Does Anybody Believe George Sexually Abused Casey? POLL ADDED

[GracieLu]

i believe ICA is a sociopath (someone with an abnormal lack of empathy combined w/abnormal immoral conduct despite their ability to appear normal).

and while we are on the subject, since the "cat has been let out of the bag, i.e. GA molested her for years" and after her not so convincing meltdown (at least to me) during openning statements when JB said she was molested, wasn't that "freeing" for her? Isn't she able to act normal now without pretending everything is perfect? And if thats the case, why no tears when Caylee is mentioned? She cries for herself. I've been seeing that a lot lately but I've yet to see any tears for Caylee...

She is a sociopath and everything that comes out of her mouth (from her attorneys) are lies! so, IMO, the answer is NO....

 

[Bobbisangel]

Exactly. That is what this is supposed to be about, not her parents who were thrown into the spotlight and feasted upon by people picketing and wanting their heads on a stick, but, thats what happened.

I personally have no idea if he abused her, I think he did abuse her mentally and growing up with him doing the terrible things he did to her mother were probably hell with all the fighting, if anything those two should have divorced decades ago, but thats not the point here. There is SOMETHING going on in that family, most normal caring Dads wait out in the waiting room to rush in and see their new grandchild, not sit and watch her emerge from his daughter. jmo

I really disagree with you about grandpa's in the birthroom. Why should it be only the females who get to see the miracle of birth? My daughter's coach was a male and he was in the birthroom when her baby was born. If the mother to be doesn't mind why should anyone else care? Watching a baby be born is the highest high a person could ever get...it is a miracle beyond miracles and the males can sit by the side of the bed and not the foot of it. Why should they be cheated out of seeing the birth if the mother is alright with it? Times are changing and grandpas and daddys aren't being left out the way they used to be. I have to say that I have witnessed the birth of most of my grandchildren and I have stood at the foot of the bed. Two minutes later I couldn't tell you what my daughter's looked like down there! That is not the focus.

 

[leesap]

Absolutely not! The family dynamic can be explained by having a sociopath in the house for the last 23 years.

 

[darcedarce]

I really disagree with you about grandpa's in the birthroom. Why should it be only the females who get to see the miracle of birth? My daughter's coach was a male and he was in the birthroom when her baby was born. If the mother to be doesn't mind why should anyone else care? Watching a baby be born is the highest high a person could ever get...it is a miracle beyond miracles and the males can sit by the side of the bed and not the foot of it. Why should they be cheated out of seeing the birth if the mother is alright with it? Times are changing and grandpas and daddys aren't being left out the way they used to be. I have to say that I have witnessed the birth of most of my grandchildren and I have stood at the foot of the bed. Two minutes later I couldn't tell you what my daughter's looked like down there! That is not the focus.

I also agree! I have had many people in my delivery room, male and female. It's a personal choice, certainly but I don't see it as sick or disgusting or disturbing as has been suggested throughout this trial.

 

[octobermoon]

I really disagree with you about grandpa's in the birthroom. Why should it be only the females who get to see the miracle of birth? My daughter's coach was a male and he was in the birthroom when her baby was born. If the mother to be doesn't mind why should anyone else care? Watching a baby be born is the highest high a person could ever get...it is a miracle beyond miracles and the males can sit by the side of the bed and not the foot of it. Why should they be cheated out of seeing the birth if the mother is alright with it? Times are changing and grandpas and daddys aren't being left out the way they used to be. I have to say that I have witnessed the birth of most of my grandchildren and I have stood at the foot of the bed. Two minutes later I couldn't tell you what my daughter's looked like down there! That is not the focus.

I could not of cared less who was there with me when I gave birth as long as they didn't get in the way of the Doc. This was in the early 80's and the whole natural child birth fad. No drugs, no epideral (sp?) My mom laughed when I told her the russian army could have strolled in, just don't bother my Doc!

 

[wandering]

Someone had smashed open the lock on Georges shed in his backyard. Then they stole his gas cans. If somebody came into my yard, and broke a lock to get inside somewhere and steal something, I would call and report it also.

I think George had suspicions it was Casey. And I think that was one reason he reported it. She was getting more out of control, with dropping out of sight, keeping the baby away from them. I think he was looking for leverage against her. They were going to fight for custody probably.

