Coronavirus COVID-19 - Global Health Pandemic #98

[CoverMeCagney]

Love the new thread. Thank you.

You’re welcome! It’s good to read other people’s experiences

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Do you know if they are elderly? I suspect that many of the people with breakthrough cases and hospitalizations are elderly, immunocompromised, or with significant underlying conditions.

This is true in the UK; it is predominantly killing the old, the medically vulnerable, and the unvaccinated.

 

[nhmemorymaker]

I posted a couple of articles about John Hopkins and Worldometer a few weeks back. They get their data from different sources. For the US, John Hopkins can be considered more reliable. (Essentially, Worldometer gets its data from whatever sources it can find online. For the US, John Hopkins has more direct sources.)

Thanks for this. I didn't know that.

 

[nhmemorymaker]

Because they are such a small percentage.

.... a New York Times analysis of data from 40 states and Washington, D.C. ... Fully vaccinated people have made up as few as 0.1 percent of and as many as 5 percent of those hospitalized with the virus in those states, and as few as 0.2 percent and as many as 6 percent of those who have died.
Data was not available for several states in which the virus has been surging, including Florida and Missouri.
See the Data on Breakthrough Covid Hospitalizations and Deaths by State


That means at least 94% of the covid deaths are unvaccinated people, and as much as 99.8% of the deaths are unvaccinated people - depending on which state you are looking at.


All of these stats are breakthrough infections:
View attachment 308919 View attachment 308920 View attachment 308921 View attachment 308922

The last column is (of all covid deaths) the percentage of vaccinated people who have died from covid.
The second column is (of all covid hospitalisations) the percentage of vaccinated people who have been hospitalised with covid.
It is an extremely small percentage. Unvaccinated people are definitely the ones who are suffering from serious covid far, far more.
.

dbm

 

[nhmemorymaker]

And where’s the media while 2 people (also vaccinated) are on vents this week in my small community ? Crazy how we very rarely hear of the vaccinated dying every day

I don't understand what you are trying to prove???

There are also probably many more vaccinated getting covid because their symptoms are light enough to just stay home.

And the message is clear now that we will be needing the booster. We are "building this airplane" when it is already flying in the air. How can anyone expect "perfection" with what we are living through??

The bottom line, and the data is crystal clear, is that MOST people getting bad covid cases are unvaccinated....so the virus continues to bloom, and is perhaps mutating as we speak.

So I expect more vaccinated WILL get Covid, as we try to roll out the boosters, and some MAY die.....
but THE REAL PROBLEM is to get more vaccinations.

 

[anneg]

Dr. Campbell discusses the delta pandemic in the UK, US, Australia, and Myanmar. See below for some highlights of what he talks about.


Dr. John Campbell
1.08M subscribers

UK
https://coronavirus.data.gov.uk

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulati...

W/e [week ending] 6th August
1 in 75 people in England
1 in 220 people in Wales
1 in 55 people in Northern Ireland
1 in 190 people in Scotland

13 August 2021
64% of adults met up indoors with someone not in their household in the past seven days

United States
https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-trac...

https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-trac...

https://covid.cdc.gov/covid-data-trac...

90% of counties with high or substantial transmission notes
93 million not vaccinated who are eligible
Therefore, mutation more likely
Measles, smallpox, polio (universal vaccination)
Hospitalizations up 34.6% over past week Florida and Texas, 40% of hospitalizations
RSV surge in a heat wave
Parainfluenza viruses MIS-C, 2 to 6 weeks after a covid infection
Children in hospital with covid https://www.washingtonpost.com/health...

1,785 Florida worst 247 children admitted last week
Nearly all parents unvaccinated
Either under age 12 or teens who put off the vaccine

Long covid in children https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/arti...

