Deputies: Grandmother killed by dog while babysitting

[LaborDayRN]

Number one.

Children should never be left alone with a dog capable of killing them. I've witnessed many children suffer dog bites and nips. Every single time the child was doing something wrong. Every single time.


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I totally agree with you that children should NEVER be left alone with a dog capable of killing them. I do however, strongly disagree with you on the dog bite issue being always the childs fault. A very close family friend of mine had a daughter and son in law bring home their newborn baby. The young mother was in her backyard a week later getting fresh air. Her two dogs (who she insists had never been aggressive in any way) were outside with her. Baby was in a stroller sleeping. Mom went inside to answer the phone and was back in minutes. The newborn had been killed by her two "gentle dogs". Now granted, the mother should NOT have left this helpless baby unattended, but the baby CLEARLY did nothing to provoke the attack. Making sweeping generalizations like every time a child is bitten the child was doing something wrong is simply inaccurate. IMO

 

[Linda7NJ]

I totally agree with you that children should NEVER be left alone with a dog capable of killing them. I do however, strongly disagree with you on the dog bite issue being always the childs fault. A very close family friend of mine had a daughter and son in law bring home their newborn baby. The young mother was in her backyard a week later getting fresh air. Her two dogs (who she insists had never been aggressive in any way) were outside with her. Baby was in a stroller sleeping. Mom went inside to answer the phone and was back in minutes. The newborn had been killed by her two "gentle dogs". Now granted, the mother should NOT have left this helpless baby unattended, but the baby CLEARLY did nothing to provoke the attack. Making sweeping generalizations like every time a child is bitten the child was doing something wrong is simply inaccurate. IMO

I was speaking of my personal experiences.

 

[Cracka*Jaxx]

Anyone that has done rescue for any length of time (and worse dealt with potential adopters) knows that 98% of canine "problems" are the result of stupid/ignorant owners that don't know enough about dogs OR get breeds they have no idea how to handle.

The ignorance and stupidity displayed by many dog owners makes me always lean towards "human error" whenever I read about "crazy dog suddenly attacks without warning" stories. It is ALWAYS the dogs fault, right? Never the humans.

Agreed, and dogs shouldn't be around toddlers if they have zero experiences being around young children.

I've seen more than my fair share of toddlers abuse dogs. The owners will say...oh she a great dog, the brat can pull her tail, ears, lay all over the dog and the dog just lays there. I want to slap the crap out of the owner. Typically they're the ones that claim, the dog was never aggressive before....it was unprovoked ...blah blah....

Years ago while on vacation, I left my cockapoo with my animal loving sister and her family for a week. The dog was gentle enough, so I was shocked to receive a call from her saying that he had bitten her young (6 yr old?) child.

The full story only came out after I got home and pressed my sister for details. It turned out that the dog was lying in the yard, minding it's own business, when my nephew fell on top of him while playing with a football. Startled, the dog swung around and bit in a quick reaction.

As usual, people are quick to blame others (here, an innocent, sleeping animal) for their own mistakes. Her husband forced the boy to hit the dog with a stick because it had been 'bad'! My sister was responsible for keeping both her child and my dog safe. She failed at both and then blamed my dog for her mistake. Sadly, I learned that you can't even trust your own family when it comes to taking 'care' of your animal or giving you the story in it's entirety.

 

[Cracka*Jaxx]

I think these arguments (not just yours, Sprite) miss the point that maybe dogs shouldn't be around people if the animals are so sensitive to triggers known only to them.

I realize cats are different, but I had a Siamese who only attacked "when provoked". But "provoked" in her mind might mean laughing, curling one's toes or rolling a pair of dice.

I foster cats- some feral- and was bitten by one four times in a matter of 30 seconds. Was the cat provoked, vicious or just crazy? Well, it turned out to be my own fault.

I had lifted the cat to move her from the cage into a carrier. When my 3 dogs ran in from the yard I didn't think much about it because they were cat friendly. But the cat didn't know that the dogs wouldn't hurt her, so she squirmed to get loose from my grip. The dogs started barking at the squirming cat, which escalated the tension. The cat was semi-feral and I knew that if I let go she would hide somewhere and it could take me hours to get her back into the cage. So, I chose not to let go.

I guess my body went into shock because the bites never actually hurt. I just remember the sensation of her crunching down on my arm. She would bite and then squirm, clearly trying to give me a message. But since the bites didn't hurt, I still kept holding on and trying to get her into the carrier. I finally had to make a conscious decision to release the cat.

When things calmed down a few hours later, I had no particular fear of the cat. She wasn't crazy and didn't just 'snap'. She had sent me a message which I refused to acknowledge. It was my own fault.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

We had a chow that lived to be 13 years old, the sweetest dog I've ever known, loyal, affectionate, cuddly, and smart as any dog I've ever known. It broke our hearts when he died recently.

That said, IMO, it is criminally neglectful and abusive, not to mention just flat out stupid, for dog owners to blatantly ignore the fact that dogs, PARTICULARLY certain breeds, can and do attack. Chows are among them.

