Coronavirus COVID-19 - Global Health Pandemic #42

[PommyMommy]

Can Covid-19 spread through your apartment building's pipes

[...]

Dr. Leana Wen, the former Baltimore health commissioner, said currently there is no evidence that the coronavirus can spread long distances.

However, she added that the virus could spread through a defective plumbing system. This was a particular concern in Hong Kong. During the 2003 severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS) outbreak, this method became a major source of transmission. At the Amoy Gardens housing estate, there were more than 300 infections and 42 deaths after defective plumbing allowed the virus to spread through the building.

Dr. Wen recommended that "buildings should make sure that they check their exhaust systems, their pipe systems. And I think for all of us who live in apartment buildings, there are additional steps you can take as well, including don't get into crowded elevators. Try to make sure you are not in an elevator with someone."

Dr. Wen also recommended opening the windows to increase your own ventilation once the weather gets warmer and to wash your hands thoroughly after touching surfaces that are used often, like handrails or buttons in elevators.

Coronavirus live updates: Cases top 1 million globally - CNN

 

[branmuffin]

@The Night Watchman SAID:
Will anything good come out of this horror? We know most of the bad things.

1) Americans know 1000x more about a pandemic than they did before.
2) Governments relearned the hard way what is needed to combat a pandemic. It won't be ignored going forward, and they will be held accountable.
3) Americans (including me) have learned the importance of flu shots (it's not about you, dummy).
4) People are stepping up and helping neighbors.
5) Pollution is reduced, creating a possible vision of what could be.
6) Possible momentum for universal health care.
7) Time spent with family.
8) New recipes.
9) Self-evaluation of health status (what lifestyle changes are needed).

What else?

10ofRods SAID:

10) People may realize that scientists, including doctors, are more trustworthy than non-experts
11) People may learn that their own folk views of how to cure something must give way to medical expertise
12) Hopefully, people will learn to be nice to their carers and essential workers (although on that one, I have a few doubts)
13) Possible momentum for more working at home (permanently) so that there's less pollution
14) Possible workplace accommodations (work at home) for people who are at risk
15) Lots more birds and birdsong
16) Coyotes walking around San Francisco.

17) People will read more news, especially science news. Medical news. You know, like people on WS do.

Here is what I say ----

#18.)
PLEASE EVERYONE THINK FOR YOURSELVES. DO NOT ONLY RELY ON GOVERNMENT "EXPERTS" TO TELL YOU WHAT TO DO! TAKE THE SAFETY MEASURES YOU FEEL ARE BEST FOR YOU AND YOUR LOVED ONES.

Too many people have gone to special occasions/fun events with big crowds because the "experts " we're allowing it. Because State restrictions were not yet put in place - and now they are seriously getting sick and seriously regretting it.

Take a look at the damage Mardi Gras and Saint Patrick's Day celebrations have caused for the city of New Orlenes. Now the Mayor is under fire and making excuses.

If only people would think for themselves.

I think the problem is that people ARE thinking for themselves. There are many people out there who know who the REAL experts are and have governed themselves accordingly from the get go. Then there are those people who want some 'EXPERT' to tell them what they want to hear.

All you need to do is listen to the varied responses from officials world-wide. Some have gone from ignoring it to threatening to shoot people in the streets. Some have equated it to the most innocuous solution of just washing your hands. Some have suggested that an over abundance of testosterone can inoculate you from the virus and others have taken the aspirational route favouring fairy tales over reality.

There is no rewind in real life.

 

[BUF]

How to sanitize your groceries

[...]

CNN Chief Medical Correspondent Dr. Sanjay Gupta said that since the virus is respiratory, you can't get it from contaminated food.

"It's more of a question of the packaging. You just have to think about, is there any risk of contamination in other ways. But you are not going to get a GI type thing from eating the virus.

Watch the video at the link on how to sanitize your groceries.

Coronavirus live updates: Cases top 1 million globally - CNN

Dr. Gupta also did a video on how to properly wash your hands...

Dr. Sanjay Gupta shows the proper way to wash your hands - CNN Video

 

[branmuffin]

My sister wears a mask she made at the Nursing Home she works at. Other workers don't wear any.