After even mild or asymptomatic infections in children Michael Smit, Children’s Hospital Los Angeles Vaccines for 5- to 11-year-olds delayed until later this year
We have months more to go
We’re in a real danger period between now and then

Australia, NSW Cases, + 390 = 12,440
140 linked to a known case or cluster
118 are household contacts
22 are close contacts
Source of infection for 250 cases is under investigation
58 cases were infectious in the community
Isolation status of 191 remains under investigation
6,874 locally acquired cases reported since 16 June 2021
Deaths, + 2 man in his 90s woman in her 40s
Deaths in current outbreak = 38 = 95 In hospital = 391 (63, 30)
Regional sewage systems in Tamworth, Bomaderry, Bathurst, Parkes and Bourke
No known cases of COVID-19 living in these areas
420 COVID-19 testing locations across NSW
your nearest clinic visit:
https://www.nsw.gov.au/covid-19/how-t...

[He also discusses the situation in Myanmar]

 

[nhmemorymaker]

Do you know if they are elderly? I suspect that many of the people with breakthrough cases and hospitalizations are elderly, immunocompromised, or with significant underlying conditions.

I had posted last week about this very statement. I was listening to a doctor on NPR or CNN .......... and she was saying MOST breakthrough cases were elderly, because the immune systems were never strong enough to build up significant immunity.

This is why I feel so many of us are on pins and needles over what is happening to children. What IS the effect going to be with Delta infection on children up to 12 years old???
This is such a mystery... and downright scary..........are we going to be saying .........."if they only had worn masks" ????

 

[Amonet]

I had posted last week about this very statement. I was listening to a doctor on NPR or CNN .......... and she was saying MOST breakthrough cases were elderly, because the immune systems were never strong enough to build up significant immunity.

This is why I feel so many of us are on pins and needles over what is happening to children. What IS the effect going to be with Delta infection on children up to 12 years old???
This is such a mystery... and downright scary..........are we going to be saying .........."if they only had worn masks" ????

Another important factor for the elderly is that I read the vaccine does reduce their chances of serious illness and death, but it reduces from the level they of vulnerability they were at down to about 10% of that level. So someone who had a 1 in 8 chance of dying before vaccination might still have a 1 in 80 chance of dying after vaccination. And that is still so much higher than in other age groups.

Another way I read it was that over 80s who are vaccinated are brought down to the vulnerability level of a pre-vaccinated 60-yr old. That is how dangerous Covid infection can be to older age groups.

In the UK the data has shown that there are still around 40% vs 60% hospitalisations vaccinated vs unvaccinated. And that has confused a lot of people. But we now have about 75% or higher fully vaccinated population, so there are so many more people in that vaccinated group that cases per vaccinated per capita will be much lower than in the unvaccinated per capita. And you have to allow for the fully vaccinated being far more likely to be in the older age groups along with those who are already living with conditions that adversely affect their immunity and perhaps mean that the vaccines aren't as effective in them (like people living with leukemia).

 

[Sundog]

Another important factor for the elderly is that I read the vaccine does reduce their chances of serious illness and death, but it reduces from the level they of vulnerability they were at down to about 10% of that level. So someone who had a 1 in 8 chance of dying before vaccination might still have a 1 in 80 chance of dying after vaccination. And that is still so much higher than in other age groups.

Another way I read it was that over 80s who are vaccinated are brought down to the vulnerability level of a pre-vaccinated 60-yr old. That is how dangerous Covid infection can be to older age groups.

In the UK the data has shown that there are still around 40% vs 60% hospitalisations vaccinated vs unvaccinated. And that has confused a lot of people. But we now have about 75% or higher fully vaccinated population, so there are so many more people in that vaccinated group that cases per vaccinated per capita will be much lower than in the unvaccinated per capita. And you have to allow for the fully vaccinated being far more likely to be in the older age groups along with those who are already living with conditions that adversely affect their immunity and perhaps mean that the vaccines aren't as effective in them (like people living with leukemia).

Precisely why the CDC and FDA need to quit being political and move forward with the booster shot for senior citizens.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

In the UK the data has shown that there are still around 40% vs 60% hospitalisations vaccinated vs unvaccinated. And that has confused a lot of people.

We have approx 47m vaccinated adults and 6m unvaccinated. There are approx 5000 in hospital. So 2000 are vaccinated, 3000 are not.

So that’s 2000 out of the 47 million vaccinated people.
And 3000 out of just 6 million people who are not.

