Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW GUILTY* #50

[smucklecrumble]

Here's what I see:
Equipment Limitations.

1. Video. The media shall be given access to the courtroom, in a location as designated by the judge, and the petitioners shall be responsible for pooling pursuant to the arrangements outlined below. There shall be only one such camera in the Courtroom from which the proceedings may be viewed. Only one person shall be permitted to operate the one videotape, television, or motion picture camera. The camera operator may use a tripod but shall not change location while Court is in session. Video may be utilized for live streaming and taping.

2. Audio. The court’s audio system shall be used if technically suitable and, in that event, there must be no interference with the court’s use of its system. If the court’s system is not technically suitable, then the person conducting expanded media coverage may install an audio recording system at his or her own expense upon first obtaining approval of the judge. All microphones and related wiring shall be unobtrusive and shall not interfere with the movement of those in the courtroom.

https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/19th_Judicial_District/caseofinterest/2018CR2003/Order Concerning Expanded Media Coverage.pdf

Is what you're referring to somewhere else and I'm missing it?

No you’re right. I was just inferring from notice of court room change document that the live streaming was their own -

“Based on the limited seating capacity in Division 17, the sentencing hearing will be held in Division 16, a courtroom that has greater seating capacity. However, Division 17 will be utilized for overflow seating and will offer live video streaming of the sentencing hearing.”

https://www.courts.state.co.us/user...rest/2018CR2003/Notice - courtroom change.pdf

 

[smucklecrumble]

I agree, but that would give a huge boost to that website and their followers. Can you imagine the victimhood shouted through cyberspace. What could happen is that CW family is allowed to bring an extra person, or a "counselor" with them and the letter writer could get in that way. (I just made that up, but anything is possible here).

Gah! Don’t give them ideas lol

 

[Medstudies]

You mean like borderline personality disorder? Narcissistic personality disorder? Having homicidal and suicidal ideation? Obsessive compulsive disorder? Munchausen Syndrome and Munchausen Syndrome by Proxy?

Hmm. Some who are railing about "armchair diagnoses" based on commonalities seen repeatedly in family annihilators and their families, (which we see repeated with the Watts clan), had ZERO problem with such diagnoses of an actual murder victim based on the state of her darn closets, speculation about innocuous home videos and gossipy innuendo and rumor.

All. This. :::standing slow clap:::

 

[gitana1]

Which is why I repeat my opinion that he will do just fine in prison, unless of course he is murdered.
No worries about paying bills, 3 squares a day, healthcare, access to libraries in some places, TV, maybe computers?, no leaky roof, showers without ever having to fix the water heater, etc. He won't have to vacillate amongst his various personas in order to please females. I could foresee that he might even convince other inmates that he took one for the wife, to save her reputation. He will probably also have an anvil taken off his chest in that he really doesn't have to see Mom ever again.

Yeah I agree. A lot of these types seem to do quite well in prison. They don't have to worry about the mask slipping. No one is allowed to have masks and no one really cares. Who's going to judge? A rapist?

Scott Peterson is on death row. He has a tv. Loads of fan mail from imbalanced woman who think he's super handsome and super innocent. He plays basketball or card games with his fellow murderers during his five hours free time from his cell each day.

He seems to be doing just fine, just as they all do.

 

[Mellowmelly]

Not long now till the sentencing and the closest we will probably ever get to the truth of that horrific night. Hopefully it will put an end to all the speculation, especially as to who is guilty and silence the doubters out there.

 

[liltexans]

I think it would be in the courts best interest to deny KA access to the courtroom on Monday. Not only has she breached confidentiality and court orders by tweeting from the courtroom during the reading of the plea deal, she also penned the letter to the judge on behalf of Ms Watts, accusing the system of actions that are, in her words, "inhumane". At this point, she is preying on Ms Watts and her weakened state, for her own gain and notoriety. Unfortunately she is using what appears to be a very emotionally, unstable human being /Ms Watts who MAY ( not saying she is) be on the brink of an emotional &/or nervous breakdown. Not something anyone one of us would want to see happen. I hope the court/ judge sees the potential disaster this could cause, and deny KA any and all access inside the courtroom for the best interest for everyone.

