Still Missing CT - Jennifer Dulos, 50, New Canaan, 24 May 2019 *ARRESTS* #58

[Area52]

I distinctly remember reading a few weeks ago, that a court declared Jennifer dead for the purposes of having her estate turned.over to her children because of her mother's age. This was granted by a Connecticut court, even though the 7 year missing requirement has not yet been reach because "brain matter" belonging to Jennifer was found along with her blood. Has anyone else seen this or did I miss the.posts?

 

[Diddian]

I distinctly remember reading a few weeks ago, that a court declared Jennifer dead for the purposes of having her estate turned.over to her children because of her mother's age. This was granted by a Connecticut court, even though the 7 year missing requirement has not yet been reach because "brain matter" belonging to Jennifer was found along with her blood. Has anyone else seen this or did I miss the.posts?

Posts were made here referencing news reports that probate court Judge William P. Ostendoerf, in response to a petition filed by JFD’s mother, declared JFD dead, premised on the basis ”that overwhelming evidence submitted to the Court supports the claim that Jennifer sustained non-survivable injuries.” The judge also discussed the length of time Jennifer has been missing without her body being found despite LE searches and the fact that there has been no contact since Jennifer went missing.

Those news reports did not reference “brain matter.”

However, in the trial, photographic evidence was introduced and a LE officer testified about a small specimen, light in color, collected from the underside of a vehicle and delivered to the medical examiner. Posters here have speculated that the specimen looked like possible brain matter. (ETA: the Medical Examiner has not yet testified.)

 

[pernickety]

Your theory that Pattis might hide the evidence like a knife is plausible. Keeping the knife (if it exists) from LE using extra- ethical methods does comport with my knowledge of Pattis. And since we are talking about the very public figure Pattis, plausible speculation is fair game IMO.

But I don't see how it would benefit Pattis to invent Fudge. Why put it out that a knife existed, unless it was also known by Oattis that LE knew about the knife. We still don't know what weapon(s) were used in the murder- there is no benefit to Fotis Dulos to name one. If the knife existed and were known, why put it out that anyone handled it, unless that was already known by LE?

A knife does seem plausible to me. It also seems plausible that Fotis Dulos intended to use a knife to threaten and aid in an abduction. If he had intended to kill her on scene, surely he'd have been a little better prepared with spatter control and cleanup materials- and perhaps materials that would kill leaving fewer bodily fluids around.

The murderer may have over estimated his knife's ability to obtain compliance.

Also, I think it is highly unlikely Fotis carried a gun to the scene because if he had, mentioning his gun ownership would not be prejudicial. It would be relevant to proving the case.

And he'd need some kind of plan to subdue JFD. Either he'd have to threaten her to comply or overpower her and restrain her using surprise to his advantage. I think he either messed up the surprise thing, such as by making noise in the garage, and switched to the bloody plan B, or didn't try it at all, thinking JFD would comply by knife point.

However it went down, offering the police any leads to a weapon would not benefit the defense that I can see.

MOO


Edited to add: it could be that Fotis Dulos and Pattis were aware that a knife was discarded in Hartford, and wanted to tease out a confirmation from LE that they recovered the knife (gulp) or did not (the whole knife thing was a silly rumor!)

That does make much more sense to me than just filling airwaves with incriminating rumors that otherwise only harm F. Dulos. They could have been trying to decide how to handle the knife evidence if, indeed, there was going to be knife evidence to explain.

I doubt very highly LE does not know who fudge is, as he was reportedly incarcerated for a short time. (You don't readily spring a John Doe. Or a Fudge.) The story, as told, does not include anything that Fudge would lie about. And I'm sure LE asked him about it.

What makes sense to me is Patti's may have been trying to find out what LE knew about the knife. It does not make sense to me that Fudge is a fabrication of Pattis'.

MOO

Possible Murder Weapon in Missing CT Mom Case Sold for $10: Report

A homeless man said he found the hunting switchblade and traded it with another man who then sold it for $10.

www.thedailybeast.com

Above report says a guy named "George" is seen on surveillance finding the knife (allegedly with bloody pillow) and wiping it on his pants. If LE had the blood on George's pants tested for DNA and it was positive for JFD, that would be truly important evidence.

