Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW GUILTY* #47

[Tortoise]

That all makes a lot of sense molly. I think I'm looking for something that would let me know he never loved them, not in the way I love for instance. Maybe he was amused by them but I'm talking about risk your life for your kids kind of love. I don't believe he did one day but then it dissipated until one day there was none left. I think he never had the capacity to love. He fooled them into believing he did though. He was a master of pretending.

 

[Thepoet]

CW is a small (his character and substance), selfish, despicable person (male, but not a man) who brutally murdered the family that loved him, gave to him, and trusted him. He brutally murdered his two daughters who depended on him to protect them. He ended four (4) lives of great value and potential, sacrificing them on the alter of his vanity and selfish needs!. He has betrayed ALL who cared about him. He will soon cease to be CW and will become Inmate no. - - - - - - for the rest of his life. Most will want, and try, to forget him. Eventually he will become just an ugly memory, if he is remembered at all, and a small footnote in the history of family violence. He is now, nothing, except maybe a warning! Or maybe the remnants of something very revolting on the bottom of mankind's shoe.

 

[Tortoise]

And it states that all evidence can be destroyed. Maybe come the 19th, CW will have changed his mind. Maybe not.

Oh how I'd love to know how it all went down. Who approached who and who said what first.

 

[Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats]

G

There's a level of sexism and self-loathing coming from the people, all women that I witnessed, that were determined to slander and fabricate scenarios based on the words of an admitted killer. (He always admitted to having killed SW and Nico so why they thought him incapable of killing Bella and Cece is beyond me.) It's a reality in our world but this case really brought it to the forefront. Why do certain women feel compelled to believe a murderous male over an innocent female victim? I realized for some there's an element of fear in these cases because admitting that SW was just a regular, working mom trying to make a better life for her girls and family whose husband decided to slay them all opens up the reality that it could happen to them also. Yet this goes beyond that need to separate yourself. The number and level of openly venomous remarks was just appalling.

Great post, it went and still is going, way beyond trying to find a reason to make ones self feel safer. It is disgusting.

 

[Thepoet]

There are literally thousands of marriages that deal with those exact same stresses - they end in divorce not murder. All you mentioned is irrelevant.

I believe there were signs of his extreme selfishness but I think Shanann was gaslighted badly by him, and was likely very confused for some time and kept trying to revert back to the CW who was so loving and so supportive. A link to a Nancy Grace podcast was posted and I listened to it last night. Some don't like NG's style, but I think she really lays it out there and she doesn't pull any punches.

NG had guests on the podcast and one stated Shanann was earning around $80,000 a year when he murdered her. She was making it happen and she was starting to surpass his earnings, which had declined in recent years. That was very hard on his ego, I believe. I think SW was pumping him up and praising him because she knew it was hard on him.

A couple of guests stated he was a Narcissist and one referred to his sociopathic behavior. It hasn't officially been stated what's wrong with him, but based on what he's done, I've always thought he falls in the Cluster B personality disorder spectrum and that it is extreme, and it might be psychopathy.

Nancy Grace referred to him as a philanderer and although it hasn't been confirmed, I do think he was a serial cheating philanderer and that it probably had been going on for some time. His income went down, at a time when most young men with young families are working their rear ends off, trying to advance to better support their families.

JMO, he was very likely doing his cheating during work hours and that would explain the income decline. How would Shanann know he was cheating if he was home in the evenings and on the weekends, "acting" like a devoted father and loving husband? How would she know?

I think he was very stealth in his cheating and he didn't want Shanann to know, because that would blow his image, and expose him as a fraud. He was a fraud, IMO, and probably from the very start of their relationship. As a guest attorney pointed out on the podcast, if CW ended up in family court, his secrets and misbehavior would come out.

His own behavior at home began to give him away. Shanann began to suspect he was having an affair, but she had a hard time believing he would even be able to do that. I also think she found out, likely when she was in NC about his cheating, and I think CW's house of cards was beginning to collapse in the weeks and days before he murdered them.

My thoughts are that Nancy Grace is onto the backstory of what happened, and I do hope we get more details because those details might help serve as warning signs to others and might help prevent horrific victimization.

JMO

Well said. Kudos and thanks for the NG info.

 

[Tortoise]

Are there rules as to what one can and can’t say or do during a victim impact statement? (e.g. cussing, standing in front of defendant, time limit, etc.)?

Tex McIver. Two of the victims were told by the judge not to say parts of what they had written. I can't remember why now, so sorry because that's not a lot of help. It was on Wild About Trial though (I think) if you want to look it up and watch.

