Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW GUILTY* #55

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  • #341
I am not sure about that. If that were me, I would just peek in their rooms and see that they were there. She would not be thinking of whether they were alive or not. They were tucked up in their beds. That would be enough as tired as she would have been.
Me too I would peek in and check the monitor as I'm sure she was very sleepy from the layover and just wanted to go to bed. He might have had the deceased girls laid in bed like they were asleep. SW was probably asleep or close as she had long beautiful nails I think SW would have fought hard for her life if wide awake. If he strangled her while asleep less chance of her screaming to wake or alert neighbors.
 
  • #342
I am sure that meeting so many people who defended Shanann was good for them. And they would know the people who were defending her and the ones who were slandering her. Thank God, that there were more of the former than the latter.
Much more. I think most never believed his story. It just seemed like a lot supported him because they were so loud and insistent. Much like a hen house. Imo
 
  • #343
I think that it means that he killed the children first. He doesn't want the world or his mother to know that.

If he agreed that he killed the kids first, then his whole house of cards fall apart. He has only plead guilty, but he has not really confessed yet. I believe his "escape" plans were like this:
1) Plan A: Shannan ran away with the kids. -- free man
2) Plan B: I killed Shannan in a fit of rage after I saw her kill my kids -- second degree murder?
3) Plan C: I killed Shannan in anger, then went crazy and killed the kids. -- second degree murder.

If he killed the kids first.... everything falls apart.

This gives me an idea on why the PodPeople were going on about the condition of Shannans body saying it was badly beaten. Evidence of that would indicate some sort of spur of the moment struggle, and reduce the charge from first degree murder to a lesser charge of second degree murder. "He snapped and he beat her up badly" is a better position to be in than "He murdered them coldly", when you are a CW supporter.
 
  • #344
The key for me is what Shannan was wearing. The autopsy report shows that she was at the very least, in the process of changing into bedclothes when she was killed.

I think she was actually in bed.

Had the kids been killed first, I think she would have been murdered the second she walked in that door, and been fully dressed.

I believe that she likely would have checked on the kids as soon as she got home. He couldn’t chance that, as she would have fought him.

The lack of defensive wounds tells me that she never saw it coming, which means that she didn’t see the kids dead, because they weren’t dead at that point.

Therefore, I strongly suspect that Shannan was killed first.
I've always thought he killed them first but you may be right. It just occurred to me that he also might have wanted to make sure he killed Shanann first before following through with the girls. What if for some reason her flight was cancelled and she wouldn't be home until the following day? It would have made things more complicated. Imo
 
  • #345
I've always thought he killed them first but you may be right. It just occurred to me that he also might have wanted to make sure he killed Shanann first before following through with the girls. What if for some reason her flight was cancelled and she wouldn't be home until the following day? It would have made things more complicated. Imo
He would have just done the same thing the following day. He cancelled the girl's school enrolments.
 
  • #346
I have to say when CW mother said how much she loved and forgave him, I felt sick. that was so inappropriate. It is pretty telling what kind of family they are- at least mom--an enabler.
So much energy and focus has gone into Cindy Watts. We’ve been talking about her for days. Now she is free to go visit CW in jail whenever she wants, and she can bring him cookies and try to squeeze all the information out of him she can get. I don’t really care, it won’t bring Shanann, Bella, and CeCe back.
 
  • #347
I would think they went to her apartment. It was too much of a risk with all the neighbors around, I would think. She also could have been seen on camera. Imo

There would not have been opportunity for that to happen. The girls were in NC with Shanann until very recently, and then of course Shanann was home with them. Since meeting NK, Chris was only home with them for one weekend, and he got a babysitter on that Saturday night.
 
  • #348
Dear colorado303 and feyinfredrick (and anyone else who may have been in court today). (I’m so far behind...will never be able to catch up, so apologies if this has already been requested...)

When you feel strong enough and have the time and inclination, could you pls give us a glimpse of what it was like to be present in court today? Your observations and impressions. I would imagine the courtroom was incredibly tense and emotional.

I’m so sorry for your loss.
Im a nutshell: Waiting in line you couldn’t tell who was press and who had personal connections. Watching the press try to either pick up snippets of info or befriend people who might be interview worthy was surreal. I had a woman who worked for NBC warn me I was standing next to a podcaster.