Maybe they can put her in the overflow room and she can watch the televised hearing. She does not need to take up space in the courtroom that is meant for family, friends, and actual verified media. She can sit with the public visitors in a separate room. IMO

 

[Tortoise]

There is that judgment word being thrown around. When actually it appears to me (and I believe, the majority of the WS’s) discernment. - (definition, discernment: nothing more than the ability to decide between truth and error, right and wrong. Discernment is the process of making careful distinctions in our thinking about truth.)

If we want to get theological about it: According to the New Testament, discernment is not optional for the believer-it is required.

Excellent post! Thank you.

 

[idfinch]

I have had passive clients who have had trouble standing up for themselves. In several cases I've had to deal with their aggressive family members who threatened to derail the case or derail a good settlement deal.

As an experienced attorney you learn quickly how to control those situations, protect your client and "shut that **** down", as Cindy's Watts claimed was said to her.

I believed her. I would've done the same thing to protect a client who has made a reasonable decision and has people in their life trying to undermine it.

Yes. The "shut that **** down" quote sounded like it came from exasperated public defense attorneys well versed in difficult family dynamics, who have been contacted and stalked on a regular basis from August through October by mom wanting info. The fact that she was repeatedly transferred to social workers is telling.

Info that Chris clearly chose not to give. His defense isn't with him 24/7. They don't sleep in the jail. They aren't wardens. In the end, they work for him and represent his interests and decisions, correct? They can advise and be a buffer, but even down to the 30 minutes per family member the night before the plea, CW could have replied, "don't speak to my mother like that, I'm going to discuss the case and the possibility of hiring new attorneys with her" and they couldn't have stopped him, isn't that true? He could have called at any point when they weren't around. Even on suicide watch he gets an hour with a phone.

With all of the drama and outcry surrounding this case, if there were any viable claim to the misconduct and poor representation Mama Watts is yelling about, I'd imagine she would be contacted by more than one prominent defense attorney wanting to take the case pro bono just for the publicity alone.

She ended up with an attention ***** (I'm not typing it but you all know) blogger with all the wrong intentions. I can't fathom they haven't tried and failed with more than one actual attorney in the past 3 months.

 

[Tortoise]

Thought provoking post. Well said. I never thought about what a chameleon he actually is.

Kind of goes along with my theory of family annihilators having annihilated identies.

A sociopathic chameleon.

 

[Love Never Fails]

You mean like borderline personality disorder? Narcissistic personality disorder? Having homicidal and suicidal ideation? Obsessive compulsive disorder? Munchausen Syndrome and Munchausen Syndrome by Proxy?

Hmm. Some who are railing about "armchair diagnoses" based on commonalities seen repeatedly in family annihilators and their families, (which we see repeated with the Watts clan), had ZERO problem with such diagnoses of an actual murder victim based on the state of her darn closets, speculation about innocuous home videos and gossipy innuendo and rumor.

Gitana1, we are doing some armchair diagnosing but we are just trying to wrap our heads around how a person could do this.
What I cannot figure out is why everyone doesn’t have a clean closet? I grew up in a clean home and I have one even though we do a lot of living in it. It’s just taking pride in your home. I personally would be diagnosing people who are sloppy. Ha!
So all of this discussion seems normal. Except....No judgments should be made about Shanaan. I think she was likely an awesome person!

 

[SuziQ]

As usual I am way behind, but I need to vent.

Holy ***. I see where Chris gets it from.

And the comparison to Jackie Peterson is spot on.

What a dispicable bunch.

That's all.

 

[gitana1]

Yes. The "shut that **** down" quote sounded like it came from exasperated public defense attorneys well versed in difficult family dynamics, who have been contacted and stalked on a regular basis from August through October by mom wanting info. The fact that she was repeatedly transferred to social workers is telling.