 

[MimosaMornings]

Texas Judge Says There Are No Kid ICU Beds: Have To ‘Wait For Another Child To Die' — HuffPost

“A Texas judge spelled out the dire COVID-19 situation for young people in the state on Friday, saying in an interview that, “in Dallas, we have zero ICU beds left for children.”

“That means if your child’s in a car wreck, if your child has a congenital heart defect ... and needs an ICU bed, or more likely if they have COVID and need an ICU bed, we don’t have one,” said Dallas County Judge Clay Jenkins.”

“Your child will just not get on the ventilator, your child will be [airlifted to] wherever we can find them a bed,” Jenkins added. “But they won’t be getting one here unless one clears.”

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Texas Judge Says There Are No Kid ICU Beds: Have To ‘Wait For Another Child To Die' — HuffPost

“A Texas judge spelled out the dire COVID-19 situation for young people in the state on Friday, saying in an interview that, “in Dallas, we have zero ICU beds left for children.”

“That means if your child’s in a car wreck, if your child has a congenital heart defect ... and needs an ICU bed, or more likely if they have COVID and need an ICU bed, we don’t have one,” said Dallas County Judge Clay Jenkins.”

“Your child will just not get on the ventilator, your child will be [airlifted to] wherever we can find them a bed,” Jenkins added. “But they won’t be getting one here unless one clears.”

This is just an awful and upsetting situation. What’s the vaccine uptake in Dallas? Adults need to take control of protecting these children by protecting themselves.

 

[WichitaFalls]

This is just an awful and upsetting situation. What’s the vaccine uptake in Dallas? Adults need to take control of protecting these children by protecting themselves.

As of the week ending 8/7/2021, about 62% of Dallas County residents age 12 years and older have received at least one dose of COVID-19 vaccine, including: 86% of residents age 65 years and older; 70% of residents between 40-64 years of age; 57% of residents 25-39 years of age; 47% of residents 18-24 years of age; and 39% of residents 12-17 years of age.
Source: 2019 Novel Coronavirus (2019-CoV)

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Finally, our 16-17 years should be jabbed very soon, in time for the new school year in September. Interesting that they will only get one shot, for now.

Covid: 16 and 17-year-olds in England to be offered jab by 23 August

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Another life enjoyment denied due to this virus.
Just one out of thousands.

I hope it doesn't sound selfish, but DH and I feel "cheated" by the pandemic. I realize that many people have suffered far worse issues with Covid, but I can't help but feel that life hasn't been fair We had long planned a Mediterranean cruise for our 50th anniversary June 25 of this year. Due to Covid, we weren't able to enjoy a fabulous cruise to celebrate our 50 years together and DH's retirement last December. Given the current status of the ongoing pandemic, who knows if or when we might ever be able to cruise again? Not to mention that there are so many restrictions in place for cruise passengers that it would probably not be a pleasant experience.

 

[ringbearer]

Here's a good website where you can see ICU and regular hospital bed usage and capacity and what the patients are being treated for in the US -- you can search nationally and by state.

Hospital Utilization

This note is at the top of the page:

NOTE: COVID-19 ICU bed utilization values include both confirmed and suspected cases of COVID-19

This is the definition of a suspected case:

Case definitions for COVID-19 surveillance – 16 December 2020 - PAHO/WHO | Pan American Health Organization

Suspected case of SARS-CoV-2 infection (three options, A through C):
A. A person who meets the clinical AND epidemiological criteria:

Clinical criteria:

1. 
   
   
   • Acute onset of fever AND cough; or
     
   • Acute onset of ANY THREE OR MORE of the following signs or symptoms: fever, cough, general weakness/fatigue,1 headache, myalgia, sore throat, coryza, dyspnoea, anorexia/nausea/vomiting, diarrhea, altered mental status.

AND

Epidemiological criteria:

1. 
   
   
   • Residing or working in a setting with high risk of transmission of the virus: for example, closed residential settings and humanitarian settings, such as camp and camp-like settings for displaced persons, any time within the 14 days before symptom onset; or
     
   • Residing in or travel to an area with community transmission anytime within the 14 days before symptom onset; or
     
   • Working in health setting, including within health facilities and within households, anytime within the 14 days before symptom onset.