That's very scary and I hope your sister remains safe. I am outraged that this is happening to people who have signed on to care for the most vulnerable and then experience a slap in the face like this as if they are somehow responsible.

 

[I'm Just Here]

Lol, I wish I could post what my RN daughter just posted to me! She is working hospice and travels to places she is needed besides her own patients. There are no mask shortages but she posted her bra cup mask, it just so happens she is wearing a large enough size that covers her whole face! I think she too is finding ways to entertain herself off work. Hope my 2 little grandsons didn't see silly mommy.

 

[KALI]

Sigh. I've wondered when (not if) this was going to happen.
This is VERY bad news.
As of February 2019, California had 108,000. Homeless. (Per the LAtimes.com/homeless-housing/story/2020-03-18/coronavirus-homeless-money-california-risk-150-million)
There is zero good news here. It is all bad.
Sorry to say.

First case of Covid-19 on Skid Row has been confirmed: Fears the virus will spread like wildfire | Daily Mail Online

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Let's find out who has antibodies while we work out vaccines and treatments. I really don't want to accept a future that looks like the last few weeks.

I'm no longer posting them, but for those that still follow Dr. Campbell's videos - he spoke of other countries now using tests for such.. like a take home pregnancy test at this time. The US folks have spoken of this, yet already in use in other countries.

 

[ilovewings]

we're all scared
let's just say it
we're scared @#$%less
sending you hugs

.
Thank you Sending hugs back to ya!!!!

 

[Trudie]

This is ultra frightening. Moo

Can Covid-19 spread through your apartment building's pipes

[...]

Dr. Leana Wen, the former Baltimore health commissioner, said currently there is no evidence that the coronavirus can spread long distances.

However, she added that the virus could spread through a defective plumbing system. This was a particular concern in Hong Kong. During the 2003 severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS) outbreak, this method became a major source of transmission. At the Amoy Gardens housing estate, there were more than 300 infections and 42 deaths after defective plumbing allowed the virus to spread through the building.

Dr. Wen recommended that "buildings should make sure that they check their exhaust systems, their pipe systems. And I think for all of us who live in apartment buildings, there are additional steps you can take as well, including don't get into crowded elevators. Try to make sure you are not in an elevator with someone."

Dr. Wen also recommended opening the windows to increase your own ventilation once the weather gets warmer and to wash your hands thoroughly after touching surfaces that are used often, like handrails or buttons in elevators.

Coronavirus live updates: Cases top 1 million globally - CNN

 

[Alethea]

I keep having these moments thinking that this is just our life now. I can’t imagine going out shopping for fun or into a big building for business meetings. We’re just going to be pioneers living isolated on a homestead. I actually said today: “Should we figure out how to build a barn?”

 

[SugarQueen]

Grim New Rules for NYC Paramedics: Don’t Bring Cardiac Arrests to ER for Revival

(Sorry if repost)

Wow!

 

[imstilla.grandma]

Random thought:

It is often via “incidental findings” during a check up that problems are detected. Of course we have no choice here but to rightfully postpone elective appointments, however I’m just randomly thinking about the little cancer things that may now go unnoticed and forfeit “early detection”.

This is on my mind as I have an immediate family member with terminal cancer.

So many infinite ripple effects. When a butterfly (or bat) flaps its wings...

My sister has exploratory surgery scheduled for advanced cervical cancer next week. As of today, it is still a ‘go’ - I just keep hoping so.

 

[Betty P]

There are so many poor and impoverished people in this country with no retirement, who live paycheck to paycheck or SS check to SS check. They are people who have worked hard their entire lives but maybe never had the means to prepare or the knowledge to prepare. I wish people didn't begrudge them. So many people are so well off and yet still resent some poor person getting a little windfall.

Why does it bother these people so much? "You" might have savings, investments, a pension. Why resent the poor who always have barely enough. Barely enough to cover their minimal expenses forget excess. They can't even get their teeth fixed when they need it. This $1,200 isn't enough for one person to get a root canal or a crown where I live. It's a drop in the bucket. And it will barely last, certainly nothing compared to the actual need.