 

[Diddian]

Do you think the Fudge story benefitted Dulos?

I think it is quite incriminating, given the video evidence of Dulos and Troconis touring Hartford garbage cans.

The only benefit to Patti's/Dulos that I can imagine is releasing the story as an attempt to locate the alleged knife before LE. That woukd be quite unethical to help one's client find and disappear evidence. But Dulos was already under investigation of doing exactly that (not to mention murder) and we would later learn about apparent possessions of GP., suggesting this could be a strategy Patti's would be willing to implement.

MOO

Does anyone remember when the “Fudge” story about the knife surfaced? (ETA: Never mind, I see the knife/Fudge story in the Hartford Courant came out in Sept 2019, so around the time of FD’s first arrest.)

I also recall news reports about an ax FD had borrowed from a neighbor (to cut firewood) a month before JFD disappeared that was confiscated from FD’s garage at the time of his arrest on 1/7/2020. The ax confiscation was interesting in light of Exhibit 110 (wood fragment) reported as evidence collected in association with the search of FD’s 2015 black Chevy Suburban. There was discussion on these threads at the time the ax was confiscated (and a batch of search warrants was released).

Fotis Dulos Allegedly Borrowed An Ax, Which Has Been Confiscated, Before Jennifer Dulos Vanished | Oxygen

An ax that Fotis Dulos allegedly borrowed from a friend a month before his wife, Jennifer Dulos, vanished was seized from his Connecticut mansion on Tuesday, January 7 when he was arrested on murder charges.

www.oxygen.com

 

[afitzy]

Your theory that Pattis might hide the evidence like a knife is plausible. Keeping the knife (if it exists) from LE using extra- ethical methods does comport with my knowledge of Pattis. And since we are talking about the very public figure Pattis, plausible speculation is fair game IMO.

But I don't see how it would benefit Pattis to invent Fudge. Why put it out that a knife existed, unless it was also known by Oattis that LE knew about the knife. We still don't know what weapon(s) were used in the murder- there is no benefit to Fotis Dulos to name one. If the knife existed and were known, why put it out that anyone handled it, unless that was already known by LE?

A knife does seem plausible to me. It also seems plausible that Fotis Dulos intended to use a knife to threaten and aid in an abduction. If he had intended to kill her on scene, surely he'd have been a little better prepared with spatter control and cleanup materials- and perhaps materials that would kill leaving fewer bodily fluids around.

The murderer may have over estimated his knife's ability to obtain compliance.

Also, I think it is highly unlikely Fotis carried a gun to the scene because if he had, mentioning his gun ownership would not be prejudicial. It would be relevant to proving the case.

And he'd need some kind of plan to subdue JFD. Either he'd have to threaten her to comply or overpower her and restrain her using surprise to his advantage. I think he either messed up the surprise thing, such as by making noise in the garage, and switched to the bloody plan B, or didn't try it at all, thinking JFD would comply by knife point.

However it went down, offering the police any leads to a weapon would not benefit the defense that I can see.

MOO


Edited to add: it could be that Fotis Dulos and Pattis were aware that a knife was discarded in Hartford, and wanted to tease out a confirmation from LE that they recovered the knife (gulp) or did not (the whole knife thing was a silly rumor!)

That does make much more sense to me than just filling airwaves with incriminating rumors that otherwise only harm F. Dulos. They could have been trying to decide how to handle the knife evidence if, indeed, there was going to be knife evidence to explain.

I doubt very highly LE does not know who fudge is, as he was reportedly incarcerated for a short time. (You don't readily spring a John Doe. Or a Fudge.) The story, as told, does not include anything that Fudge would lie about. And I'm sure LE asked him about it.

What makes sense to me is Patti's may have been trying to find out what LE knew about the knife. It does not make sense to me that Fudge is a fabrication of Pattis'.

MOO

Can’t disagree with any of this theory. It’s plausible as you outline.

Thing though is that I believe anything we know about fudge is from DA and not corroborated by LE. I’d have to go back and double check this past statement but I don’t think we ever heard about the knife or murder weapon for that matter from LE one way or another. I dread going back and listening to clips of the “Baghdad Bob” of this case aka as Detective Foley if I recall. I think I need to put foley on the bingo card as I don’t think I’ve seen a worse public voice of a crime than him. Where is Sheriff Grady when you need him!