When they opened the courtroom, they let the press in first—called them up one by one by media outlet. They took up at least half the room so people who probably were sure they’d get in wound up in the overflow room. I saw the Thayers in line behind me but didn’t see them in the courtroom so they must not have made the cut.

The first two rows were reserved for family and the DA/Defense teams. The Watts chose not to sit directly behind CW but sat 3 rows back (maybe to avoid the cameras?).

I was in the second to last row so really could only see the back of people’s heads when they were talking at the microphone. Also had lean left to see the judge (almost wished I could see a tv screen instead at first), but I had an unobstructed view of the back of CW’s head/neck the whole time. I lost track of the number of times one of the defense attorneys rubbed CW’s back or patted him on the shoulder, but each time it happened I cringed. Pretty sure I swore under my breath a couple of times.

The Rzucek speeches were of course hard to hear. Seemed like everyone held their breath when the Watts got up and let out a collective sigh of relief when their rep said they accepted their son committed all the crimes he was charged with.

The only audible sobbing from where I sat was when the DA started to outline the crime for the judge. It got worse when he said Bella fought back.

By the time the judge finished rattling off the sentences people were mostly composed again. Walking out of the courtroom there was a WALL of huge tv camera’s (at least a dozen) about 3-4 feet away from us and that was a shock because there were few cameras in the hall when we entered.

Press was not allowed to ask for or conduct interviews inside, but when we got outside there were several gaggles of them. I have to say they were respectful— I was with a couple of people known to the press and they were approached for comments, but never by someone with a microphone in their hand. They were all apologetic for asking and gracious about going away without a fight. I was grateful and pleasantly surprised.

I’ll talk about the press conference and some other behind the scene things in another post.
 
  • #349
I dont know how y’all feel but being a longtime crime enthusiast and websleuther this is the most horrific gruesome crime I have ever followed.

It's not the most gruesome I've followed, but it's definitely made me angrier and sadder than most. The senselessness is staggering.
 
  • #350
It wasn’t bad. Just long -got up at 4:15. Glad it turned out the way it did and that’s the last we’ll have to see of him ever. Also glad Watts family saw the light. When they got up you could cut the tension w/a knife. Still love the DA —even more after today if that’spossible. And I got to spend time w/the Rzuceks — I hadn’t met them before and they are even more amazing than I could have imagined.
One of the prosecutors was tearing at the table. I think he had on glasses. It was emotional to see tears coming down his eyes. I think he was the 3rd seat at the prosecution table.

The close photo of the 2 tanks and her shallow grave with their pictures at the end did it for me as well.

Especially since this was the 1st time I watched this case on my big screen tv. Usually I just reviewed things on my phone or laptop.

Sad case and sorry for you guys that knew them.
 
  • #351
He would have just done the same thing the following day. He cancelled the girl's school enrolments.
True but a lot may have happened in that time. Shanann may have insisted on speaking to the girls and become suspicious. Her friend Nicole may have come inside if they returned during the day. He may have had to dispose of the bodies during two separate trips.
I think there would be a lot more that could have gone wrong. Jmo. Edited, oh I just realized you meant he could have waited to kill all three. I guess he could have, but I still think he would have considered it a risk. Shanann may have found out they didn't go to school. Her friend probably would have come inside if they were suspicious. I think he was counting on everything going as planned, as he had called the co- worker to make arrangements and the girls were starting school. Imo
 
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  • #352
Quoting Jupiter05, post 1156 from the last thread



I heard him say that any earnings CW makes in prison would be garnished and put into a victim fund, and that any expenses to the Rzuceks such as funeral expenses or if they feel they would like counselling can be paid out of the fund. I took that to mean that the fund is a general pool of money as opposed to the victims of crime A receive only what the convicted person has paid in, and that the convicted person contributes to the general fund from which money can be paid out.
Yes. In addition to paying for the victim’s families to travel to the hearing, the state of Colorado (I think, perhaps the county) paid for the bodies to be flown to NC and they also paid for the caskets and funeral. CW will contribute to the fund that made that possible.
 
  • #353
I lost track of the number of times one of the defense attorneys rubbed CW’s back or patted him on the shoulder, but each time it happened I cringed. Pretty sure I swore under my breath a couple of times.
.

