Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW GUILTY* #48

[Seattle1]

Could be a little bit of both. It looks like the defence's first approach to the DA for a deal was around the time of the autopsy reports were released to the defence. I would be really interested to know what that first offer was!

Whatever it was, we know it was rejected by the State!

 

[PommyMommy]

I think that the the entire time from his arrest to his last hearing that nobody, not even his family, could talk to him. Everything had to go through his attorneys. I could be wrong but I don’t think I am.

Article from September 5 when CW was under "close watch protocol." He was allowed phone calls. He may have told his family he couldn't talk to them, but that doesn't appear to be true. Surprise, surprise. MOO

"He is allowed to leave his cell for one hour a day – to shower and make phone calls to his family or to counsel."
Chris Watts under suicide watch at Colorado jail, reports say

 

[NuttMegg]

I think that the the entire time from his arrest to his last hearing that nobody, not even his family, could talk to him. Everything had to go through his attorneys. I could be wrong but I don’t think I am.

It just seems weird.

 

[PommyMommy]

I just listened to Reisch’s .”Punked” podcast. He doesn’t know any more than we do. He comes across as arrogant and unprofessional to me. He seems to believe there’s a viable defense within Shanann’s social media that was overlooked by the defense, that Shanann’s treatment of CW led to the murders, and the defense didn’t take the time to adaquately investigate. Even if some defense attorney could be so persuasive he could convince a jury that Shanann was a domineering shrew who was so unnerving she drove her husband to murder her, what about the three children? What did they do to cause their father to murder them?

Perhaps he missed the part about CW having multiple affairs. Or that he admitted to dumping his daughters in crude oil tanks. Or the news interviews in which CW smiled, laughed and lied his arse off. Sounds to me like he may not be very well informed. MOO

 

[Layla123]

Perhaps he missed the part about CW having multiple affairs. Or that he admitted to dumping his daughters in crude oil tanks. Or the news interviews in which CW smiled, laughted and lied his arse off. Sounds to me like he may not be very well informed. MOO

Exactly!

 

[Marli61]

Facts about Colorado's 'Death Row'

Daily life for death row inmates

Each day an inmate is held awaiting an execution the cost to the state is $102.28. Inmates wear standard issue clothing, which includes prison-made green shirts and green pants.

Death row inmates in Colorado spend 23 hours per day in their own cell. The one hour outside their cell each day is for exercise and showering.

Death row inmates are permitted a television, two books, newspapers, and magazines in their cell.

If the inmates comply with their educational and program requirements, they are permitted to view movies shown by the facility.

Death row inmates are permitted visitors a couple of hours per week. During the inmate's last week, or "warrant week," they may have increased visiting hours.

Each time the inmate is moved, it is done with full restraints and a minimum of two correctional officers.

Regular meals are served three times per day and brought to the inmate's cell. The inmate's requested 'last meal' must be selected from the correctional facility's main menu.

Generally, a death row inmate will serve a minimum of ten years before the sentence of death is carried out.

 

[gitana1]

I would like to ask a question. Had CW been formally convicted to death, would that mean he’d spend his time on the Death Row? This is not fun by itself. Maybe this is what he wanted to avoid?

Yes. It may be what he was avoiding depending on what it's like in CO. In CA and AZ it's horrible. Not sure what CO death row is like.

CO has pretty strict rules about treatment of prisoners though. No solitary except limited time periods. They have had extensive prison reform, apparently. Let me see what I can find out.

Ok. People sentenced to death are housed at the Colorado State Penitentiary in a segregated and maximum security facility.

It looks like there are only three people on death row there. I wonder if they might not be the "kind" of people CW wants to associate with for the rest of his life.

Prisoners are kept in their cells 23 hours per day. It's pretty much like AZ. Terrible.


Facts about Colorado's 'Death Row'

But the last few times the DA has tried a death penalty case the jury has opted for life. Including James Holmes.