B. A patient with severe acute respiratory illness (SARI: acute respiratory infection with history of fever or measured fever of ≥ 38 C°; and cough; with onset within the last 10 days; and who requires hospitalization).

C. An asymptomatic person not meeting epidemiologic criteria with a positive SARS-CoV-2 antigen-detecting rapid diagnostic test (Ag-RDT).2

 

[ringbearer]

I hope it doesn't sound selfish, but DH and I feel "cheated" by the pandemic. We had long planned a Mediterranean cruise for our 50th anniversary June 25 of this year. Due to Covid, we weren't able to enjoy a fabulous cruise to celebrate our 50 years together and DH's retirement last December. Given the current status of the ongoing pandemic, who knows if or when we might ever be able to cruise again? Not to mention that there are so many restrictions in place for cruise passengers that it would probably not be a pleasant experience.

Very sorry you're missing your celebration of such huge milestones. I agree about vacationing not being a pleasant experience. I've booked a Christmas trip, but have been telling my kids there is a very good chance we won't be going. The country we'd be travelling to requires Covid tests coming and going, even for those who've had the shots, and is on a 9 pm curfew. Not to mention the masking on the plane and, presumably, in the public areas of the hotel. If things don't change before Christmas, I'll probably cancel it. Last Christmas we got in and out of Mexico just before the rules changed and there were only very loosely enforced mask mandates.

 

[jjenny]

Finally, our 16-17 years should be jabbed very soon, in time for the new school year in September. Interesting that they will only get one shot, for now.

Covid: 16 and 17-year-olds in England to be offered jab by 23 August

Teenagers and children have stronger immunity. Do they think one dose is enough for them?

 

[anneg]

Biden Administration Plans for Vaccine Boosters, Perhaps by Fall

With a stockpile of at least 100 million doses at the ready, Biden administration officials are developing a plan to start offering coronavirus booster shots to some Americans as early as this fall even as researchers continue to hotly debate whether extra shots are needed, according to people familiar with the effort.

The first boosters are likely to go to nursing home residents and health care workers, followed by other older people who were near the front of the line when vaccinations began late last year. Officials envision giving people the same vaccine they originally received. They have discussed starting the effort in October but have not settled on a timetable.

[...]

Among other indicators, officials say, the administration is carefully watching Israel, where some data suggests an uptick in severe disease among older adults who received the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine early in that nation’s campaign, according to people who have reviewed it.

[...]

Late this week, the F.D.A. authorized third doses of the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines for certain people with weakened immune systems and the C.D.C. recommended them. The authorities decided those individuals, who make up fewer than 3 percent of Americans, merited extra shots because many fail to respond to the standard dosage.

[...]

According to the C.D.C., only a tiny fraction of the more than 166 million fully vaccinated Americans have been hospitalized for Covid-19 or have died. Of that number — 8,054 as of Aug. 9 — three-fourths were 65 or older. But the agency says the true total is likely larger because the data relies on voluntary reporting from the states.

[...]

Researchers at Israel’s Ministry of Health have said that the Pfizer vaccine’s effectiveness in preventing infection fell from 95 percent early in the year to 39 percent from late June to mid-July. The vaccine’s overall efficacy against severe disease remained high, though, at 91.4 percent.

More recent Israeli data suggests continued erosion. One person who has reviewed it said it showed that the Pfizer vaccine’s efficacy against severe disease had dropped significantly for those 65 and older who got their first shots in January or February.

[I used red font to highlight that last paragraph because that describes DH and me.]

 

[SouthAussie]

<RSBM>
And you have to allow for the fully vaccinated being far more likely to be in the older age groups along with those who are already living with conditions that adversely affect their immunity and perhaps mean that the vaccines aren't as effective in them (like people living with leukemia).

I posted a science article a bit further back in the thread that measured the antibodies in (vaccinated) immunocompromised people. People with cancers and other conditions.

Many of those people built no antibody protection after one dose, many built some antibody protection after two doses, some people never built any antibody protection at all.

I think this is why there is a move to give the immunocompromised a third dose very soon.