockey]

It seems so WRONG to me that Shanann & her beloved children were buried with the last name 'WATTS"..It is their legal name but under the horrific circumstances of their deaths I strongly feel that Shannan's maiden last name should've been used instead..Is there a reason why that couldn't happen?

It bugs me that their date of death, listed in the obituaries, was August 16th.

Also wanted to add to the discussion waaaayyyyy back about burial vs. cremation.

Skip ahead if you don't want to read.

I didn't watch the entire funeral, but I did see part of a video where the caskets were being brought out of the church and put into the hearses. I noticed that it took the pallbearers noticeably more effort to lift Shanann's casket than it did with the girls' caskets, leading me to say with a fair amount of certainty that they were indeed buried and not cremated and interred.

 

[MerryB]

When I found my X had an affair.....no more sex. I was scared of what STD I might get. She was trash.......
So why did SW get pregnant if she knew??? Just a personal thing. Did she think she could keep him? But did she want him?

I understand what you’re saying, but this is actually very common in relationships where there’s been infidelity, believe it or not. It’s called “reclaiming” your spouse, and it’s an effort to re-forge that bond, stake your claim, show him & others you’re unbreakable.

 

[PhoneJockey]

And was catholic ,so not sure if her beliefs on marriage would include divorce , just a thought . I also think the perfect family image projected a success formula that gave her sales and recruitment opportunity for success . It’s a lifestyle that most consider iconic.

She has already had one divorce. I don't think it is AS frowned upon in the Catholic church as it has been previously. I believe they still have you do a type of religious "anulment" if you want to stay active/a member of the church, but it's doable.