 

[sun16]

So, what does CW do over the next 8 days? Meet with lawyers? Meet with family and friends? Think about if he’s going to say anything, and if so, what? Stress out? Panic? Cry? Sleep? Just sit there?

 

[ZsaZsa]

And it states that all evidence can be destroyed. Maybe come the 19th, CW will have changed his mind. Maybe not.

Struck me as odd that evidence would be returned but I was thinking along the lines of his phone, truck,personal possessions etc- is that normally the case that evidence is returned or destroyed after sentencing?

 

[medea13]

Oh how I'd love to know how it all went down. Who approached who and who said what first.

I wonder if alexa recorded it? I remember several threads back people were mentioning they had one

 

[molly1255]

And it states that all evidence can be destroyed. Maybe come the 19th, CW will have changed his mind. Maybe not.

My thoughts are he's not going to change his mind. If he goes to trial, it will all come out, not only the details of the murders, but also things that expose him as a complete fraud. JMO.

 

[BeanieBod]

Nut allergies are pretty common nowadays. Just last year one of my coworkers disclosed his allergy around the holidays when I was baking and asking about allergies and preferences. I was glad I had gone around and asked before bringing in goods so I could make sure the things given to him weren't exposed to nuts/nut dust at any point.

To be clear, I thought she was allergic to tree nuts. She was not allergic to peanuts as they are legumes.

 

[Tortoise]

I wonder if alexa recorded it? I remember several threads back people were mentioning they had one

Sorry...I meant the machinations of the plea deal.

 

[Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats]

Struck me as odd that evidence would be returned but I was thinking along the lines of his phone, truck,personal possessions etc- is that normally the case that evidence is returned or destroyed after sentencing?

Strange to me too. I guess since he has given up his right to appeals they don’t need to keep it for possible future litigations, idk. Is it possible that was part of the negotiation? To destroy the evidence as to how truly awful CW is?

 

[Trident]

G

Great post, it went and still is going, way beyond trying to find a reason to make ones self feel safer. It is disgusting.

What that post says to me, and maybe I should have quoted it, is women hate other women. Women are the biggest critics of each other. Blaming SW isn't a way of making anyone feel safer, it is a way to make the critics "feel better" than SW. They are telling themselves it would never happen to them because they are better, more worthy, more understand of their man. Women are their own worst enemies. IMO

 

[Charlot123]

A couple of guests stated he was a Narcissist and one referred to his sociopathic behavior. It hasn't officially been stated what's wrong with him, but based on what he's done, I've always thought he falls in the Cluster B personality disorder spectrum and that it is extreme, and it might be psychopathy.

JMO

The problem is, no one can predict what people have by merely reading about them, nor by watching videos offering snippets of their lives. Also, no one is a one walking diagnosis. He could be cluster B, or cluster A (avoidant), or a mix, plus certain social issues, anxiety, and then, something else. On the other hand, his personality traits might be flattened, not enhanced. We have no information from specialists. We don't know if he was clean/sober, or substances were on board. We know nada to diagnose him.

I can see he was not the greatest speaker, and his actions indicate that he could not imagine the consequences of his acts, because he obviously thought the story would end differently, so there is a major thinking flaw somewhere. Also, he was born without morality in the bigger meaning of this word. But this is all. In terms of prediction, his story so far gives us very little.

 

[Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats]

What that post says to me, and maybe I should have quoted it, is women hate other women. Women are the biggest critics of each other. Blaming SW isn't a way of making anyone feel safer, it is a way to make the critics "feel better" than SW. They are telling themselves it would never happen to them because they are better, more worthy, more understand of their man. Women are their own worst enemies. IMO

Yes they are, I think all you said also is a big part of it.

 

[sun16]

He doesn’t actually SIGN the agreement until Nov. 19, right? Although I’d be shocked if he changes his mind.

 

[Tortoise]

Tex McIver. Two of the victims were told by the judge not to say parts of what they had written. I can't remember why now, so sorry because that's not a lot of help. It was on Wild About Trial though (I think) if you want to look it up and watch.

https://wildabouttrial.com/archives/tex-mciver-trial-video-archive/

I think victim impact statements begin at about 45 minute mark on the sentencing video.

 

[molly1255]

Well said. Kudos and thanks for the NG info.

Thank you. I found the podcast interesting, and while NG always uses a lot of drama, I think she also lays it out the way she sees it, she's passionate and she also uses logic. I don't recall that I have ever once disagreed with her.

 

[Jennifer17]

He doesn’t actually SIGN the agreement until Nov. 19, right? Although I’d be shocked if he changes his mind.

I would be surprised if he hadn't signed it. Nov 19 is just sentencing. He has done his pleas of guilty.