GUILTY Denmark - Kim Wall, 30, Copenhagen, 10 Aug 2017

[Shiressleuth]

http://healthybuildingscience.com/2013/02/22/carbon-monoxide-facts/

You're right. When I Googled I read the "myth" not the "fact".

Aaaw! painful ... it is CO of course and not CO2. How did that happen?


BTW CO is slightly lighter than air:



Don't know how that would work out in a submarine though.

 

[Shiressleuth]

It is pimpossible to test, because the engines are destroyed. They cannot re-create the state of the old engines, so a test will be useless.

I think, given his multiple changes of stories, paired with the likely conclusion of forensics re cause of death, this will not have much, if any, impact on a coming verdict.

PM and lawyer are just grasping at straws.

How are the engines destroyed? By being waterlogged only or were they operating when it sank?

Just playing devil's advocate.

 

[Shiressleuth]

Going back and reading the BT article he is discussing 3 scenarios regarding positioning of two valves, a hull valve and a drain valve. And an engineer agreed with the scenarios but the test cannot be done because of the engine damage due to the sub being on the bottom of the ocean. However, hopefully the engineer can testify how the valves were positioned when the sub was recovered. E.g. if both valves were open wouldn't that mean he sabotaged and sunk it?

 

[Logical_Inference]

Peter Madsens friend and co-builder of the submarine does not believe the carbon monoxide story.

Maybe this article can clear up some things about it.
https://translate.google.com/transl...ger-jeg-tror-ikke-paa-den-her-kuliltehistorie

 

[Shiressleuth]

Peter Madsens friend and co-builder of the submarine does not believe the carbon monoxide story.

Maybe this article can clear up some things about it.
https://translate.google.com/transl...ger-jeg-tror-ikke-paa-den-her-kuliltehistorie

"When he got out of bed he found her lifeless" ???

 

[Moll]

"When he got out of bed he found her lifeless" ???

I have a feeling that's really 'when he got the hatch up', but await expert Danish advice.

 

[Logical_Inference]

"When he got out of bed he found her lifeless" ???

Correct translation:

Then he said that the submarine's engines filled the submarine with gases. When he got the hatch open, he was met by a cloud of hot air and found Kim Wall lifeless.

I hate Google....

 

[Logical_Inference]

Going back and reading the BT article he is discussing 3 scenarios regarding positioning of two valves, a hull valve and a drain valve. And an engineer agreed with the scenarios but the test cannot be done because of the engine damage due to the sub being on the bottom of the ocean. However, hopefully the engineer can testify how the valves were positioned when the sub was recovered. E.g. if both valves were open wouldn't that mean he sabotaged and sunk it?

They are not going to do any tests because the forensics said it wasnt needed,. It was not likely that whats killed her.
From the last linked article:

At Thursday's hearing, it also emerged that Peter Madsen's explanation of carbon monoxide poisoning has been submitted to forensics who do not immediately find it likely to be the course.

 

[Shiressleuth]

Correct translation:


I hate Google....

I think instead of him being met with hot air , he is giving us hot air.

:shakehead:

Thanks for correcting the translation.

 

[Logical_Inference]

Must witness in court: She may become Peter Madsen's worst nightmare

In court, the murderer, inventor Peter Madsen, brags with his knowledge of submarines. When prosecutor Jakob Buch-Jepsen asks questions about how a 10-August evening trip developed fiercely for the Swedish journalist Kim Wall, the submarine builder answer back with complex technical explanations. But soon Peter Madsen will be facing a Danish expert who knows at least as much about submarines as he himself does.

The tanned Navy veteran from The Navy, Ditte Dyreborg, has written a report that casts doubt on Peter Madsen's explanations of Kim Wall's death. Soon she will testify with her expertise in court.

I have translated the important part of the article. There is also something about the witness's career and life, and that she is a hermaphrodite, which I find absolutely, so much not important to the case....but its apparently news-worthy.

 

[Moll]

Thank you very much, L_I. Armed with that name I found this article with trial timetable:
http://cphpost.dk/news/peter-madsen-trial-back-on-tomorrow.html

as well as the one you've quoted from
https://www.bt.dk/krimi/skal-vidne-i-retten-hun-kan-blive-peter-madsens-vaerste-mareridt
See what you mean about the personal stuff - inevitable I suppose given her earlier career.