Motive is apparently a big part of death penalty decisions. Colorado Springs attorney weighs in on Watts facing death penalty

Also, I recall that Shanann's family expressed ambivalence or disapproval of the death penalty either at the funeral during eulogy and/or the statements written out, or in other public statements at the time.

It's possible fear of death row partially motivated his decision.

 

[sun16]

The first plea deal that was rejected — don’t you think it was probably something to the effect of ‘Ok, I plead guity to definitely killing Shanann, but I totally, like, didn’t kill the girls”.

 

[mtnlites]

I think that the the entire time from his arrest to his last hearing that nobody, not even his family, could talk to him. Everything had to go through his attorneys. I could be wrong but I don’t think I am.

I firmly believe that CW requested the no communication part of this. I don't think he wanted to see his family or talk to them. The very fact that his visitor log was not to be shared to the public says, to me anyway, that he was allowed to have visitors.

 

[mtnlites]

The first plea deal that was rejected — don’t you think it was probably something to the effect of ‘Ok, I plead guity to definitely killing Shanann, but I totally, like, didn’t kill the girls”.

I wonder if the Alford Plea figured into this at all.

 

[gitana1]

Could be a little bit of both. It looks like the defence's first approach to the DA for a deal was around the time of the autopsy reports were released to the defence. I would be really interested to know what that first offer was!

I wonder if it was an Alford plea.

 

[gitana1]

I wonder if the Alford Plea figured into this at all.

Jinx.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Just a note that I looked up on the Internet what the word punked means. I would get a timeout if I posted the actual results from the internet, but one definition is trickery, and the other definition is a homosexual activity between two prisoners. I then went and looked up where the first mention of that was in the threads. It apparently was from the lawyer and the web blog that he does and the title of it.

I find it offensive now that I know why he use that as the title, and what the definition means. Because I don't think he meant trickery, I think he was doing a double entendre/ with the second definition. Perhaps to get more clicks, and this word keeps being used again and again in these threads and gives that web blog person highlights to his show. In my opinion.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

There are conversations that the defense was not privy yet to the evidence other than the autopsy report and questioning the validity of the plea.

Unfortunately, the list of evidence was not attached, purposely, to the plea agreement. I would have liked to have seen that. It was specifically noted on the plea agreement that it was not attached, although the wording within the plea agreement led me to believe it usually would be. I think they wanted even that list to not be published publicly.

 

[Marli61]

I wonder if it was an Alford plea.

Wouldn't the DA have stated that in his last presser?

 

[mtnlites]

Just a note that I looked up on the Internet what the word punked means. I would get a timeout if I posted the actual results from the internet, but one definition is trickery, and the other definition is a homosexual activity between two prisoners. I then went and looked up where the first mention of that was in the threads. It apparently was from the lawyer and the web blog that he does and the title of it.

I find it offensive now that I know why he use that as the title, and what the definition means. Because I don't think he meant trickery, I think he was doing a double entendre/ with the second definition. Perhaps to get more clicks, and this word keeps being used again and again in these threads and gives that web blog person highlights to his show. In my opinion.

I think he probably used it because of the insanely popular Ashton Kutcher television show "Punked." They played pranks on people, usually famous people, and videotaped it. A more modern version of "Candid Camera." We use the term frequently in our house. IMO there's no double entrende there. It's just a popular way of saying "You got tricked" or "I got you".

 

[BabyButterfly]

I'm posting this after a lot of thought and with my husband's permission of course, all pertinent names and some specific details changed.

My MIL is a classic FA mom. Scary, but true.

I think it's so important to explore the mother/son relationship in FA cases. I firmly believe it's a large part of what is instilled these "men" to believe the wife (and children) are disposable at some point. I believe there are a lot more moms in the equations than sons, because the stereotype of the MIL not liking or approving of the DIL is so prevalent. You have to have the perfect storm of the son who has a certain personality type, personality defect, mental/emotional issue, or ability to detach and become an extension of mama rather than a man in his own right.

