Discussion Thread #60 - 14.9.12 ~ the appeal~

[JudgeJudi]

Mandy Wiener @MandyWiener · 1m 1 minute ago
#OscarPistorius Theoretically, there could be a situation that Oscar is out on correctional supervision while the appeal is being heard.

 

[mrjitty]

Minimum for DE is 15 years as I understand it

Yes

if he is convicted of murder a new sentence will be imposed.

if the state loses the appeal - his sentence on CH cannot be changed.

Of course the state can still apply direct to to the SC for leave to appeal sentence & ammo

 

[zwiebel]

Bernard Bergstedt ‏@OnPoint_B 59 secs59 seconds ago

#OscarPistorius A summary - The NPA can appeal Oscar's conviction but it cannot appeal his sentence. It can petition the SCA on sentence.

Is this correct anybody? Whats the SCA?

 

[mrjitty]

Why would she throw out the sentence appeal, if, as Mr Fossil says (and I would also have expected), if he's found guilty of murder he'll get minimum 15years anyhow? Does her decision achieve anything? Have any value?

Yes.

If the state loses the SC appeal on the murder conviction, it had a second bite at extending the sentence for CH

Currently now they have everything riding on the murder appeal.

 

[Giles]

This will make Oscar uncomfortable. There is a chance that the Appeals Court could change his conviction to dolus eventualis or even dolus directus now.

Am I understanding this correctly?

If the Appeals Court finds that Masipa's handling of circumstantial evidence was not legally correct, or if they find that the plethora of defenses were mutually destructive, and discard his testimony then can they overturn the conviction to dolus directus?

 

[zwiebel]

Yes

if he is convicted of murder a new sentence will be imposed.

if the state loses the appeal - his sentence on CH cannot be changed.

Of course the state can still apply direct to to the SC for leave to appeal sentence & ammo

Just saw you answered my question here - and without the A I realised straight away it's the Supreme Court, Lol!

 

[soozieqtips]

That not guilty verdict on illegal possession of ammo verdict is just surreal. I can't comprehend why that appeal wasn't granted. What if it had been cocaine?

BIB - I agree. The ammo was in his own safe in his own home, and that's not intent to possess? What more proof could there be, for God's sake!

 

[mrjitty]

Bernard Bergstedt ‏@OnPoint_B 59 secs59 seconds ago

#OscarPistorius A summary - The NPA can appeal Oscar's conviction but it cannot appeal his sentence. It can petition the SCA on sentence.

Is this correct anybody? Whats the SCA?

State can contest Masipa's ruling on leave to appeal sentence by application direct to the Supreme Court

That would not be a full hearing. Like this proceeding, on the papers, the SC can itself decide if it wants to look at the sentence.

 

[lisasalinger]

Minimum for DE is 15 years as I understand it

It seems odd that they would even need to apply for leave to appeal on sentence if the sentence is automatically reviewed anyway in the event of an appeals court finding him guilty of Murder. I'm puzzled on that one.

 

[soozieqtips]

Daniel Williams ‏@Danielclearcut 5 mins5 minutes ago

#OscarPistorius father Henk just told me that #oscar is doing ok in prison. "He is strong he has got to be strong. He grew up like that."

Haha. Just the opposite of what Roux said about how he'd never be able to cope in prison!

 

[jay-jay]

Yes

if he is convicted of murder a new sentence will be imposed.

if the state loses the appeal - his sentence on CH cannot be changed.

Of course the state can still apply direct to to the SC for leave to appeal sentence & ammo

Thanks for clarifying, Mr J :thumb:

 

[soozieqtips]

It seems odd that they would even need to apply for leave to appeal on sentence if the sentence is automatically reviewed anyway in the event of an appeals court finding him guilty of Murder. I'm puzzled on that one.

BIB - I wonder if Masipa has confused herself (again) with that one!

 

[lisasalinger]

Yes

if he is convicted of murder a new sentence will be imposed.

if the state loses the appeal - his sentence on CH cannot be changed.

Of course the state can still apply direct to to the SC for leave to appeal sentence & ammo

Ok... now I get it. Thank you for the clarification on that!

 

[Mr Fossil]

State can contest Masipa's ruling on leave to appeal sentence by application direct to the Supreme Court

That would not be a full hearing. Like this proceeding, on the papers, the SC can itself decide if it wants to look at the sentence.

Is the same true for Count 4?

 

[zwiebel]

eNCA ‏@eNCAnews 1m1 minute ago

#OscarPistorius The NPA says it welcomes the decision by Judge Masipa to grant them leave to appeal. Via @phakxx

 

[mrjitty]

BIB - I agree. The ammo was in his own safe in his own home, and that's not intent to possess? What more proof could there be, for God's sake!

I agree.

That decision was clearly incorrect.

In such cases, intention relates only to positive knowledge of possession. As a question of fact - he was clearly in control, knowingly, of the ammo.

Masipa wrongly looked at cases where the accused takes no action to posses (e.g. someone puts a gun down next to you) or the accused does not intend to possess. e.g. you find a bag of cocaine at your front door and telephone the police to come get it.

Otherwise as you say, you could hold drugs or guns for someone else - but have no intention to possess?

Absurd.

 

[Mr Fossil]

Mandy Wiener ‏@MandyWiener 4m4 minutes ago
#OscarPistorius NPA says it must still think about whether or not it will petition SCA on sentence.

 

[Mr Fossil]

Karyn Maughan ‏@karynmaughan 2m2 minutes ago
Mncube says state will ask that #OscarAppeal be heard as soon as possible. On normal timelines, would be heard in at least a year @eNCAnews

 

[zwiebel]

eNCA @eNCAnews · 3 mins 3 minutes ago

#OscarPistorius - NPA spokesman Nathi Mncube: this isn't about winning. It's about justice. Via @karynmaughan

 

[Mr Fossil]

Karyn Maughan ‏@karynmaughan 4m4 minutes ago
Mncube says state will argue for 15 year sentence for #OscarPistorius - if Appeal Court finds him guilty of murder @eNCAnews

"Argue for"? Not automatic?