We also didn’t know and honestly still don’t know if the murder weapon was a knife. Imo as everyone here has said, a knife makes the most sense given the extent of blood loss. What could have resulted in blunt force trauma in the garage? We don’t yet have a theory on that or even know if that happened. Imo a determined and fierce knife attack alone could have subdued the witness in short order and brought the Victim to her knees in line with the trajectory testimony we heard last week.

Could Pattis had simply been trying to tease out from LE that they had a murder weapon one way or another and simply used DA to deliver the public message? Seems plausible to me.

It was a chaotic time and Pattis knew that LE was withholding information from the public at that time and was desperate to continue his very public defence of FD. I was watching clips of his stmts at that time last night (glutton for punishment) and frankly imo he looked manic, exhausted and more than a little panicked that no alternative theory was readily at hand even in his creative mind. He also was desperate to stay in the public eye imo and so needed to keep people on the story even it meant feeding misinformation to the press.

I think we probably could agree that having the DA story not being tied to LE was more probable than it being tied to Pattis. Thing also though is that Pattis allegedly had deep contacts in LE assisting his efforts and this wasn’t talked about too much but was long rumoured. I don’t doubt it as Pattis had been around a good long while and no doubt had a network of contacts.

Would I love to see Fudge alive and well and showing up in court? Yes, but don’t believe it will happen but I will add it to the bingo card.

 

[citygirl]

Possible Murder Weapon in Missing CT Mom Case Sold for $10: Report

A homeless man said he found the hunting switchblade and traded it with another man who then sold it for $10.

www.thedailybeast.com

Above report says a guy named "George" is seen on surveillance finding the knife (allegedly with bloody pillow) and wiping it on his pants. If LE had the blood on George's pants tested for DNA and it was positive for JFD, that would be truly important evidence.

Thanks so much. I had forgotten they caught it on video!!!!!

 

[citygirl]

Does anyone remember when the “Fudge” story about the knife surfaced? (ETA: Never mind, I see the knife/Fudge story in the Hartford Courant came out in Sept 2019, so around the time of FD’s first arrest.)

I also recall news reports about an ax FD had borrowed from a neighbor (to cut firewood) a month before JFD disappeared that was confiscated from FD’s garage at the time of his arrest on 1/7/2020. The ax confiscation was interesting in light of Exhibit 110 (wood fragment) reported as evidence collected in association with the search of FD’s 2015 black Chevy Suburban. There was discussion on these threads at the time the ax was confiscated (and a batch of search warrants was released).

Fotis Dulos Allegedly Borrowed An Ax, Which Has Been Confiscated, Before Jennifer Dulos Vanished | Oxygen

An ax that Fotis Dulos allegedly borrowed from a friend a month before his wife, Jennifer Dulos, vanished was seized from his Connecticut mansion on Tuesday, January 7 when he was arrested on murder charges.

www.oxygen.com

Another good one!

 

[afitzy]

Possible Murder Weapon in Missing CT Mom Case Sold for $10: Report

A homeless man said he found the hunting switchblade and traded it with another man who then sold it for $10.

www.thedailybeast.com

Above report says a guy named "George" is seen on surveillance finding the knife (allegedly with bloody pillow) and wiping it on his pants. If LE had the blood on George's pants tested for DNA and it was positive for JFD, that would be truly important evidence.

Sadly imo the Daily Beast was simply doing what the other outlets were doing and “reposting” the DA article info. There are other articles that are similar to this one on the topic and this one was better than most as it cited DA. Most didn’t even cite their source if I recall. What bugs me about the Beast article is that it talks about Law enforcement but no public statement from law enforcement on anything related to George or Fudge exists so far as I know. These articles made it seem as if Law enforcement was all over a knife issue and I’m not sure we ever heard that to be the case from law enforcement. These reposting articles made following the case virtually impossible as the Foley statements simply weren’t helpful and the overall communication with the public imo was substandard.

We also saw Pattis at the time with open access to any member of the press and so it was a circus. I don’t think any other member of the press went to Hartford to investigate or ask around that I can recall.

Press has been sitting in cubes or at home reposting AA info and the DA info on this topic imo. No substantive reporting and even the so called longer format shows just did cut and paste jobs on the public info.

