DC - Savvas Savopoulos, family & Veralicia Figueroa murdered; Daron Wint Arrested #17

kammiemc · Jul 13, 2015

This was from an early WaPo article. I'm confused about when the Porsche was last seen in the neighborhood.

According to this article, the chief thought it went missing Thursday morning. Anyone?

"Lanier renewed a call she originally made Thursday for information about the movements of the family's blue 2008 Porsche 911, which disappeared from the home Thursday morning.

She asked the public to contact authorities if anyone had seen it between Wednesday and Thursday at 5 p.m. a larger time frame than authorities had initially requested. Lanier declined to explain why investigators now wanted to know the car's movements a day earlier.

The Porsche was found burning in Prince George's County, Maryland, on Thursday evening, Lanier said. Prince George's County Fire spokesman Mark Brady said firefighters extinguished the fire around 5:30 p.m. behind a church in Lanham. Lanier said it was unclear who had been driving the vehicle."

Link:
http://readingeagle.com/ap/article/four-found-in-dc-re-were-slain-police-say

facundo · Jul 13, 2015

James Bond said:
I think they are waiting for DW to spill his guts on the others involved in this crime. We already have a good indication of what is coming from his fired attorney.

I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for Wint to talk. Hanover only repeated what Ficker had said about others being involved. Hanover had no new information from DW.

facundo · Jul 13, 2015

kammiemc said:
This was from an early WaPo article. I'm confused about when the Porsche was last seen in the neighborhood.

According to this article, the chief thought it went missing Thursday morning. Anyone?

"Lanier renewed a call she originally made Thursday for information about the movements of the family's blue 2008 Porsche 911, which disappeared from the home Thursday morning.

She asked the public to contact authorities if anyone had seen it between Wednesday and Thursday at 5 p.m. — a larger time frame than authorities had initially requested. Lanier declined to explain why investigators now wanted to know the car's movements a day earlier.

The Porsche was found burning in Prince George's County, Maryland, on Thursday evening, Lanier said. Prince George's County Fire spokesman Mark Brady said firefighters extinguished the fire around 5:30 p.m. behind a church in Lanham. Lanier said it was unclear who had been driving the vehicle."

Link:
http://readingeagle.com/ap/article/four-found-in-dc-re-were-slain-police-say

Porsche was there when Vera's husband visited the house Thursday 5/14. (No link, this was discussed yesterday.)

The second time Lanier issued a call for witnesses spotting the Porsche was after it had been found burning. Police were aware of the four-hour time gap between the car being seen on New York Ave. and the car fire. They hoped that someone else may remember seeing the car.

kammiemc · Jul 13, 2015

facundo said:
Porsche was there when Vera's husband visited the house Thursday 5/14. (No link, this was discussed yesterday.)

The second time Lanier issued a call for witnesses spotting the Porsche was after it had been found burning. Police were aware of the four-hour time gap between the car being seen on New York Ave. and the car fire. They hoped that someone else may remember seeing the car.

I posted the link yesterday re VF's husband. There were other links as well saying that he said the Porsche was there on the street. So, do you think that she was saying the Porsche went missing in the AM just because that was the last time reported to be seen by anyone at the home? I remember a neighbor commenting on it either being gone or parked in an unusual place. Will try to track that down.

Bootsctr · Jul 13, 2015

facundo said:
I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for Wint to talk. Hanover only repeated what Ficker had said about others being involved. Hanover had no new information from DW.

Not holding my breath either! LE has nothing to compel him to talk. What are they going to use as leverage for Wint to talk? Tell him they are sending him back to Guyana if he doesn't talk. He's not a criminal mastermind, but I do think he knows it is in his best interest to stick with his story of not liking pizza and somebody framed him. Do I think that will fly in a courtroom? No, but the punishment will be the same. Clearly LE says he murdered Mr. Savopoulous in the SW. There's just no wiggle room at this point regarding LE getting Wint to talk.

Bootsctr · Jul 13, 2015

Peliman said:
Got a reminder last night about Wint hanging out for some time after the crime. Thanks

Wint must have thought he pulled off the perfect crime and wouldn't be caught. A witness places Wint at his fathers steps after the crime had occurred.

I think Wint suffered from delusions of grandeur or megalomania.

facundo · Jul 13, 2015

kammiemc said:
I posted the link yesterday re VF's husband. There were other links as well saying that he said the Porsche was there on the street. So, do you think that she was saying the Porsche went missing in the AM just because that was the last time reported to be seen by anyone at the home? I remember a neighbor commenting on it either being gone or parked in an unusual place. Will try to track that down.