All the arguments over whether the dog had "ever been aggressive before" or not mean NOTHING. It is KNOWN that some breeds are more predisposed to seemingly unprovoked attacks. My chow never bit, ever, and yet I never once left him unattended in a child's presence because I knew he was more "likely" to than, say, a golden retriever.

This knowledge is understood and verified enough for many municipalities in the US and some entire countries to either ban these breeds altogether or to require registration and certain restraints. They don't do this because they "just don't understand the dogs", they do this because some dog OWNERS just don't understand the FACTS or choose to blatantly ignore them.

Any time I hear anyone say "dog was never aggressive before", it just burns me and saddens me for the poor victims. Even human murderers never murdered before, right up until they do. EVERY dog of certain breeds is capable of unexpected attack, history or not. Whether that was provoked "in the eyes of the dog" or not is immaterial. It can and does happen.

It's sad that laws must be instituted to protect the common good because people are not willing to do that simply as a matter of internal ethic.

Well IMO bumping into a sleeping dog should not be a fatal mistake.

My point was, SOME dogs do just snap.
People here want to say they don't. But they do.

And some breeds are more likely to snap than others.

Pits do.

So, my original comment and opinion of my surprise that people here are assuming this grandmother was doing something wrong or harming the children is horribly wrong to me.

 

[jjenny]

There is a story on the same website that OP article is about 3 pitbulls attacking and mauling a woman.

 

[Confusion]

I hope the children who were in the room when the attack started will be able to shed some light on what happened. Pit bulls (if that's actually what the dog is) already have a bad rep, and I'd hate to see it get even worse if it isn't deserved.

I obviously don't know what happened, but I have guesses. I think that the dog may have been sleeping or in a different room, and one of the smaller kids fell or got hurt in some other way. Grandma went to pick up the crying child, and the dog wakes up or enters the room to see the woman holding one of "his/her" people who is screaming in pain.

 

[tlcya]

you are right confusion, we just do not have enough info to know what caused this horrible thing to happen. All we can really do is pray for those who've lost a loved one and that the children weren't traumatized irreparably by what they may have seen/experienced.

My thoughts will be with this family.

 

[Elley Mae]

I hope the children who were in the room when the attack started will be able to shed some light on what happened. Pit bulls (if that's actually what the dog is) already have a bad rep, and I'd hate to see it get even worse if it isn't deserved.

I obviously don't know what happened, but I have guesses. I think that the dog may have been sleeping or in a different room, and one of the smaller kids fell or got hurt in some other way. Grandma went to pick up the crying child, and the dog wakes up or enters the room to see the woman holding one of "his/her" people who is screaming in pain.

http://gwdtoday.com/main.asp?SectionID=2&SubSectionID=27&ArticleID=23375


Officials say that Betty Ann Chapman Todd was watching her grandchildren at her son’s home in Hodges while her son and his wife went to dinner when the pit bull attacked her.

 

[wishuwerehere]

He’s my first large dog. It took time for the two of us to become trained. Yes, I had to learn too. I had to learn to become his pack leader. He’s very bullish, so it took time. I didn’t give up. I think it’s easy for some pet owners to become lazy and not admonish their dog when they do something wrong and then the dog begins to believe this is acceptable behavior (whatever that may be). My dog, my responsibility. I would never leave him alone with someone who is not able to handle him.

The training and learning between the two of us is continuous. There is no finish line.

 

[LinasK]

Well IMO bumping into a sleeping dog should not be a fatal mistake.

My point was, SOME dogs do just snap.
People here want to say they don't. But they do.

And some breeds are more likely to snap than others.

Pits do.

So, my original comment and opinion of my surprise that people here are assuming this grandmother was doing something wrong or harming the children is horribly wrong to me.

Wow! Have pigs flown??? Something we finally agree on!

 

[LinasK]

He’s my first large dog. It took time for the two of us to become trained. Yes, I had to learn too. I had to learn to become his pack leader. He’s very bullish, so it took time. I didn’t give up. I think it’s easy for some pet owners to become lazy and not admonish their dog when they do something wrong and then the dog begins to believe this is acceptable behavior (whatever that may be). My dog, my responsibility. I would never leave him alone with someone who is not able to handle him.

The training and learning between the two of us is continuous. There is no finish line.

I have a huge Lab, she's tall, long-legged 85 lbs. and has a large barrel-chest. She's downright scary when she dashs at full-speed and is barking aggressively. We knew when we got her that she would be big, so not only is she spayed, but she had puppy-training from the time we got her, including my toddler daughter at the time. The dog had to learn to respect my toddler!
My lab can be the biggest baby and lap puppy despite her size, but I'll never tell the door-door salesman that!!!

 

[wishuwerehere]

I have a huge Lab, she's tall, long-legged 85 lbs. and has a large barrel-chest. She's downright scary when she dashs at full-speed and is barking aggressively. We knew when we got her that she would be big, so not only is she spayed, but she had puppy-training from the time we got her, including my toddler daughter at the time. The dog had to learn to respect my toddler!
My lab can be the biggest baby and lap puppy despite her size, but I'll never tell the door-door salesman that!!!