 

[citygirl]

Sadly imo the Daily Beast was simply doing what the other outlets were doing and “reposting” the DA article info. There are other articles that are similar to this one on the topic and this one was better than most as it cited DA. Most didn’t even cite their source if I recall.

We also saw Pattis at the time with open access to any member of the press and so it was a circus. I don’t think any other member of the press went to Hartford to investigate or ask around that I can recall.

Press has been sitting in cubes or at home reposting AA info and the DA info on this topic imo. No substantive reporting and even the so called longer format shows just did cut and paste jobs on the public info.

If they claim it's on video LE must have it, right?

 

[afitzy]

I distinctly remember reading a few weeks ago, that a court declared Jennifer dead for the purposes of having her estate turned.over to her children because of her mother's age. This was granted by a Connecticut court, even though the 7 year missing requirement has not yet been reach because "brain matter" belonging to Jennifer was found along with her blood. Has anyone else seen this or did I miss the.posts?

No, you are correct. Darien/New Canaan probate declared the Victim deceased.

https://www.ctinsider.com/news/article/jennifer-farber-dulos-declared-dead-will-estate-18598246.php

 

[Ruminations]

I have been going on memory, and appreciate the recent posts of ancient news stories.

I had forgotten that George and Fudge were separate people.

Which one was briefly incarcerated? Because my belief is a person without rigorous defense (not likely, sadly, for George or Fudge) would never see that knife again if it were on him while being arrested. The assumption would be it is contraband weaponry, and not something carried because a hunting trip was planned later in the day.

If the person who was arrested had the knife on them, only if it was mishandled - such as stolen by an officer in charge of the evidence closet- could it be missing.

MOO

Edit: and while Fudge has no reason to lie, certainly George would have reason to invent Fudge if George managed to hide the knife from LE and explain why he does not have it. I think maybe George went to jail, because it was the bloody pants guy.

So, maybe I conflated George and Fudge and maybe Fudge was invented by George. Or by the cop who thought the knife was cool and took it home.

MOO

 

[afitzy]

If they claim it's on video LE must have it, right?

Idk, how would they know what LE had and doesn’t have if LE didnt make a statement to confirm? Was the reporter privy to the video? My guess is not but honestly who knows until we hear and see it at trial.

Sadly I think I have to go back and listen to “Baghdad Bob” Foley statements as it’s been such a long time. The issue is that the Public Spokesperson didn’t carry through for the duration of the investigation. So much of the insane speculation existed because the communication from the state was inconsistent and poor. We also had Prosecutors not speaking to the public. So, little to no info made it out imo and most was speculation imo.

I’m truly not sure it makes sense to read the press so perhaps I will just wait for trial. My recollection was Collangelo must have put the fear of god into law enforcement about leaks and so no info got out for a time. So, if the info source that had factual info wasn’t available to the press imo that left them to rinse and repeat on Pattis statements and sadly that is what we got as the public.

Hope I’m wrong but I think I won’t waste time on old articles and will wait for trial as frankly I don’t know what can and can’t be believed from the press.

MOO

 

[afitzy]

I have been going on memory, and appreciate the recent posts of ancient news stories.

I had forgotten that George and Fudge were separate people.

Which one was briefly incarcerated? Because my belief is a person without rigorous defense (not likely, sadly, for George or Fudge) would never see that knife again if it were on him while being arrested. The assumption would be it is contraband weaponry, and not something carried because a hunting trip was planned later in the day.

If the person who was arrested had the knife on them, only if it was mishandled - such as stolen by an officer in charge of the evidence closet- could it be missing.

MOO

Per this story it seems like George was incarcerated.

 

[waldojabba]

Possible Murder Weapon in Missing CT Mom Case Sold for $10: Report

A homeless man said he found the hunting switchblade and traded it with another man who then sold it for $10.

www.thedailybeast.com

Above report says a guy named "George" is seen on surveillance finding the knife (allegedly with bloody pillow) and wiping it on his pants. If LE had the blood on George's pants tested for DNA and it was positive for JFD, that would be truly important evidence.