Maybe the expanded 2-day time frame was because they had subsequently arrived at the conclusion that the hostage situation was a longer period (overnight) than they had originally surmised because neighbors had seen the car but didn't observe who was driving it.

mk4osu · Jul 13, 2015

Great questions! I'm also curious as to why he still had the white bucket. He had several hours to hide the money (and any other possessions) and dispose of the security tape. Did he take the bucket to the S house, or get the bucket, from a friend or relative's house, after the fact? LE were photographed leaving his dad's house, carrying similar white buckets, during search. The bucket is odd, in that if he brought it to transport goods from the crime scene, why a bucket? A large backpack, duffle bag, or something similar, would be much less conspicuous (easier to transport, as well). Also, if he had accomplices, how did they flee from the scene of the crime? If he had accomplices, why wouldn't they have stolen one of the other vehicles? IMO, a white RR would not have been so noticeable. They are everywhere, especially in a prominent neighborhood. They could have moved those vehicles out of there, during the night...and taken to a chop shop, long before anyone had reported them. Sadly, the security tape is probably sitting in a landfill, at this point.

Peliman said:
Got a reminder last night about Wint hanging out for some time after the crime. Thanks

Wint must have thought he pulled off the perfect crime and wouldn't be caught. A witness places Wint at his fathers steps after the crime had occured.

_________________________________________________
<snips> The story is worth a re-read.

"As police continued their hunt, JB, 31, a neighbor of the suspect's father, said he spotted Wint 'a day' after the slayings sitting outside his father's home.

Mr B, who lives opposite 57-year-old DB in the DC suburb of Lanham, said: 'I saw him just a couple of days ago - possibly just a day after it all happened.

'I was in and out and I saw him just sitting on the steps for an hour or so. He was just being quiet.

'He looked like he was just sitting and thinking. He had on a white-cut off shirt and black pants. He's a big guy and he's very strong.

'To see him sitting there after everything that had happened, it's very scary. I hope I never see him again.'

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...on-finding-DNA-pizza-crust.html#ixzz3fkPHrz1I

From another story

"DZ, who lives on the same street as Wints parents in Lanham, said she would occasionally see Wint sitting on the porch steps but that it didnt appear he lived there full time. She said Wints father and his wife, Pamela, moved in about a decade ago. Wednesday night, police searched the split-level house."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/local...707c0c-ffa7-11e4-833c-a2de05b6b2a4_story.html

So there's another SW we haven't seen.

______________________________________________________
<me>

So correct me if I'm wrong please. It was 23-25 miles to wints fathers location and the Porsche supposedly left the SS home around 1:15pm. I don't know how long it would take to get to the fathers home location. I'd suspect the Porsche arrived in Lanham, MD around 1:45 - 2pm Thursday.

I'd further speculate the Porsche contained the loot from the robbery and possibly the security system DVR. Plus the 40k blood money. That gives DW almost 3 1/2 hours to secure the 40k, whatever valuables before the car is burned to destroy whatever evidence exist in the Porsche.

Then wint gets confident and coy, hanging around his Dad's home as if nothing ever happened. Until the heat got to him and he fled for another state.

Sorry for the rambling and run on, speculating here. News story links contain names of others not involved.

So how did wint get to the bus station while fleeing?
Where did DW live if he didn't live at his fathers home?
Were those other locations (if any) searched?
Was he identified on the bus to NY?

Peliman · Jul 13, 2015

Good info facundo, thanks for the update. I'm still on it, I just need to tighten it up a bit. Doing some free range thinking this morning.

facundo said:
Depending on the route taken the distance between St. Christopher's Episcopal Church in Lanham, and the address in on Westview Lane, Lanham MD is only five or six miles. There is a Greyhound bus station at the New Carrolton Metro station in Hyattsville, MD. This is within walking distance of Wint's address as shown on the Charging Document. Other than the address on the charging document Wint had no other known fixed address. His most recent published home location was Brooklyn, NY as shown on his facebook page. It is possible that he was living at his girlfriend's house. One witness in Brooklyn mentioned that he saw Wint sometime in the past six months. Another witness spotted him before his capture near Glenwood Road and Rockaway Parkway in Brooklyn, NY. There are no published sitings of Wint on the bus to New York.

Wint's girlfriend was located in a Jamaican restaurant in Canarcie, Brooklyn by pinging her cell phone. Wint's girlfriend's house was searched on 05/21. http://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/loca...-Missed-New-York-City-Brooklyn-304688561.html

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/cri...tims-family-grateful-arrest-article-1.2232197

The address in Lanham, MD was searched and police were seen removing documents and one or more white buckets.
http://wtvr.com/2015/05/21/source-pizza-crust-led-d-c-police-to-name-suspect-in-quadruple-homicide/

al66pine · Jul 13, 2015

Bootsctr said:
Not holding my breath either! LE has nothing to compel him to talk. What are they going to use as leverage for Wint to talk? Tell him they are sending him back to Guyana if he doesn't talk. He's not a criminal mastermind, but I do think he knows it is in his best interest to stick with his story of not liking pizza and somebody framed him. Do I think that will fly in a courtroom? No, but the punishment will be the same. Clearly LE says he murdered Mr. Savopoulous in the SW. There's just no wiggle room at this point regarding LE getting Wint to talk.

bbm

Agreeing - likely LE has little leverage to make DDW talk.

