Court: Teaching Credential Required To Home School

[angelmom]

i live in duval county Florida. i can only speak on what i have seen locally. a child that is home schooled must be tested at the end of each school year by a teacher approved of by the school board. parents must keep a portfolio of their child's work and have it checked by the teacher at this time.

i agree that some over sight is good but a teaching certificate is way over the line.

In GA it is the same. I don't know the specifics, but I do know there are certain points where the child has to pass certain standardized tests and that there is a list of approved tests that the parents have to either pay to have their child take OR buy and be certified to administer. Also, they have to have attendance records, a portfolio, a record of grades, etc.

My friend who homeschooled her boys was very active in the homeschooling community. Every time the issue comes around, they have a group show up en masse at the legislature and offer to enroll them all the following Monday. Since our school system is currently overcrowded to the point of near riots, the legislators realize the insanity of the proposal and decide that there is more pressing political hay to make.

There are good and bad in every system - homeschooling, public schooling, and private schooling. In every case a LOT of it has to do with the motivation and involvement of the parents. I think you could take a gifted child and motivated parents to the worst school in the world and there might rise one of the leaders of our time; but by the same token, a child with severe learning differences and a neglectful parent might have the most inspired teaching of all time and still end up a drug-ridden, illiterate criminal.

If only there were a drug to make people care about their kids.

 

[NaNaRosebud]

To CyberLaw:
Have you ever even SEEN a textbook that you can buy from Amazon on ANY subject/curriculum?

Surely you don't think that a parent just one day decides to home school their child and then grabs any old magazine and starts teaching the contents. Or they don't sit down and think of what information they know and need to teach their child.

You make it sound like parents are too stupid to even teach their own child.

Do you not realize that the school district has to approve the plans of the home schooled student. The parent has to bring in curriculum/lesson plans (per se) so that those plans can be approved as in line with the state learning standards.

Each state has their own learning standards of what each student should know at what level of education in each grade of their school experience.
Those plans are out there for parents to follow.

Parents BUY textbooks that follow those standards. Then they teach what is in those books.

Then the student must take a state approved test to see if they have learned up to the state standard.

I don't think you have a good idea of just how home schooling works.

 

[Mygirlsadie]

All 3 of my kids go to Private school but I am curious what is to come our way next year when we move & they have to start attending Public school. I would love to have the option to home school my children if the Public school didn't meet up to their needs. I guess I better get my butt to school and start hitting the books to get my teaching degree huh?! :crazy:

 

[believe09]

that indicated the law would not be enforced, per Ahhnold (sorry, being silly) and the guy in charge of education for the state. Even the prosecutor of the case that triggered the ruling said it was not at all her intention to have the law being suddenly enforced, simply to ensure that parents who do not have the best interests of their children at heart by keeping them out of school are prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. It was a child neglect case/welfare case that started this, right???

And BTW God bless all of you who have the energy to homeschool-I adore my children, but already my 7 year old and I square off about simple homework...I cannot imagine trying to teach her, lol!!!!

 

[CyberLaw]

Again, I have to emphasize, when a child is kept out of school, he/she is kept away from "those who may wonder" why the child looks neglected and abused.

If a child is abused then hopefully teachers and administrators will ensure that proper authorities are contacted. But as often is the case, these "home schooled" children are kept out of school to cover up abuse.

I cannot see a child properly educated in an abusive home.

Also, I am well aware of "Are you smarter then a Fifth Grader" is just a program, but darn it all, the questions are basic. No trick questions here. People cannot even answer "basic" questions regarding math and geography.

It is not like Jeopardy, where my least favorites topics are Ancient History, Classic Literature and Art.

I think it is very telling when more people can tell you more about who Britney is and Paris is, the the situations in Dafur and Tibet.

 

[Buzz Mills]

Layoff notices set to hit 10,100 California teachers' mailboxes

More than 10,100 teachers will see pink slips in their mailboxes over the next few days as districts up and down California meet a Saturday deadline to warn staff of anticipated layoffs due to the state's budget crisis.

http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2008/03/14/MN6UVJBJH.DTL

 

[Mygirlsadie]

That's because Britney and Paris aren't boring. Sorry, it's sad to say but it's true. Now of course they are not important like the situation in Tibet & Dafur but unfortunately people just aren't interested in that.

Again, I have to emphasize, when a child is kept out of school, he/she is kept away from "those who may wonder" why the child looks neglected and abused.

If a child is abused then hopefully teachers and administrators will ensure that proper authorities are contacted. But as often is the case, these "home schooled" children are kept out of school to cover up abuse.

