Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW GUILTY* #47

[Johnny1181]

I don't think it will explain a thing. I've been on Food Stamps and Medicaid in the past, and we're currently going through bankruptcy. It sucks, but we haven't gone on a killing rampage. If he were stressed about money, then I could buy it as a motive for self-harm. It would definitely not explain him taking out his entire family.

I see no outside influences "explaining" this. CW's actions were his and his alone.

Hang in there. It will get better. You have a fresh start.

 

[mtnlites]

I would have a very hard time, wanting to visit with my son, if he strangled my grand baby and my Daughterinlaw.

I love him with all my heart, and I do believe in unconditional love---kind of.

You don't need to get a masters or make millions or never make mistakes. I will love you unconditionally ---with the exception of killing your family.

Seriously, it would be hard to want to reward that behavior with family visits etc. JMO

Have you seen the movie WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT KEVIN? It explores the relationship between a mother and a son who went on a school shooting spree and then took out his dad and little sister. I realize that this is slightly off topic, but I think the complicated continuing relationship between CW and his parents is interesting and something worth contemplating. As a mother, I have no idea how I'd feel.

 

[Johnny1181]

Have you seen the movie WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT KEVIN? It explores the relationship between a mother and a son who went on a school shooting spree and then took out his dad and little sister. I realize that this is slightly off topic, but I think the complicated continuing relationship between CW and his parents is interesting and something worth contemplating. As a mother, I have no idea how I'd feel.

That is an amazing movie. And this is a very complicated issue. Thank you for being so honest.

 

[mtnlites]

Hang in there. It will get better. You have a fresh start.

Thank you. I appreciate it. Our medical bills became more than our mortgage. It sucked. This is actually a bit of relief now.

I can see how outside stressors could have affected CW's mental health. Life is hard, bad things happen. But if such things made you depressed then IMO it would be far more likely to hurt yourself than to hurt the people around you. Christian Longo was in the same position financially and took out his family because he supposedly didn't want them to "suffer" just because he couldn't pay the bills. It's a cowardly and, IMO, stupid thing to do. Even if CW blamed SW for what had happened (as a way of shirking personal responsibility, not because she truly did anything wrong), it wouldn't explain why he turned on his children. I don't want to be a broken record, but his actions showed depravity. There's not any "evidence" that could be brought up right now that would make me understand how he could hurt his kids and then treat their little bodies in the manner in which he treated them. As parents, most of us have a biological need to protect our children. What he did IMO goes against nature.

 

[liltexans]

Have you seen the movie WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT KEVIN? It explores the relationship between a mother and a son who went on a school shooting spree and then took out his dad and little sister. I realize that this is slightly off topic, but I think the complicated continuing relationship between CW and his parents is interesting and something worth contemplating. As a mother, I have no idea how I'd feel.

I think you're on to something here with this train of thought. I expect someone will write an in depth book about CW, similar to the books about Scott Peterson and one of my favorite true crime books, "Shattered", about David Temple. If the author researches CW's life thoroughly, I imagine they will uncover some interesting mother-son and father-son family dynamics, based on what we know about the majority of family annihilators.

 

[Charlot123]

CW has been presented as an introvert (I am sure he was on some level, hiding so many secrets and seemingly lacking the normal range of human emotions and empathy) but he managed to fairly aggressively go after SW after she initially turned him down. He decided he wanted her and that was that, he would not be thwarted. I would guess he was the same with AP, who (IMO) was going to give him a major financial leg up. This "introvert" also seemed quite interested in popping on camera when he was in the b.g. of SW's videos; he may have been awkward and stiff and a little clueless, but he appeared to like it. On his sham TV interviews, he seemed quite chatty, and actually the least stiff we have seen him; I think he was excited and pleased with himself. I don't think he is a true introvert at all. I think it's more that he was masked, had a hidden persona, whether it be his sexcapades, bisexuality, inner rage, aggression, resentment and hostility or just shame. His "talk" about relationships was mechanical bordering on idiotic. Nothing genuine or spontaneous or introverted about him. IMO MOO.

Agree about financial leg up. Maybe even a social push?

All of this being said - there is a chance that AP matched CW better by virtue of having similar interests. It could have been the case, but the financial interest of CW can never be discounted.

About CW. I think initially he was, mostly, an introvert. Not fully but predominantly.

But with time, life with SW, a very extroverted person, turned him into an "ambivert". It has two meanings: a) an introvert who learned to come across as more interested in people than he truly is (CW was like it, I think), and, b) a person coming across as shy and introverted who is IRL quite interested in people and tries to have more friends (a very sympathetic introvert).

But either way, it was SW to whom CW in a major way owed the development of his "social language".

This absolutely genius observation made by two Websleuthers, that CW was mimicking SW's language when speaking about the girls, prompts me to think that he was copying many things from SW, both in the way of social skills and language.

And he likely learned a lot from her. And owed a lot of his "new" charm to her.

I always wondered about one thing. I don't know much about SW, how she was academically, but it seems that her social IQ was very high. How come she missed the assassin developing next to her? Why did she trust him?

Now I think that with time, he learned to repeat what she was thinking and saying, and she probably thought they were thinking in unison.

 

[Jennifer17]

Have you seen the movie WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT KEVIN? It explores the relationship between a mother and a son who went on a school shooting spree and then took out his dad and little sister. I realize that this is slightly off topic, but I think the complicated continuing relationship between CW and his parents is interesting and something worth contemplating. As a mother, I have no idea how I'd feel.

I didn't like that book. It was fiction and the relationship between mother and son was far to simplistic to my mind.
He hated her from the moment he was born. He also did not use a gun, it was a crossbow.