If his best bet for avoiding the slam is the DLP Defense - Doesn't Like Pizza Defense, this is gonna be some trial.
(Turning the Twinkie Defense on its head?)

Paulas88 · Jul 13, 2015

mk4osu said:
Great questions! I'm also curious as to why he still had the white bucket. He had several hours to hide the money (and any other possessions) and dispose of the security tape. Did he take the bucket to the S house, or get the bucket, from a friend or relative's house, after the fact? LE were photographed leaving his dad's house, carrying similar white buckets, during search. The bucket is odd, in that if he brought it to transport goods from the crime scene, why a bucket? A large backpack, duffle bag, or something similar, would be much less conspicuous (easier to transport, as well). Also, if he had accomplices, how did they flee from the scene of the crime? If he had accomplices, why wouldn't they have stolen one of the other vehicles? IMO, a white RR would not have been so noticeable. They are everywhere, especially in a prominent neighborhood. They could have moved those vehicles out of there, during the night...and taken to a chop shop, long before anyone had reported them. Sadly, the security tape is probably sitting in a landfill, at this point.

what is the point of the bucket? he had 3 hours to stash whatever, I was thinking some type of accelerant, but wouldn't he just leave that to burn too? Maybe he took
pieces of the car to sell?

RTC · Jul 13, 2015

Paulas88 said:
what is the point of the bucket? he had 3 hours to stash whatever, I was thinking some type of accelerant, but wouldn't he just leave that to burn too? Maybe he took
pieces of the car to sell?

He probably took the loot to a safe place, then parked the car in church parking lot and used the bucket full of gasoline to torch the car. Maybe the car ignited so quickly he couldn't put the bucket inside the car so he had to take it with him.

facundo · Jul 13, 2015

Paulas88 said:
what is the point of the bucket? he had 3 hours to stash whatever, I was thinking some type of accelerant, but wouldn't he just leave that to burn too? Maybe he took
pieces of the car to sell?

IMO The bucket had a few items of value that he stole from the house. It was probably more than he could stuff in his pockets. If he had followed the lead of a typical thief he would have grabbed a pillow case from a bed. He took the bucket thinking it wouldn't attract attention.

TexMex · Jul 13, 2015

mk4osu said:
Great questions! I'm also curious as to why he still had the white bucket. He had several hours to hide the money (and any other possessions) and dispose of the security tape. Did he take the bucket to the S house, or get the bucket, from a friend or relative's house, after the fact? LE were photographed leaving his dad's house, carrying similar white buckets, during search. The bucket is odd, in that if he brought it to transport goods from the crime scene, why a bucket? A large backpack, duffle bag, or something similar, would be much less conspicuous (easier to transport, as well). Also, if he had accomplices, how did they flee from the scene of the crime? If he had accomplices, why wouldn't they have stolen one of the other vehicles? IMO, a white RR would not have been so noticeable. They are everywhere, especially in a prominent neighborhood. They could have moved those vehicles out of there, during the night...and taken to a chop shop, long before anyone had reported them. Sadly, the security tape is probably sitting in a landfill, at this point.

IIRC white buckets were seen being removed from Wints fathers home while the search warrant was being executed

rkf · Jul 13, 2015

mk4osu said:
Great questions! I'm also curious as to why he still had the white bucket. He had several hours to hide the money (and any other possessions) and dispose of the security tape. Did he take the bucket to the S house, or get the bucket, from a friend or relative's house, after the fact? LE were photographed leaving his dad's house, carrying similar white buckets, during search. The bucket is odd, in that if he brought it to transport goods from the crime scene, why a bucket? A large backpack, duffle bag, or something similar, would be much less conspicuous (easier to transport, as well). Also, if he had accomplices, how did they flee from the scene of the crime? If he had accomplices, why wouldn't they have stolen one of the other vehicles? IMO, a white RR would not have been so noticeable. They are everywhere, especially in a prominent neighborhood. They could have moved those vehicles out of there, during the night...and taken to a chop shop, long before anyone had reported them. Sadly, the security tape is probably sitting in a landfill, at this point.

Those white buckets are also everywhere.

I don't have a valid reason, but I still think the initial plan was one thing (burglary OR torture murder) which turned into something else (overnight hostage situation including robbery, etc.) I keep thinking cars were the draw, but then why weren't any of them taken, except the Porsche? I doubt all the others, including Rovers, were manual transmission, if DW couldn't drive stick...