I cannot see a child properly educated in an abusive home.

Also, I am well aware of "Are you smarter then a Fifth Grader" is just a program, but darn it all, the questions are basic. No trick questions here. People cannot even answer "basic" questions regarding math and geography.

It is not like Jeopardy, where my least favorites topics are Ancient History, Classic Literature and Art.

I think it is very telling when more people can tell you more about who Britney is and Paris is, the the situations in Dafur and Tibet.

 

[sherri79]

something i do not understand in this thread. some people see this as a way to save abused children. this law does not make it illegal to home school your children but says parents must have a higher education to home school. educated people still abuse their children. a teaching certificate does not make you safe. if all it took was a teaching certificate would we read the stories of teachers that abuse children ? teachers that get pregnant by preteen boys, that play a game about being blind that involves a "taste test", marry their students before they graduate, talk about their students perky breast, create child on their school computer, or scream at a 5 year old about how worthless they are. i know not all teachers are like this. most do this thankless job because they love kids. most parents love their children. my whole childhood was full of abuse. i was raped and beaten and told how worthless i was when i was not just neglected. i went to public school. of all the threads i have read in the crime section of children that are beaten or raped or killed by their parents i can not recall one where the parents home schooled. 2 cases of death by neglect involved home school.

to debate the value of a parents education to teach a child is a fair point. will a good set of books take the place of a well educated parent? a child that is home schooled will not need to wait for the rest of the class to catch up and receives individual attention make up for what the parents lack in education? fair points. will it prevent abuse? no. if 1 out of 500 teachers is abusive in some way then do the math. your child has at least 1 teacher a year in grades k-6 and 6 teachers a year in grades 7-12. the odds that your child would be told they are stupid or struck, or a teacher makes a sexual comment, or actually sexually abuses a child would be high enough to negate any safety for a child abused at home in hopes a teacher would notice and report.

 

[CyberLaw]

Well I hope those people who find Brit and Paris news worthy and interesting and not Dafur and Tibet are not the same parents who are home schooling their kids.

The Lesson for today:

Why don't we "become educated on current events", now what is Britney doing today as reported by the entertainment news station: The "current" event program that "Mom" the teacher put on today for your "education".

Is Britney:

A) going to court again to attempt to see her kids

B) going to a psych ward

C) getting a coffee at Starbucks

D) going shopping

E) driving without a license

F) being photographed without panties

or (G) hanging out with Paris, drinking and dancing and driving under the influence or (with a loud and firm voice and a wink, wink in the child's direction) all of the above.

I know Mom, all of the above. That is right home schooled child, you get an A in current events. Tomorrow, Lindsay Lohan, the next day Paris Hilton.

How about: WMD, I know says home schooled child, Want More Dresses.

That is right, WMD means exactly that. You can never have too many dresses, says home schooling Mom.

Why don't we take the afternoon off after all of this hard work and do just that, go shopping. Don't worry it is not like I am going to mark you absent or anything. I will mark it down in my "attendance" book as a field trip.

Mommy why did (by estimates) 100 people die today in Tibet, trying to obtain their freedom from Chinese rule.?

Oh don't worry about that, it is boring and unimportant. Now lets try to get a dress like Britney wears O.K. If you "forget about Tibet" I will buy you ice cream and we can get your hair done like Paris.

Oh, that is great says the child. I will never ever mention Tibet again. I mean come on Mom, I know Britney is more important then Tibet, because you say so. That is what you are teaching me.

 

[southcitymom]

Well I hope those people who find Brit and Paris news worthy and interesting and not Dafur and Tibet are not the same parents who are home schooling their kids.

The Lesson for today:

....... I know Britney is more important then Tibet, because you say so. That is what you are teaching me.

Are they talking about Dafur and Tibet in the public schools?

Most homeschoolers I know are way more up-to-date on pertinent current events than their peers. You obviously have issues with homeschooling and I can respect that, but this post I have referenced does not reflect the homeschoolers I know. It might even better reflect an average group of middle schoolers at XYZ Public School in Anywhere, America.

If your point is that most of America is stupid about pertinent political events, point taken - but that's not a homeschooling issue.

 

[BhamMama]

That's funny.

Do you realize that more than half of all homeschoolers are religious and are taught with religious text? That of these people more than half either don't watch mainstream tv, or don't even own a television?

My daughters couldn't tell you who Britney Spears is on more than she's a singer level, much less what kind of clothes she wears. They aren't label obsessed like many children because they don't have to deal with peer pressure to wear certain brands. They also don't see the commercials on tv either.