When I start to feel envy towards someone else I remember to count my blessings. I don't have a lot that others have. But I do have a lot. I have more than most of the world. I am blessed in many ways. We are entering a period of deep suffering for so many people the world over. Let's rejoice when others are able to rejoice and grieve for others when they grieve.

An excellent comment, thanks for expressing it so well. I was thinking today about how difficult it's going to be for so many people. So many will risk their lives to go back to work in low paying, unsafe conditions because they have no other resources. And the millions of Americans with no health insurance....

 

[Spartygirl]

Must read
The Story of a Coronavirus Infection

WOW !! What a horrifying reality check.
I saved the article so I can share.
This $hit is real and it's here and we all have to fight it together.
We have been staying home, only to run to the grocery store as needed. (twice so far)
We are doing what is needed. And yet............

 

[Cool Cats]

I think the problem is that people ARE thinking for themselves. There are many people out there who know who the REAL experts are and have governed themselves accordingly from the get go. Then there are those people who want some 'EXPERT' to tell them what they want to hear.

All you need to do is listen to the varied responses from officials world-wide. Some have gone from ignoring it to threatening to shoot people in the streets. Some have equated it to the most innocuous solution of just washing your hands. Some have suggested that an over abundance of testosterone can inoculate you from the virus and others have taken the aspirational route favouring fairy tales over reality.

There is no rewind in real life.

COOL....OK THEN...YOUR OPINION INTERESTING.......

I am open to all opinions. Not just from the USA where I'm from....But from other country's points of view.
I try anyway...!!! It's a global world...

But the USA is in my heart and in my bones from my childhood. The declaration of independence, the westward expansion, the cowboys and Indians,
the pilgrims at Thankxgiving...The pioneers in the west...

The USA is in my heart and in my soul...The way I was raised. Should I be ashamed? Is this politically incorrect? No!! I embrace it..

Be proud of who you are!!

 

[PommyMommy]

The owner of the New England Patriots used the team's plane to bring hundreds of thousands of masks from China

Palettes of N95 respirator masks are off-loaded from the New England Patriots football team's Boeing 767 jet on the tarmac at Logan Airport on April 2 in Boston. Elise Amendola/AP

Robert Kraft, the owner of the New England Patriots, recently purchased 1.2 million N95 protective masks to donate to the state of Massachusetts and another 300,000 for New York state.

[...]

Kraft explained that his eldest son, who is the chairman of the board of Massachusetts General Hospital, is close with the state's governor, Charlie Baker. Baker asked if there was a way that the state could get the masks bought in China.

So Kraft offered to use the team's jet, which was sitting idle.

[...]

Gov. Cuomo said the call he got from Kraft saying they were getting the extra masks was probably "the only good call I've gotten in about 10 days."

Coronavirus live updates: Cases top 1 million globally - CNN

 

[Midwestmom2019]

No, I haven't seen it. Due to RL issues, I've pretty much missed the last two threads. I continue to read and post when I can but definitely not as much as my norm! MOO

Dear PM: I posted and 348 posts showed up after I hit post reply. I skip around when there are 348 posts to read, and sometimes hit a winner. RL is more important. Agreed. That’s how I kind of sort of keep up. And why my post can sometimes seem like we’ve talked about this already.... but you and I have not. Lol. WS will have to forgive us.

 

[Midgie2]

PommyMommy, salleye818, and all the others here, Thank You for your prayers. It means a lot to me!

 

[Betty P]

I keep having these moments thinking that this is just our life now. I can’t imagine going out shopping for fun or into a big building for business meetings. We’re just going to be pioneers living isolated on a homestead. I actually said today: “Should we figure out how to build a barn?”

I'd be willing to be a lot of people will start vegetable gardens this spring. I would, were it not for my back yard being a forest that goes for miles. I expect many of my neighbors will be starting one.

 

[gitana1]

But you don't know how many people are infected. A lot of what you said is not, IMO, quite correct.