From the article -
According to The Hartford Courant, a hunting switchblade was found in a garbage bag also containing a bloody pillow by a homeless man named “George”—who is seen on surveillance video taking an object out of the trash can, wiping it on his pants leg, and putting it in his pocket. “George” reportedly traded the knife to a man called “Fudge,” who says he then sold the knife for $10. “Fudge” reportedly told investigators he did not remember who bought the knife, which he said was slightly smaller than a chef’s knife. “I had no idea it (the knife) was from some murder until the police told me when they questioned me. I said I had nothing to do with no murder,” he told the newspaper. State police believe the knife, along with other evidence tainted with Farber Dulos’ blood, was tossed on the same day the mother went missing in May.
Just for clarity. Imo.

 

[Sundog]

It’s been been said many times before but I’d like to repeat again, LA is imo a heroine in this case and also imo she saves the 5 dulos children from FD and MT.

Keep in mind she wasn’t a parent, guardian or custodian of the children and was simply an employee of JF at the time. She risked being sued for taking the children (FD did threaten her with kidnapping) across state lines to their grandmother in ny. Put yourself in her shoes as an employee, she didn’t know where her friend and boss was but she had the presence of mind and courage to know something was terribly wrong.

It’s one thing to know something is wrong but it’s another thing to have the courage to do something about it. But for whatever reason she knew that removing the children to the safety of their grandmother was what needed to be done and she did it at great personal risk imo. Not sure how many employees would take such a risk. Iirc she did what she did even without all the proper car seats in place in her much smaller car and also iirc FD threatened to sue her for child endangerment for the lack of proper seating in her small car.

We saw what happened next as FD drove down to New York and assaulted the doorman at GF apartment. Gloria Farber as always was prepared with an armed guard at her apartment. The New York post reported extensively on this for reference. Can you imagine not knowing where your daughter and mother of 5 children was and having to
Deal with a violent and angry FD showing up at your door.

I always wonder if the motivation behind grabbing the children over the weekend was because FD was trying to show himself and a not doubt highly angry MT that there was still a way to access the Farber wealth via the children and keep a roof over their head as Gloria Farber would never allow the children to be homeless? Neither FD or MT cared a whit for the children but only imo cared what the children represented which was control over Gloria Farber and her access to cash to keep the grifting duo in their lifestyle and lattes!

Were FD and MT going to take the children and flee to Greece where GF wouldn’t easily be able to bring them back to US or maybe effectively hold them ransom from their grandmother as she was the only person (other than the trusts of the children) with money in this tragic FD And MT grift as FD and MT worlds were falling apart as neither had any money, the house they were living in belonged to the farbers and the police would be knocking on their door shortly.

Moo

The "grifting duo" is what this case is all about, and would like to see it replace the "gone girl" nonsense on social media.

 

[waldojabba]

No, you are correct. Darien/New Canaan probate declared the Victim deceased.

https://www.ctinsider.com/news/article/jennifer-farber-dulos-declared-dead-will-estate-18598246.php

From the article
A probate judge made the declaration on Oct. 24, 2023, after receiving an overwhelming amount of evidence that “supports the claim that Jennifer sustained non-survivable injuries," according to documents obtained Tuesday by Hearst Connecticut Media Group.

***Declared dead - But no specific mention of brain matter. Non survivable injuries would be a finding though if brain matter was perhaps the scraping taken off the car. Sounds plausible imo just not definite yet. Imo.

 

[afitzy]

Some of the Foley statements:

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State Police and Foley on FD suicide attempt: https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=press+conference+jennifer+dulos

Last Foley interview before gag order:

- YouTube

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Other videos:
FD 911 Call after JF left with children and filed for divorce:

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Psychologist does a body language analysis of MT in Police Interview:

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Note: at 7:24 is where MT turns to Atty Bowman, imo dismisses him and then tells Detectives about the disallowed Dr Herman report as a means imo to deflect from their questioning and disrupt the interview process. at 11:43 is where one of the Detectives say that per FD phone he was attempting to get back with JF.