And, imo, calling the cops about the gas cans NULLIFIES his being an accomplice in the cover-up. IF he had wrapped duct tape around his dead grandchild and wrapped her in a blanket and dumped her 1/4 a mile away from his yard---NO WAY would he be calling cops to come look in his backyard.


as for the ladder, I have not heard that testimony yet. But IF Caylee had died in that pool on the 16th, and those 2 covered it up and staged a kidnapping, they would NOT have left the ladder down. imoo

If it was down on the 17th, it may have been Casey, trying to do something in the backyard while desperately figuring out what to do with the body. Maybe she considered putting her in the pool and staging an accident the next day? Or she washed her off before bagging her? To cxlear away some evidence?

I don't recall the dogs hitting on the pool.

 

[wandering]

I also agree! I have had many people in my delivery room, male and female. It's a personal choice, certainly but I don't see it as sick or disgusting or disturbing as has been suggested throughout this trial.

ITA. Actually, I know a woman whose brother was an OBGYN, and he was her doctor.

 

[Pink Panther]

Both LA and KC had such blatant disregard for GA that I can't buy into the idea that she was afraid of him as a Survivor. They even posted funny comments about getting him a "real job" for Father's day.

moo

ETA - Seems to me that he garnered disdain more than power or fear.

 

[Emma Peel]

Remember when we weren't even allowed to talk about this subject on WS?

Remember when we used to wonder if JB & company followed WS opinion?

Remember when Leonard Padilla said (on NG!) that we'd be "shocked" when we found out the truth about the father of Caylee? Some WSers were certain he was referring to LA at the time... I know I was wondering when we'd understand where the heck LP's comments came from ... and now we do ...

Well, I'm trying to remember ... but I think LP was getting his info from at the time ... IIRC he was working for JB while protecting Miss Casey.

:waitasec:

Anyway ... pretty sure this "sexually-molested Casey defense" has been the defense plan since early game on...

DNA evidence eliminated family members as Caylee's father ... but the plan never changed.

Interesting that Casey told Tony that GA abused her, and Tony never interpreted it to mean sexual abuse. Even though the "Lee tried to feel me up" was also one of the family secrets...

I think it's weird that Casey told Tony anything, frankly. Do we know when Casey disclosed this? Before or after Caylee disappeared? Was she simply laying a foundation for not being able to go back home and "needing" to be rescued from her family by Tony?

Anyone have any insight as to why she'd share these "secrets"?

I don't have time to write a post for each thread. I'm finding so much of the trial to be repetitive (what we already know) - yet at the same time, there's daily nuggets of "oh yeah - now that makes more sense".

*sigh*

Go Team Caylee! The more you shine the light, the sadder Caylee's story is. Casey is one hell of a mess. And to the point of this thread, one has to wonder ... what the hell happened in her life that fractured her brain and cut out her heart?

Was she just "Born this Way?" (apologies to LGaga)

sheesh.

Capital D ysfunctional Family. 4 sho'.

 

[Emma Peel]

I was also molested by my dad starting at the age of 7 until the age of 12. I told my mother, but she wouldn't do anything about it. My older sister knew but as long as it wasn't happening to her any longer she didn't want to help me and she moved out as soon as she could. I wanted to run away, but had nowhere to go. I was all alone. Thankfully I told someone at my school and that was the end of it. However, I went through years of counseling and from foster home to foster home, until I was old enough to be out on my own. I believe that KC was abused by her father. She could have created an alternate life and actually believe it herself to escape reality.

When I heard George on the stand say that he was in the delivery room it made me sick. I don't know any one who would let their father be there.

First, I want to say that I am so sorry that you experienced that and I really appreciate it when abuse victims chime in about this case and comment on what they think Casey might have gone through to turn her into such a monster.

I'm glad to know you finally got away from your situation.

I also wanted to share that my father-in-law was actually in my delivery room. I'd have rather it been my father, but, ... that's not how it worked out that day.

My GYN is the one that made it all happen. 20 years ago. I think you'll find, it's not uncommon for a grand to be in the delivery room...

Long story (and it is a looooooong story) is that my MIL died at 6 AM as she was fighting to stay alive to meet our baby but ... she succumbed to terminal lung cancer whilst I labored. My DH's entire family was there at her deathbed (except my DH, who was at my labor-bed). The funeral home came and removed her body by noon. And there were 10 family members, devastated, with nothing to do. My SIL says "lets visit the birthing room". And they all come over. And my GYN says to me "your epidural is working great, you should really think about letting your FIL witness the birth. He and his wife had all these children in a time when we did not let the husband in the birthing room. It would be very soothing for him." And I look at her like she has 4 eyes.