My doctorate is in anthropology and I have a degree in human biology as well. You do NOT have to be next to a person's face to get (where did you get that? the flu is not relevant here).

Here's the thing. Coronavirus has very different properties from the flu. Want to see a chart of SOME of them? Here's an article:

Into the Eye of the Cytokine Storm

The shape and physiology of this virus is very very different (hence the word "novel").

Back to the statistics. Iceland found that about 20-40% of its population (depending on locale) had already had CoVid19, despite it being an island. In other studies, 20-50% of regions have already had it - without symptoms. The shedding period for this virus is much longer than the flu and its attack on the immune system is getting up there with malaria. There are two strains - one seems much more damaging than the other. Both will eventually hit nearly every person on the planet - over the next 3-5 years. We urban and suburban dwellers will find it hits us within a year or 18 months (unless you live in a bubble).

Singing spreads it (because breathing deeply and exhaling can communicate it very well). 6 feet is a minimum distance. People have been infected at 12 feet. Even further. There's something called viral load. How much virus is in the person's lungs? If a lot (they are in hospital, etc), they have the ability to propel 12 feet away with a cough and infect their nurse, even if she has a surgical mask. She/he needs to be outside the room. That's a problem, especially since no one goes from their house to a room. Many people will encounter them on their way to the hospital. -with so much virus in them, that their breath can spread it to people 6-10 feet away. God forbid they ever get into an elevator (especially with the so-called blue strain). 3 feet is not enough.

Panting, yawning, coughing, sneezing, sighing spreads it further than 6 feet. 3 feet is not enough (at all) even with a common cold or flu (which can kill many people - surely we should rethink how we interact?)

Sweating, shaking hands, sharing a cup, poor hygiene in table wiping at restaurants, shared towels, all of that increases its spread.

In the end, we'll all get it. Many of us older people will die sooner than we would have.

But comparing it to the flu is somewhat limited. We have flu shots. We have nothing for this. Zilch, nada so far. And it's way more communicable than the flu. And while the flu causes inflammation, this virus attacks certain tissues (lung) and systems (spleen, immune cells) that give it the power to kill a lot of people.

Anyway, I truly hope you find you already have antibodies (wouldn't that be great?) and go on about your life in good health. People who have spiked a fever are probably not contagious if they wait a week after their fever breaks before ending quarantine - but no one knows about how long the virus lasts and transmits in the asymptomatic. The range in numbers is sobering. Those with mild symptoms transmit for up to 28 days (with an average, perhaps, of about 14).

On surfaces, it can live up to 72 hours (again, elevators are brutal, as are all metal tube thingies like airplanes, buses, subways, taxis), so add the last asymptomatic transmitter plus 72 hours - and yes, you can get it in an elevator or any small space occupied by many people. The Chinese studies show this clearly.

I’m not comparing it to the flu as far as dangerousness. That’s clear. I’ve followed this thread since the beginning and am well aware that it is NOT the flu. It’s catastrophic.

But I am comparing it as far as how it’s transmitted. Based on information I got from my doctor. And applying it to the real world.

We had 3,711 people on the Princess Diamond in close proximity to each other for weeks. A hotbed of disease transmission. We know exactly how many people got it because every single one of them was tested.

19%. (Half of whom were asymptomatic).

It defies logic to me that a disease that can pass from just breathing normally in the same room only infected 19% of the passengers and staff floating in a disease incubator.

As I’ve stated many times here, I have asthma. So my immune system is not good. I won’t survive this disease.

I have every incentive to make sure people know how serious it is.

But some of this defies logic and is based on assumptions and very small samples. No one can be positive that someone caught the virus because someone else coughed 12 feet away. You can’t test for that as it would be unethical. And we have no idea how many sources of infection such a person come into contact with, how or when.

But we do know what happened to 3,711 people floating in the same disease incubator, closely socializing, talking, laughing, riding in elevators, eating at buffets, dancing, exercising, singing, talking loudly in the pool or spa, who are older than the average population. We know what happened to them and it is an excellent study model because they all socialized, and all were tested while being quarantined in the same location.

19%. Not 90, 80, 70 or 50.