Interview with Atty Jim Bergenn when JF bloody tee shirt was found along with duck tape with FD fingerprint inside and MT acknowledging her presence with FD and how Gone Girl makes no sense: Attorney Jim Bergenn discusses new evidence found in Dulos case

Defence put this info out in advance of request to remove GPS - new clips from MT interviews: New Video Released In Case Of Missing Connecticut Mother Jennifer Dulos

The "MT is Innocent Tour Courtesy of TP" and 48 Hrs What does the Other Woman know included it all: Family of woman charged in connection to Jennifer Dulos' presumed murder speaks out [No words for CBS bias in this program imo]

Fox5 Clip Summary: The Death of Jennifer Dulos - One Year On | The Tape Room
FD "I Know what I've done": Jennifer Dulos Case: In First Interview, Missing Mom's Husband Says 'I Know What I've Done' | I-Team

Movers talk about their experience with JF: Movers recall interactions with Fotis and Jennifer Dulos at time of divorce

FD reprimanded in Court for removing JF memorial: Judge scolds Fotis Dulos over Jennifer Dulos memorial

EMS giving CPR to FD after suicide attempt (GRAPHIC WARNING AS THERE IS NO BLURRING): Fotis Dulos Given CPR at Connecticut Home

Atty Weinstein (another hero class act in this case IMO) Interview during Civil Trial (explains the mortgage situation at 4JX and how it was secured by cash by Hilliard Farber - FD couldn't or wouldn't even pay interest - update on the family - comments about FD ongoing lying made by Judge Heller and asking his children to lie on his behalf): FULL INTERVIEW: Attorney for Jennifer Dulos' family addresses case

L&C Report (good footage on 4JX): L&C Report: Investigators Search Farmington Home For Body Of Missing Mom Jennifer Dulos

Three Year Timeline review and discussion of DV and passing of "Jennifers Law" by Hartford Legislature: The disappearance of Jennifer Dulos three years later: A timeline

For some comic relief here is Nancy Grace on LA Nanny Knows: THE NANNY KNOWS! Missing Mom Jennifer Dulos' Nanny SPILLS FAMILY SECRETS IN MURDER TRIAL

Who is Kent Mawhinney [includes video of gas can and crowbar man]: Who is Kent Mawhinney and how is he connected to the Jennifer Dulos investigation?

 

[Diddian]

Some of the Foley statements:

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Other videos:
FD 911 Call after JF left with children and filed for divorce:

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Psychologist does a body language analysis of MT in Police Interview:

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Note: at 7:24 is where MT turns to Atty Bowman, imo dismisses him and then tells Detectives about the disallowed Dr Herman report as a means imo to deflect from their questioning and disrupt the interview process. at 11:43 is where one of the Detectives say that per FD phone he was attempting to get back with JF.

Defence put this info out in advance of request to remove GPS - new clips from MT interviews: New Video Released In Case Of Missing Connecticut Mother Jennifer Dulos

The "MT is Innocent Tour Courtesy of TP" and 48 Hrs What does the Other Woman know included it all: Family of woman charged in connection to Jennifer Dulos' presumed murder speaks out [No words for CBS bias in this program imo]

Fox5 Clip Summary: The Death of Jennifer Dulos - One Year On | The Tape Room
FD "I Know what I've done": Jennifer Dulos Case: In First Interview, Missing Mom's Husband Says 'I Know What I've Done' | I-Team

Movers talk about their experience with JF: Movers recall interactions with Fotis and Jennifer Dulos at time of divorce

FD reprimanded in Court for removing JF memorial: Judge scolds Fotis Dulos over Jennifer Dulos memorial

EMS giving CPR to FD after suicide attempt (GRAPHIC WARNING AS THERE IS NO BLURRING): Fotis Dulos Given CPR at Connecticut Home

Atty Weinstein (another hero class act in this case IMO) Interview during Civil Trial (explains the mortgage situation at 4JX and how it was secured by cash by Hilliard Farber - FD couldn't or wouldn't even pay interest - update on the family - comments about FD ongoing lying made by Judge Heller and asking his children to lie on his behalf): FULL INTERVIEW: Attorney for Jennifer Dulos' family addresses case

L&C Report (good footage on 4JX): L&C Report: Investigators Search Farmington Home For Body Of Missing Mom Jennifer Dulos

For some comic relief here is Nancy Grace on LA Nanny Knows: THE NANNY KNOWS! Missing Mom Jennifer Dulos' Nanny SPILLS FAMILY SECRETS IN MURDER TRIAL

With respect to the body language video (during interview of MT by multiple members of LE and an investigator with State's Attorney's office), it seemed to me that MT was impatient to tell the officers about the psychologist's report about JFD from the FIRST MOMENT they asked her to share if she knew anything about where JFD might be. Averting her eyes, backing up in her chair, rubbing her face and holding her hands palm out - all to "change the subject" from that of murder to JFD's inclination to make herself disappear. (ETA: Eventually, she turned to Bowman and indicated she wanted to bring up the sealed report and he emphatically responded, "No." And she brought it up anyway.)