"Are you <expletive deleted> nuts?" And she says "We can make it very modest. Trust me. It's the right thing to do." And without waiting for my anser, my GYN asks my FIL (while I'm still in shock) if he'd like to watch. And he says "why yes I would".

Okay, that's still a long story... sorry.

But the end of it is, We strapped cameras on him, and told him to get busy taking pix. My SIL got jealous so we let her in to hold my one leg up. My DH had my other leg. And my FIL tried to take video and pix at the same time. LOLOL. And when our DD was born at 6 PM, 12 hours after my FIL had held my MIL as she passed ... the GYN handed my brand newborn DD directly to my FIL - before me even.

OMG. His face. I have never regretted it. We gave her my MIL's name. After all, their spirits passed by each other that day.

He tells his story to this day. People sob. He loves me like crazy. Life is good.

Anyway, it's not weird that GA was there -unless Casey didn't want him there.



was that TMI? :blushing:

It's not my fault. This case makes me crazy. :crazy:

 

[Emma Peel]

One more thing.

To this day, my uncle calls all his daughters and nieces and sisters and (when she was alive) his own mother "Gorgeous" and "Beautiful".

I have to say it's ridiculous, in this day and age. LOL.

But he's this lovable larger-than-life old Mediterranean throw-back to Frank Sinatra.

Whatcha gonna do 'boudit?

This does not make my dear uncle a dirty old man. It makes him a fine specimen of age-appropriate male chauvinism. Even my liberated college girls giggle about it.

IMO, I have to cut old George a break on the "gorgeous" stuff. Very likely a pet name.
Nothing sinister, IMO.

 

[Hisimage]

I could not of cared less who was there with me when I gave birth as long as they didn't get in the way of the Doc. This was in the early 80's and the whole natural child birth fad. No drugs, no epideral (sp?) My mom laughed when I told her the russian army could have strolled in, just don't bother my Doc!

Thank you... I was beginning to think I was some sort of a "wing nut" because it didn't register to me as creepy. Just because he is in the delivery room does not mean he was watching everything. What if he was behind her or in the corner. There is an awful lot going on in those rooms. Not everyone can be croweded around to see the beautiful baby enter the world.

Oh and by the way, I am beginning to think ICA watched too many Lifetime movies. (I'm not knocking lifetime, I love the network). I think ICA was putting her sad story out there, brother, daddy, mommy is crazy and I must run and take my baby because they are all against me. She was building a story for something, not just for the sake of lying. She thought somehow she could follow through with some sort of accident for the entire family.

She liked looking like she was working hard so hard she could afford a nanny, NOT a babysitter. Many here were spot on when they say she is suddenly realizing these people have not only moved on but they have moved up.

And don't think for a minute JB you could be her next accusation of some sort of abuse. Sorry-- just my opinion.

 

[sunsetbeach]

I really disagree with you about grandpa's in the birthroom. Why should it be only the females who get to see the miracle of birth? My daughter's coach was a male and he was in the birthroom when her baby was born. If the mother to be doesn't mind why should anyone else care? Watching a baby be born is the highest high a person could ever get...it is a miracle beyond miracles and the males can sit by the side of the bed and not the foot of it. Why should they be cheated out of seeing the birth if the mother is alright with it? Times are changing and grandpas and daddys aren't being left out the way they used to be. I have to say that I have witnessed the birth of most of my grandchildren and I have stood at the foot of the bed. Two minutes later I couldn't tell you what my daughter's looked like down there! That is not the focus.

I agree. I have a friend and his wife just had a baby. My friends brother was in the delivery room so I guess it's "to each his own"
I've known several people who have given birth and their Dad was in the room.

 

[mysteriew]

Do I believe it is possible that GA sexually abused KC? Yes, it is always possible. Do I believe it is possible that LA sexually abused KC? Yes, it is always possible. Yes I believe that KC could possibly show some signs of sexual abuse. But unless I hear that KC told someone reputable before her arrest (teacher, counselor etc.) I won't believe that it is anything more than a story she is telling to gain sympathy and promote her defense.

But I also believe that any possible sexual abuse is irrelevant in the trial. She chose to remain living at home even though she was of age and capable of working and earning a living. She chose to leave Caylee alone with GA at times. So if she was abused as she is now saying, the result leads to she chose to endanger Caylee.