My husband is a brilliant, dynamic, hard working, creative, funny and very manly type of man with strong opinions and beliefs of his own. It wasn't always that way. He went through so much with an overbearing mother who did very well at trying to create a clone of herself and erase any of his own thoughts or personality, using a combination of guilt and manipulation. This is a man who, at almost 30, did not know how to pick up his own prescription from a pharmacy and thought he had to have his mom call his ex-gf to get her to refill it then have his mom come and bring it to him. I'm not exaggerating.

They finally went through a major break and he checked himself straight into inpatient rehab for counseling and alcohol treatment from trying to drown out his own existence, suppress the growing anger, and do what she told him to do. It was ridiculously painful for him. He said over and over, if I stand up to her she won't love me anymore. I see how he felt that way at the time. I think she loves him too much, if anything. He had ZERO voice, would tell anyone what they wanted to hear to avoid conflict, and it took him years and years to figure out who he was. She wouldn't even recognize him now. He's the head of our household and we're a team, but I let him lead. And it's sad, because as an independent grown man he's just incredible and she's missing out on that.

The scars are still deep, and the break from his family has been clean for over a decade except for the one sane, supportive family member he has which is - wait for it - his Dad.

Of course the only thing that supposedly changed was marrying me. But it's all or nothing to her and he can't do the dysfunction. So I'm evil, his distance and free thinking is my fault, etc. She tells people it's like he's dead now, and that I stole him and brainwashed him. (?!?!?!) If anything ever happened that HE caused, I 100% guarantee my MIL would say, "My first thought was, 'what has she done?'"

His younger brother went the opposite direction. He married someone who stood up to mom, let the wife take all the flack for it, then when mom had enough of her, they divorced her. They. We joke about it now... that Mom and Joe divorced Jane. Because it's true. Every lawyer appt was led by her, paid for by her, custody worked out by her - she had kept notebooks with lists about every fault and every argument with every ex they ever had for "evidence, just in case of future custody battles". They divorced the first wife who ended up eventually getting him to terminate all rights to their child so she could escape the BS, then he found a 2nd wife who is meek, agreeable, and doesn't mind all 3 of them in the marriage raising their son. Bingo. New family. Level Up.

I very much hope that a book is written about CW, this crime, and the family dynamics behind their marriage and his upbringing. I'd like to know what made him how he is. How he's wired. What was beneath the surface of that agreeable man who learned to be a pathological liar by default because being himself wasn't going to be accepted. When he started to become resentful inside. When the mask became more and more of a mask. What made him snap and dispose of his family instead of becoming his true self. What all was so contradictory that he was hiding. And was his true self just a psychopath or narcissist regardless, and the FA mom just formed that perfect storm?

I really would like details and backstories about how this went down. And like others have stated. I'd give a whole lot just to know what the conversations with his dad were, both in the car, then at the police station. I think if there's a glimpse of who he really is anywhere, it would be when he's with his dad.

All JMO, thanks for the indulgence of listening. Thought it might be interesting to hear about the FA mom and effects on the sons from the inside of things.

Thank you for sharing. I never realized, until reading this, that was exactly how my ex MIL acted. Last I heard, the ex had been been arrested for domestic violence. I think he is lost, since his Momma passed.

 

[Tortoise]

I think I have a problem with the idea of a rejected Alford plea but I'm not sure if I can express it clearly. Is it denying him a right that he can then claim forced his hand?

 

[Tortoise]

I think he probably used it because of the insanely popular Ashton Kutcher television show "Punked." They played pranks on people, usually famous people, and videotaped it. A more modern version of "Candid Camera." We use the term frequently in our house. IMO there's no double entrende there. It's just a popular way of saying "You got tricked" or "I got you".

Yes, I think conned is another definition.

 

[NuttMegg]

I think he probably used it because of the insanely popular Ashton Kutcher television show "Punked." They played pranks on people, usually famous people, and videotaped it. A more modern version of "Candid Camera." We use the term frequently in our house. IMO there's no double entrende there. It's just a popular way of saying "You got tricked" or "I got you".

Me too. Many of us would be surprised if we looked up the newish street meanings of common terms we've used for years.