When FD was asked about JFD at the waterski pond BBQ the week following her disappearance, it is also the FIRST THING out of FD's mouth (some comments about how much $ JFD spent on medical bills, presumably having to do with mental health).

It might not have been on the "alibi script," but it was clearly the agreed-upon defense developed in the conspirators' planning.

ETA: Even when they ask her, "you have a daughter, right? Would you disappear and not stay in touch with her?" And her answer isn't that she wouldn't because her daughter needs her, it is "no, because I am a healthy person." She wants to present a contrast - implying JFD is not a healthy person.

 

[afitzy]

With respect to the body language video (during interview of MT by multiple members of LE and an investigator with State's Attorney's office), it seemed to me that MT was impatient to tell the officers about the psychologist's report about JFD from the FIRST MOMENT they asked her to share if she knew anything about where JFD might be. Averting her eyes, backing up in her chair, rubbing her face and holding her hands palm out - all to "change the subject" from that of murder to JFD's inclination to make herself disappear. (ETA: Eventually, she turned to Bowman and indicated she wanted to bring up the sealed report and he emphatically responded, "No." And she brought it up anyway.)

When FD was asked about JFD at the waterski pond BBQ the week following her disappearance, it is also the FIRST THING out of FD's mouth (some comments about how much $ JFD spent on medical bills, presumably having to do with mental health).

It might not have been on the "alibi script," but it was clearly the agreed-upon defense developed in the conspirators' planning.

ETA: Even when they ask her, "you have a daughter, right? Would you disappear and not stay in touch with her?" And her answer isn't that she wouldn't because her daughter needs her, it is "no, because I am a healthy person." She wants to present a contrast - implying JFD is not a healthy person.

I agree. This clip even though its short is powerful imo. Stunning stuff. IMO MT seems more mad than upset about anything and didn't care about JF OR the Dulos children - think she truly is a narc just like FD but of a lower level but all she cared about in this interview so far as I can see is herself and she had zero intention of helping find JF. The idea that FD might have lied to her and will betray and blame her also seemed to be a revelation. The Dr was looking for upper forehead movement and imo the lack of it was most likely Botox as its widely used in the demographic imo.

 

[Diddian]

I agree. This clip even though its short is powerful imo. Stunning stuff. IMO MT seems more mad than upset about anything and didn't care about JF OR the Dulos children - think she truly is a narc just like FD but of a lower level but all she cared about in this interview so far as I can see is herself and she had zero intention of helping find JF. The idea that FD might have lied to her and will betray and blame her also seemed to be a revelation. The Dr was looking for upper forehead movement and imo the lack of it was most likely Botox as its widely used in the demographic imo.

I guessed that Botox obscured her upper forehead movement as well.

And I agree. The primary emotion I saw in MT's face and movements in that interview was anger. Anger that the interviewers weren't just accepting her "Get Out of Jail Free" card that she thought the claim about JFD's own mental health would be.

It's a toxic and dangerous mix when two narcissists join together and neither recognize nor honor civilized limits. (I think of the Chad Daybell and Lori Vallow case - and the horrors they committed against LV's own children, not to mention their respective spouses.).

FD was clearly a gold-digging narcissist who took advantage of Jennifer and her family and rewarded their generosity toward him with mistreatment of Jennifer, cheating against her, and endangering their family by bringing dangerous others into their lives.

But, IMO MT is not simply some side character pulled into the vortex of FD's criminal behavior; she is the "Eve" in this story, whispering the tempting "Do it. We can do it and enjoy the rewards together," in FD's ear that assisted FD in transitioning from abuse to murder. And IMO, she did help "do it," - not necessarily the actual murder act, but the planning for it, the covering of it, and IMO, likely the treatment and disposal of JFD's body after FD left New Canaan with JFD's body on board.