I don't have any children, but I do have five cats. My dog has accepted all of them because they are a part of MY pack. However, the cats did take a little longer to accept him, lol.

 

[Linda7NJ]

I have a huge Lab, she's tall, long-legged 85 lbs. and has a large barrel-chest. She's downright scary when she dashs at full-speed and is barking aggressively. We knew when we got her that she would be big, so not only is she spayed, but she had puppy-training from the time we got her, including my toddler daughter at the time. The dog had to learn to respect my toddler!
My lab can be the biggest baby and lap puppy despite her size, but I'll never tell the door-door salesman that!!!

I hope you also put as much training in your toddler about how to respect and treat animals kindly.


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[Sonya610]

My friend who breeds, owns, trains, and shows Akitas in the showring told me about the time that her veteran ***** was not liking a judge, for no reason known to humans. She had a hard time with her that day. The ***** was getting real snippy and growling. My friend is very experienced and even she felt uncomfortable.

She preferred to make sure I was well behind her when going around the showdog ring and not to get as close as what we all consider normal spacing. Her Akitas could get aggressive.....and those were her own words.

I believed her.

I would not consider that dog to be "mentally snapping" unless the dog was an elderly veteran that may have been getting a bit senile, the dog for whatever reason really did not like that judge and was showing signs of agitation, of a pending conflict. She knew her dogs and knew when they were getting irritated, her dogs had aggressive temperaments but that does NOT make them "insane" it means they can be aggressive. They give of clear signs that say "I am getting irritated and about ready to kick that person/dogs butt because I don't like them and/or don't want them in my presence". If someone clueless bought one of her dogs and had that happen then the dog would be "INSANE" because the person couldn't see the dog was getting irritated and getting ready to kick some butt.

Now if the dog LOVED someone dearly for years and then suddenly bit their face off while the person was sitting quietly that would signal potential mental problems aka "insane" dog behavior.

 

[Sonya610]

I hope you also put as much training in your toddler about how to respect and treat animals kindly.

I totally agree! If "respecting the toddler" really means tolerating anything the toddler does without complaining for fear of punishment that can be a very bad thing. The dog could tolerate and tolerate until one day the dog's boundaries are pushed so far they speak up (i.e. growl/snap) and then suddenly "the dog just snapped and went crazy, the dog always loved the baby before but then just snapped! The dog just went insane!"

Tolerance/fear of punishment and avoidance is NOT the same as respect or love. Two way boundaries are required, respect is mutual and not one sided especially with "human babies". If the dog avoids the baby, backs off when the baby comes around or stays frozen when the baby crawls all over them that is not respect that is avoidance. The lack of understanding is what causes so many kids to get bitten in the face.

 

[Herding Cats]

I have one full grown Newfoundland. I have one 7 year old beagle. And I have a 4.5 month old St. Bernard. Both Newfs and Saints were bred to work with people, to help or find people; but I don't have an instant of doubt that should someone come into my home, my newf would make sure they left.

Of all of my dogs, I'd say the beagle is most likely to be "aggressive". He has been through the ringer in terms of his background, and I don't know what he'd be capable of if he felt trapped or severely threatened. He's the sort who'd snap at someone; the Saint may lick you to death, and the Newf may try to rescue you (she doesn't always say from what, though), but my beagle has been severely emotionally scarred...

That being said, I am pack leader. End of story. They are all socialized on a regular, on-going basis. They are all worked in basic commands daily. The proof of it came early this week when I was in a physical confrontation, and my Newf was collared, and then stood down, on a verbal from me and someone just standing with her, holding her collar.

Still, dogs are dogs, and dogs will bite. The old phrase "let a sleeping dog lie" is true for a few reasons.

I pity the idiot who thinks they're going to attack me in my own home...Grace will take care of things in a moment that way.

Dogs are dogs, as I said. They think differently; feel differently; and they are not the same as we are. I often say that dogs are smarter than humans, inasmuch as they are bi-lingual: they speak "dog" AND "human", and it's up to us as residents wherever there are dogs (e.g. everywhere) to know some basics about their language, and to listen to what they say, even when they don't use their voices to say it.

As for this situation, I grieve for the loss of both the Grandmother and the dog...and find it sad that yet again, a "pit" is in the middle of a death. Makes me super sad...

Just my (rather disjointed) thoughts...

Best-
Herding Cats

 

[formerjerseygirl]

http://www.postandcourier.com/article/20130111/PC16/130119828 Here is another South Carolina story. Bad dogs or bad owners?

 

[jjenny]

http://www.postandcourier.com/article/20130111/PC16/130119828 Here is another South Carolina story. Bad dogs or bad owners?

I wonder how many times CPS is going to be re-uniting these people with their surviving children? First their infant was mauled to death, now a second child was bitten?

 

[Elley Mae]

http://www.postandcourier.com/article/20130111/PC16/130119828 Here is another South Carolina story. Bad dogs or bad owners?

from your link,

The two children returned to their Ridgeville rental home in June. But two months later, they again were removed after the 7-year-old girl told counselors that she saw her parents engaging in a sexual threesome and watching homemade pornographic films.

They sound like a lovely couple.