As a matter of fact, out of the 500+ plus families in my home school group, more than 334 of us make our children's clothing for that exact reason. We don't do characters, our children aren't walking logos and they dress their age, not what the stores tell them is appropriate.

I can promise you that my children know more about Chinese gulags, female circumcision and other atrocities than many of their peers. But it's not because we home school. It's because I'm an aware parent, period.

I would suggest you read about the subject but you don't seem to want to learn about it, as your assumptions prove here.

 

[CyberLaw]

You make it sound like parents are too stupid to even teach their own child.

Do you not realize that the school district has to approve the plans of the home schooled student. The parent has to bring in curriculum/lesson plans (per se) so that those plans can be approved as in line with the state learning standards.

Each state has their own learning standards of what each student should know at what level of education in each grade of their school experience.
Those plans are out there for parents to follow.

Parents BUY textbooks that follow those standards. Then they teach what is in those books.

Then the student must take a state approved test to see if they have learned up to the state standard.

I don't think you have a good idea of just how home schooling works.

Do you realize that more than half of all homeschoolers are religious and are taught with religious text?

Both these quotes contradict each other. One is saying that the lessons must be approved and follow state guidelines and the other one is saying that home schoolers are taught from "religious" texts. Are religious textbook "common" in the public schools.

I have a great idea what home school is about, in essence no one is held accountable to teach the material they are required to teach. A parent can choose to teach the approved material or not. Just because they say they will teach it, does not mean they can and will. There is no independent third party who is trained to "help" the parent teach.

No one to ensure the parents is correct, no one to ensure that the material that the child is required to learn is actually learned and that when the child takes a "standard" test. Is that test taken at home. In a classroom.

What if the child "fails" every test, but the parent "wants to continue" home schooling their child. No one can "force" the parent to enroll their child in a public school. The parent is a failure and so is the child. What about then. Is the home school teacher "fired" from her "job" and the child place in a "regular" classroom to ensure that the child does learn.

A lot of parents "feel" that they can do the job of a teacher, but in essence, can they? Do they actually know approved teaching methods and training. If that was the case, teachers would not need teachers college and teaching credentials. They could "hire" any parent to teach kids in public school who feel that they can do the job, but have no training and eduction to do so.

 

[Texana]

I do find (ducking for flames) that the parents who home-school for religious reasons tend to be more disciplined and very thorough in teaching all subjects.

The ones who veer more towards the "unschooling" line of thought seem to go the other direction. The child I know whose parents are not mainstream religious is abysmally ignorant of history and science.

And yes, my high school freshman has discussed world situations such as Darfur at school, and just finished a study of world religions, including examining the caste system in India.

The other problem I see with some homeschooled children (not all, thankfully) is that they often have very stereotypical views of public schooled children. Because they can often move in very insulated circles, they don't often come in contact with people who are different, and they don't have the opportunity to find out that even people who are very different in some ways can have things in common, or even that "different" does not always equate "worse."

It is always a reflection of the parent, of course, the parent who feels very superior to others tends to have a child who feels that way, no matter how they are schooled.

From my experience, I find that most home schooled children are very versed in history, good readers, and good in math. Science is iffier depending on the parents' viewpoints.

 

[angelmom]

Are religious textbook "common" in the public schools.

No, but it is legal in private schools to use religious textbooks to teach. And homeschools are generally considered to be small private schools.

I have a great idea what home school is about, in essence no one is held accountable to teach the material they are required to teach. A parent can choose to teach the approved material or not. Just because they say they will teach it, does not mean they can and will. There is no independent third party who is trained to "help" the parent teach.

This is totally incorrect. According to the GA Dept. of Education, "the program must provide a basic academic educational program which includes (but is not limited to) instruction in reading, language arts, mathematics, social studies and science."http://www.doe.k12.ga.us/askdoe.aspx?PageReq=ASKHSFAQ

No one to ensure the parents is correct, no one to ensure that the material that the child is required to learn is actually learned and that when the child takes a "standard" test. Is that test taken at home. In a classroom.

Wrong again. From the link above..."it does stipulate that an "appropriate" nationally standardized testing program be administered in consultation with a person trained in the administration and interpretation of norm-referenced tests. The law further states that the student must be evaluated at least every three years, beginning at the end of third grade. Nationally-normed assessments must be given at the end of grades 3, 6, 9, and 12. Additionally, the records of such tests must be retained for three years."

What if the child "fails" every test, but the parent "wants to continue" home schooling their child. No one can "force" the parent to enroll their child in a public school. The parent is a failure and so is the child. What about then. Is the home school teacher "fired" from her "job" and the child place in a "regular" classroom to ensure that the child does learn.