 

[MCDRAW]

The Written Waiver and Guilty Plea https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/19th_Judicial_District/caseofinterest/2018CR2003/Written Waiver and Guilty Plea.pdf CW signed has something at item 12 that's concerning. It looks like he can file a Notice of Appeal within 7 weeks of sentence. It also looks like he can seek a post-conviction reduction of sentence within 18 weeks. Maybe I've read this incorrectly. I hope so.

I wondered about that too. I also read something right after saying he had to pay restitution for burial and funeral expenses something about paying for any treatment. I wonder what that might mean too.

 

[Jennifer17]

I wondered about that too. I also read something right after saying he had to pay restitution for burial and funeral expenses something about paying for any treatment. I wonder what that might mean too.

I think that that is par for the course, isn't it? All convicted criminals can appeal the length of sentence as being too harsh.

 

[MsBetsy]

Have you seen the movie WE NEED TO TALK ABOUT KEVIN? It explores the relationship between a mother and a son who went on a school shooting spree and then took out his dad and little sister. I realize that this is slightly off topic, but I think the complicated continuing relationship between CW and his parents is interesting and something worth contemplating. As a mother, I have no idea how I'd feel.

Yes. Tilda Swinton and Ezra Miller. Good movie. Killed them with a bow and arrow. That kid had major developmental issues. Antisocial behavior for sure. I wonder what CW was like as a kid and what the family dynamics were.

 

[katydid23]

One of the main reason that mistresses are so alluring and captivating, is that they can focus entirely upon 'their man.' There are no crying babies, no dishes to be done, no bills needed to be paid. You meet them in the dark of night for pleasure, and no need to face daily pressures or difficulties.

Coming home to the wife is much less exciting and pleasurable. She wants to know where you've been and if you paid the mortgage yet.

 

[SweetPeas56]

Ohhhhh, no - I thought you were looking for the video with, "I'll leave it at that." Sorry, SweetPeas!

This may be the dancing one, I'm not sure which one you were referring to: Shanann Watts

You're very awesome @PommyMommy ..... Thanks! That's the one

 

[Jennifer17]

I wondered about that too. I also read something right after saying he had to pay restitution for burial and funeral expenses something about paying for any treatment. I wonder what that might mean too.

I think that that just means that he has a financial debt to them apart from the other not so concrete debts.

 

[Jennifer17]

One of the main reason that mistresses are so alluring and captivating, is that they can focus entirely upon 'their man.' There are no crying babies, no dishes to be done, no bills needed to be paid. You meet them in the dark of night for pleasure, and no need to face daily pressures or difficulties.

Coming home to the wife is much less exciting and pleasurable. She wants to know where you've been and if you paid the mortgage yet.

Yes, one hundred times.

 

[ZsaZsa]

I've always been a dog guy. Had my girls from when they were born til the day they had to be put to rest.

Now I've got these cats that I'm figuring out what to do with lol! We make it work lol. Seriously, true story, a homeless couple living in their car in St Louis asked me to take them in as I was walking to the grocery store. I did.

They're like mini dogs. Fetch and particularly one growls her head off when she hears something amiss near my windows or doors.

As protective as my one is of the door and both are of me, I started thinking about Shanann's dog Deeter (spelling?). If someone were in my home harming me my Sammie and Monkey would be going crazy. I keep seeing posts in past threads about a well check called in because the dog was barking. Is this true? Any links? Was that phoned in? Just trying to piece the events of that horrific weekend together. I missed the resolution of this topic

Here you go - America's Most Evil Dad 'Cared More About Dog' Than Wife & Children He Murdered

 

[Jennifer17]

Yes. Tilda Swinton and Ezra Miller. Good movie. Killed them with a bow and arrow. That kid had major developmental issues. Antisocial behavior for sure. I wonder what CW was like as a kid and what the family dynamics were.

I didn't see the movie. I had no desire to after reading the book. There was no love hate relationship between that mother and son, it was all hate, which is not what happens in these relationships in real life.

 

[celticthyme]

Yes. Tilda Swinton and Ezra Miller. Good movie. Killed them with a bow and arrow. That kid had major developmental issues. Antisocial behavior for sure. I wonder what CW was like as a kid and what the family dynamics were.

I was wondering about his younger days, and found that he was an exceptionally bright student, well liked by his school mates and teachers. He got a Scholarship for some kind of Technical program. Interesting information out there.

 

[Jennifer17]

I was wondering about his younger days, and found that he was an exceptionally bright student, well liked by his school mates and teachers. He got a Scholarship for some kind of Technical program. Interesting information.

He was exceptionally good at technical things, which is not to be diminished, but I am not sure that he was bright outside of that.

 

[MsBetsy]

I didn't like that book. It was fiction and the relationship between mother and son was far to simplistic to my mind.
He hated her from the moment he was born. He also did not use a gun, it was a crossbow.

That's the book, in the movie the relationship was much more complex, especially when he was older. But I think the point was that maybe CW did not connect with people even as a child, or has Narcississtic tendencies, or even autistic tendencies like the child in the movie. The relationship between mother and son often plays a role in the developing personality, but sometimes the child becomes this way despite parent interactions and good parenting. Jmo

 

[mtnlites]

I didn't see the movie. I had no desire to after reading the book. There was no love hate relationship between that mother and son, it was all hate, which is not what happens in these relationships in real life.

I'm sorry. I didn't think this would turn into a discussion about the story. And yes, I forgot that it was a crossbow. Stories run together for me. I was less interested in his side than in how SHE felt afterwards. Someone asked how his mother might feel and if she would visit him. That was the only media reference I had to offer for such a scenario.