 

[SATA]

Thank you very much, L_I. Armed with that name I found this article with trial timetable:
http://cphpost.dk/news/peter-madsen-trial-back-on-tomorrow.html

as well as the one you've quoted from
https://www.bt.dk/krimi/skal-vidne-i-retten-hun-kan-blive-peter-madsens-vaerste-mareridt
See what you mean about the personal stuff - inevitable I suppose given her earlier career.

I think it is irrelevant.
Who knows if it is actually her that wants it known.

 

[Moll]

Yes, of course it's irrelevant - I just mean it's inevitable the media will look at her career as a man and mention it.

 

[Logical_Inference]

I think it is irrelevant.
Who knows if it is actually her that wants it known.

Apparently she did an interview in BT herself about it in may last year, so they have the story from her own mouth.
Then we should suppose that she doesnt mind that we are told about it again.
Search on google on her name if you want to see the article.

I dont like that they bring it up again just because she are going to be a witness, but now it will stick to her every time she does anything.

 

[SATA]

Apparently she did an interview in BT herself about it in may last year, so they have the story from her own mouth.
Then we should suppose that she doesnt mind that we are told about it again.
Search on google on her name if you want to see the article.

I dont like that they bring it up again just because she are going to be a witness, but now it will stick to her every time she does anything.

That´s tabloids for you!
It won´t affect her testimony though, she is an expert in her field.
In this case, maybe, just maybe, PM´s choice to go without a jury will harm him.

 

[ZaZara]

Yes, of course it's irrelevant - I just mean it's inevitable the media will look at her career as a man and mention it.

I think it is bloody relevant.

Two experts on submarines.
Life put obstacles in their way, they dealt with them so differently, and each radically decided to go their own way.

In the first 40 years of her life Ditte Dyreborg lived as a man named Cliff Dyreborg. In interviews with different media she has stated that, as a child, she was born with both a boy's and a girl's genital organs. Her parents made a quick decision and allowed her to switch to a boy without telling her about the operation or what had been removed. After years of identity crisis, she chose to go through an operation in Thailand to become a woman. In interviews she has described herself as "two-sex" and "hermaphrodite".

Ditte Dyreborg is considered one of the country's leading technical experts in submarine boats, and therefore she has been summoned as a witness in the trial against Peter Madsen.

How beautiful that she is going to destroy him on the one subject he knows best - and more. She will remind him simply by whom she is, that everyone has a choice to face their demons. Instead PM ran away to hedonism, sadism and horrible murder.

If there had been a jury, they sure would have noticed this.

 

[SATA]

I think it is bloody relevant.

Two experts on submarines.
Life put obstacles in their way, they dealt with them so differently, and each radically decided to go their own way.



How beautiful that she is going to destroy him on the one subject he knows best - and more. She will remind him simply by whom she is, that everyone has a choice to face their demons. Instead PM ran away to hedonism, sadism and horrible murder.

If there had been a jury, they sure would have noticed this.

To me that is the only similarity.

 

[Logical_Inference]

The court of law rejects Madsen's wish

Apparently the defense-lawyer did appeal the decision about not testing the submarine to a highercourt and they have now ruled that they support the decision about not testing.

The Østre Landsret, like the district court, does not consider further investigations of the submarine Nautilus to test Peter Madsen's scenarios for what led to Kim Wall's death

https://translate.google.com/transl...k/112/landsret-afviser-madsens-oenske/7086380

 

[Moll]

I still think it's far better there's no jury, as they might - just possibly - have been manipulated in some way by Madsen. I am sure the prosecutor will remind him, and everyone else, who sank the sub and made it impossible to do meaningful replications of his hypothetical scenarios

 

[SATA]

The court of law rejects Madsen's wish

Apparently the defense-lawyer did appeal the decision about not testing the submarine to a highercourt and they have now ruled that they support the decision about not testing.



https://translate.google.com/transl...k/112/landsret-afviser-madsens-oenske/7086380

OMG, they never give up, even when what they are asking for makes no sense.

What a client to have for Betina Hald. She has been through some roller coaster rides with that madman.

I think he imagines he is controlling her - and likes making her go out there with ridiculous statements and requests.

As a woman, I think I would quit defending him for that reason alone.