There are penalties for this behavior, just as there are consequences for poor public schools. From the GA DOE link above,

"What is the penalty for being violation of this law?
Any person in violation of this law is guilty of a misdemeanor and upon conviction shall be punished by a fine not to exceed $100 (one hundred dollars).
What steps should a local school superintendent take when a violation occurs?
The law requires the local school superintendent to notify the parent or guardian of the child and then to report to the juvenile or other court having jurisdiction.

The mandate placed on the public education system calls for each local school superintendent to enforce the compulsory attendance of all children between the ages of six and 16 in a public school, a private school or a home study program that meets legal requirements."

A lot of parents "feel" that they can do the job of a teacher, but in essence, can they? Do they actually know approved teaching methods and training. If that was the case, teachers would not need teachers college and teaching credentials. They could "hire" any parent to teach kids in public school who feel that they can do the job, but have no training and eduction to do so.

Obviously you have a strong bias against homeschooling that is not based on the law. The Board of Education is responsible both for the public schools and for enforcing the homeschooling requirements. They are either doing a good job or they aren't. And if they aren't, is putting the children back in public school really doing them any favors?

 

[Native New Yorker]

I homeschooled my kids in Georgia for seven years. I used a secular curriculum, and they took many enrichment classes outside of the home. I did not homeschool for religious reasons, but one of my kids did take an outside class which was Creation Science ( anti- evolution). My kids were Iowa-Tested every three years. The public school said they were learning disabled...by the time they entered public school in Illinois, they were honors students. My eldest took so many advanced high school classes that she was ahead in college.
Yes, they missed out on things in those early years, both good ( strong friendships) and bad ( head lice, being labeled as learning disabled) but I am glad I took the time to do this for them.
My kids learned to think for themselves, first and foremost. Perhaps a good ( read expensive) private school could have done the same for them, but there were none around us.

 

[sherri79]

"Are you smarter than a fifth grader" is a television show. I highly suspect that they give those kids the questions and answers that they are going to be asked. I have a friend that teaches 5th grade in the public school system and she tells me most of those questions are not in her curriculum. Surely, you know that you can't believe everything you see on television.

if the adults on that show are dumber than the fifth graders perhaps someone should point out the adults recived public education.

 

[Texana]

I homeschooled my kids in Georgia for seven years. I used a secular curriculum, and they took many enrichment classes outside of the home. I did not homeschool for religious reasons, but one of my kids did take an outside class which was Creation Science ( anti- evolution). My kids were Iowa-Tested every three years. The public school said they were learning disabled...by the time they entered public school in Illinois, they were honors students. My eldest took so many advanced high school classes that she was ahead in college.
Yes, they missed out on things in those early years, both good ( strong friendships) and bad ( head lice, being labeled as learning disabled) but I am glad I took the time to do this for them.
My kids learned to think for themselves, first and foremost. Perhaps a good ( read expensive) private school could have done the same for them, but there were none around us.

I think your approach is one of the better compromises--homeschool during early years, public high school for later. Sounds like you did a great job with your children.

LOL on the head lice--my girls both brought them home after sleepovers in the summer.

 

[Native New Yorker]

Thanks, Texana! The thing is, that there is no perfect way to raise our kids...
as for the homeschooling parents who are not qualified to teach....I have a nephew who also had some learning problems ...and the public school system really let him down....he was not dumb, but they made him feel that way....so he just gave up...never went on to college....He is one of the reasons why I felt empowered enough to teach my own kids...figured I could not do any worse!

 

[Texana]

Thanks, Texana! The thing is, that there is no perfect way to raise our kids...
as for the homeschooling parents who are not qualified to teach....I have a nephew who also had some learning problems ...and the public school system really let him down....he was not dumb, but they made him feel that way....so he just gave up...never went on to college....He is one of the reasons why I felt empowered enough to teach my own kids...figured I could not do any worse!

Learning disabled kids are a pretty strong argument for homeschooling. They are just getting what the public school system already says they should be getting--individual education based on their unique needs.

I couldn't agree with you more about there being no perfect way. Wish there was...

 

[Nocgirl]

I do not know what requirements are installed to homeschool in each state, but my cousin in CA homeschooled her 2 kids. She is not qualified to do this, she barely has a high school diploma. Her kids are 18 and 21 now and both are extremely anti-social and completely clueless on the outside world. The 21 yr old just recently got his drivers license and finally just got a job. Mom and Dad homeschooled to keep their kids from being exposed to the real world. They are so sheltered it's scary.