RSBM

I noticed that as well when I was watching. Even when the prison guard pushed in his chair, he patted him on the back. Made me feel quite sick.
 
  • #354
The key for me is what Shannan was wearing. The autopsy report shows that she was at the very least, in the process of changing into bedclothes when she was killed.

I think she was actually in bed.

Had the kids been killed first, I think she would have been murdered the second she walked in that door, and been fully dressed.

I believe that she likely would have checked on the kids as soon as she got home. He couldn’t chance that, as she would have fought him.

The lack of defensive wounds tells me that she never saw it coming, which means that she didn’t see the kids dead, because they weren’t dead at that point.

Therefore, I strongly suspect that Shannan was killed first.
I’m not sure it matters, anymore, who he killed first, does it? He felt the same way about all three of them. He hated them. He wanted them all out of his life equally, and he got rid of them, 1, 2, 3. He didn’t care how horrible it was for any of them, or for anyone who loved them.
 
  • #355
The lack of defensive wounds tells me that she never saw it coming, which means that she didn’t see the kids dead, because they weren’t dead at that point.

Therefore, I strongly suspect that Shannan was killed first.
I have to agree.

Given what happened I can only infer that CW is dumb, and probably would make the protagonists of dumb and dumber look like professors of logic and sciences. But it does look like he was somewhat aware of how things would go down or just "lucked out".

I am sure Shannan would have checked on the kids first thing after reaching home, and if she did find them murdered she would have fought pretty badly.

Also lupus + other health issues + pregnancy + late night flight after a conference will make anyone completly tired. I had chronic fatigue and used to travel for work, the sleep I used to get after getting home was a deep sleep from which no one can wake me up if they tried. I am a 6'3 250lb guy. If my 140 lb partner strangled me at that time, she would have succeeded without any resistance from my side.

I would like to believe that Shannan went without even realizing. One can only hope.

Of course all this is : MOO
 
  • #356
The key for me is what Shannan was wearing. The autopsy report shows that she was at the very least, in the process of changing into bedclothes when she was killed.

I think she was actually in bed.

Had the kids been killed first, I think she would have been murdered the second she walked in that door, and been fully dressed.

I believe that she likely would have checked on the kids as soon as she got home. He couldn’t chance that, as she would have fought him.

The lack of defensive wounds tells me that she never saw it coming, which means that she didn’t see the kids dead, because they weren’t dead at that point.

Therefore, I strongly suspect that Shannan was killed first.


This is exactly the way I feel. I think he killed her either in her sleep or as she was getting ready to lay down. Unless he waited until everyone was asleep and killed the girls first, I think we would have seen signs of SW fighting back. Because she was mostly undressed, I find it unlikely that they were already dead when she got home. She would have checked on them.
 
  • #357
I’m not sure it matters, anymore, who he killed first, does it? He felt the same way about all three of them. He hated them. He wanted them all out of his life equally, and he got rid of them, 1, 2, 3. He didn’t care how horrible it was for any of them, or for anyone who loved them.
You’re right. In the grand scheme of things, it really doesn’t matter, they’re all dead after all.

It’s just curiosity at this point, trying to understand exactly what happened.
 
  • #358
I know that Chris Watts has no feelings for anyone, other than himself.
Not like a normal selfish lout, but Truly, has NO feelings.
Something in his brain is dis-connected.
I hope that he agrees to studies of his brain someday.
Maybe it will help us understand what makes people like him do the crimes they do.
 
  • #359
You’re right. In the grand scheme of things, it really doesn’t matter, they’re all dead after all.

It’s just curiosity at this point, trying to understand exactly what happened.
It was sick, demented, and depraved, trust me.
 
  • #360
So much energy and focus has gone into Cindy Watts. We’ve been talking about her for days. Now she is free to go visit CW in jail whenever she wants, and she can bring him cookies and try to squeeze all the information out of him she can get. I don’t really care, it won’t bring Shanann, Bella, and CeCe back.
She cant say Nico because between Nua messing up his coverup along with the name of his mistress.

She just can't say the word Nico.

Sw pulled one on him with that name. He probably can't even say Nico as well without thinking about both Nicoles. Jmo.
 
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