Info that Chris clearly chose not to give. His defense isn't with him 24/7. They don't sleep in the jail. They aren't wardens. In the end, they work for him and represent his interests and decisions, correct? They can advise and be a buffer, but even down to the 30 minutes per family member the night before the plea, CW could have replied, "don't speak to my mother like that, I'm going to discuss the case and the possibility of hiring new attorneys with her" and they couldn't have stopped him, isn't that true? He could have called at any point when they weren't around. Even on suicide watch he gets an hour with a phone.

With all of the drama and outcry surrounding this case, if there were any viable claim to the misconduct and poor representation Mama Watts is yelling about, I'd imagine she would be contacted by more than one prominent defense attorney wanting to take the case pro bono just for the publicity alone.

She ended up with an attention ***** (I'm not typing it but you all know) blogger with all the wrong intentions. I can't fathom they haven't tried and failed with more than one actual attorney in the past 3 months.

All true. They cannot censor him against his will. He can receive mail. He can send mail. He can make phone calls. He could've told his family everything he wanted to during the 90 minutes he spoke with them.

He chose not to.

 

[molly1255]

Agree, which is why I said earlier that his plea is just more manipulation by him to control the situation.

Side note - I still think he’s bloody guilty of it all. Just that he’s had a lot of time to think in his cell on how he would like things to go/what he can control

I 100% agree with what you what you've said.

I also believe that there is a very good reason he turned out to be the way that he is, and I think it is a function of nature and a lot of nurture. JMO.

 

[SuziQ]

I think mama had an active campaign going to get rid of Shannon this past summer. She didn't count on Chris using murder to accomplish her goal. But you know, these momma's boys like to please their mommie's.

 

[gitana1]

Gitana1, we are doing some armchair diagnosing but we are just trying to wrap our heads around how a person could do this.
What I cannot figure out is why everyone doesn’t have a clean closet? I grew up in a clean home and I have one even though we do a lot of living in it. It’s just taking pride in your home. I personally would be diagnosing people who are sloppy. Ha!
So all of this discussion seems normal. Except....No judgments should be made about Shanaan. I think she was likely an awesome person!

Agreed. I mean when someone is arrested for murder and their family shows their true colors by bashing f the murder victim, it makes sense to armchair diagnose.

But we had people doing the same thing TO a murder victim based on her closets! And supported by the self-serving and transparent lies of the murderer himself!

 

[SuziQ]

Sitting here flashing on Josh Powell and his dad. They were on the phone the entire afternoon before Susan disappeared.

 

[katydid23]

I agree, but I would want to know why and I believe that Cindy Watts wants to know why too. When she knows the why, she may be able to accept it.

What explanation could there possibly be for strangling your children? There is no 'why' that could be acceptable.

 

[SuziQ]

I've always felt the plea deal was Chris's attempt to keep his secrets from being exposed. And now I'm thinking it's to keep them from his mom. He was gaslighting Shannon to his mom and it was all a lie.

 

[Love Never Fails]

Agreed. I mean when someone is arrested for murder and their family shows their true colors by bashing f the murder victim, it makes sense to armchair diagnose.

But we had people doing the same thing TO a murder victim based on her closets! And supported by the self-serving and transparent lies of the murderer himself!

And THAT is what was disgusting!

 

[gitana1]

pre-planning is a different concept e.g. he planned it days, weeks, months. Deliberation and intent means that he could have stopped, but didn't. The Scott Reisch video posted recently gives a good example of this.

Here's what deliberation means per the code:

• (3) The term “after deliberation” means not only intentionally but also that the decision to commit the act has been made after the exercise of reflection and judgment concerning the act. An act committed after deliberation is never one which has been committed in a hasty or impulsive manner.

Colorado "first degree murder" laws |18-3-102 C.R.S.

P.S., a criminal defense attorney is going to be more likely to try to muddy the waters regarding the definition. But the code is clear.

It means quite a bit more than "he could've stopped but didn't."

Because that definition applies to heat of passion as well.