I don't think DW (et al?) arrived at the S house prepared to do much of anything. I think he found the duct tape, the sword, the baseball bat, the white bucket, etc., etc., at the house - although of all the things mentioned, the duct tape is the least likely IMO. I'm sure the S family was more organized than me, but unless it happened to be lying on the counter when he arrived, he'd have to dig through a closet or tool box to find a roll of duct tape, which would be hard to do if you're alone and trying to hold three people hostage until you can tie them up.

Maybe he brought the green vest, but if that was used to reduce suspicion, so someone would open the front door, the person wearing it could not also be wearing a mask. (I think the boot print on the door was not from entry. Again, no valid reason to think that, except LE completely missed the broken glass and possibly broken lock when they initially canvassed the house. If DW came in through the broken door, wouldn't that have been obvious? The boot print may not have shown up until they dusted for prints. No way to know when it was left.) Maybe someone else brought the vest later, or maybe it was in the garage - there seem to be differing opinions on whether green vests were found in the garage and if they had been there before the crime.

Back to knocking on the front door, dressed as a road worker/meter reader/whatever... If DW expected the house to be empty, when VF (AS or PS) opened the door, why didn't he make an excuse and take off? At that point he knows there's at least one person there. Did he think a house keeper was easy to control and wouldn't disrupt his original plan? Was it finding a child and then his mother that upped the ante?

There's one thing, mentioned by others, that makes me think maybe this was more than just a botched burglary/car theft. How did DW know how to avoid the security cameras and how did he know where to find the DVR and disable it? Could he have asked VF/AS about it first thing? Would it take an insider to tell him how to avoid being picked up on the cameras until he could take the security system out? Was it turned off before he arrived by an insider or because it was usually not on during the day?

If LE found a green vest in the burning Porsche, (I saw LE showing it to workers on a news video), if it was in the car, wouldn't the DVR be recoverable also - at least enough to know it was there, even if they couldn't read the data? (Am I assuming the green vest in LE's photo was found in the burning Porsche?) Perhaps the green vest in the photo was only similar to the one seen by W3 or it was found in the garage. IDK

Just want to take a second to share how much I appreciate comparing theories, "facts" and possibilities with all of you. I try to put aside the horror of the crime and "work" it as a giant puzzle. You guys come up with ideas I would never think of, and help me see angles I missed on my own.

BellaVita · Jul 13, 2015

rkf said:
Maybe someone else brought the vest later, or maybe it was in the garage - there seem to be differing opinions on whether green vests were found in the garage and if they had been there before the crime.

http://www.wjla.com/articles/2015/0...-to-d-c-after-visiting-girlfriend-114233.html

Several other green vests were found in the Savopoulos garage.

rkf · Jul 13, 2015

Peliman said:
Good info facundo, thanks for the update. I'm still on it, I just need to tighten it up a bit. Doing some free range thinking this morning.

I agree, someone had to drive him somewhere at some point. They may have been unaware of what he had just done - pretty cool cucumber if he can just hang out on his dad's porch a day later enjoying the breeze. I'd think he'd smell like gasoline, though, if he poured it on the victims, the house and then the car, after driving around with it inside the Porsche. When we have a plugged can of gas in our garage, it makes the whole place reek! I think it's also likely someone who knew him/could identify him saw him driving Porsche between the house fire and the car fire.

rkf · Jul 13, 2015

al66pine said:
bbm

Agreeing - likely LE has little leverage to make DDW talk.

If his best bet for avoiding the slam is the DLP Defense - Doesn't Like Pizza Defense, this is gonna be some trial.
(Turning the Twinkie Defense on its head?)

The only defense I can see is that they'll say the DNA was contaminated/mixed up, etc. Whether he likes pizza or not, his DNA was found on the crust. Maybe he was just nibbling on someone else's crust once they'd eaten the tomato/cheese part. The testing was done in a federal lab, not the DC lab, where a mix up would have been more probable. I believe the DC lab has been sanctioned for errors recently.

Also, victim's blood on his shoes. What could he argue there? Transfer? Guess it depends on the pattern - splatter, smear, drop or whatever. I don't think dried blood transfers, so I think he would have to be at the scene. I'll bet there's loads of additional forensic evidence. I think this guy is toast.

rkf · Jul 13, 2015

BellaVita said:
http://www.wjla.com/articles/2015/0...-to-d-c-after-visiting-girlfriend-114233.html

Several other green vests were found in the Savopoulos garage.

Well, that answers that question! Thanks!

rkf · Jul 13, 2015

DC - Savvas Savopoulos, family & Veralicia Figueroa murdered; Daron Wint Arrested #17

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