Most important I don't believe that even if they establish that someone did abuse her that it should have any bearing on the trial. Kids get abused by their parents every day. But they grow up make their own choices, and they may choose to abuse their own kids or they may choose to protect them. But they don't usually kill them, unless it is to protect themselves from getting caught at something.

Do I believe that she was afraid of her parents would be an important and more relevant question. And no I don't believe she was afraid of her parents. The stories we've heard about their relationship, the videos we've seen leads me to believe she not only wasn't afraid of them, she was able to manipulate them quite well to get what she wanted.

 

[octobermoon]

Thank you... I was beginning to think I was some sort of a "wing nut" because it didn't register to me as creepy. Just because he is in the delivery room does not mean he was watching everything. What if he was behind her or in the corner. There is an awful lot going on in those rooms. Not everyone can be croweded around to see the beautiful baby enter the world.

Oh and by the way, I am beginning to think ICA watched too many Lifetime movies. (I'm not knocking lifetime, I love the network). I think ICA was putting her sad story out there, brother, daddy, mommy is crazy and I must run and take my baby because they are all against me. She was building a story for something, not just for the sake of lying. She thought somehow she could follow through with some sort of accident for the entire family.

She liked looking like she was working hard so hard she could afford a nanny, NOT a babysitter. Many here were spot on when they say she is suddenly realizing these people have not only moved on but they have moved up.

And don't think for a minute JB you could be her next accusation of some sort of abuse. Sorry-- just my opinion.

BBM The movies, soaps, even her imaginary friends.... I think you have hit the nail on the head.

 

[BAHD]

First, I want to say that I am so sorry that you experienced that and I really appreciate it when abuse victims chime in about this case and comment on what they think Casey might have gone through to turn her into such a monster.

I'm glad to know you finally got away from your situation.

I also wanted to share that my father-in-law was actually in my delivery room. I'd have rather it been my father, but, ... that's not how it worked out that day.

My GYN is the one that made it all happen. 20 years ago. I think you'll find, it's not uncommon for a grand to be in the delivery room...

Long story (and it is a looooooong story) is that my MIL died at 6 AM as she was fighting to stay alive to meet our baby but ... she succumbed to terminal lung cancer whilst I labored. My DH's entire family was there at her deathbed (except my DH, who was at my labor-bed). The funeral home came and removed her body by noon. And there were 10 family members, devastated, with nothing to do. My SIL says "lets visit the birthing room". And they all come over. And my GYN says to me "your epidural is working great, you should really think about letting your FIL witness the birth. He and his wife had all these children in a time when we did not let the husband in the birthing room. It would be very soothing for him." And I look at her like she has 4 eyes.

"Are you <expletive deleted> nuts?" And she says "We can make it very modest. Trust me. It's the right thing to do." And without waiting for my anser, my GYN asks my FIL (while I'm still in shock) if he'd like to watch. And he says "why yes I would".

Okay, that's still a long story... sorry.

But the end of it is, We strapped cameras on him, and told him to get busy taking pix. My SIL got jealous so we let her in to hold my one leg up. My DH had my other leg. And my FIL tried to take video and pix at the same time. LOLOL. And when our DD was born at 6 PM, 12 hours after my FIL had held my MIL as she passed ... the GYN handed my brand newborn DD directly to my FIL - before me even.

OMG. His face. I have never regretted it. We gave her my MIL's name. After all, their spirits passed by each other that day.

He tells his story to this day. People sob. He loves me like crazy. Life is good.

Anyway, it's not weird that GA was there -unless Casey didn't want him there.



was that TMI? :blushing:

It's not my fault. This case makes me crazy. :crazy:

Thank you for that very enlightening story. I think in your situation everything turned out kind of extraordinary. That was a neat experience for all involved and you are right as long as the one who is giving birth is ok with it. I probably would not have been, but that is besides the point.

 

[Hisimage]

First, I want to say that I am so sorry that you experienced that and I really appreciate it when abuse victims chime in about this case and comment on what they think Casey might have gone through to turn her into such a monster.

I'm glad to know you finally got away from your situation.

I also wanted to share that my father-in-law was actually in my delivery room. I'd have rather it been my father, but, ... that's not how it worked out that day.

My GYN is the one that made it all happen. 20 years ago. I think you'll find, it's not uncommon for a grand to be in the delivery room...

Long story (and it is a looooooong story) is that my MIL died at 6 AM as she was fighting to stay alive to meet our baby but ... she succumbed to terminal lung cancer whilst I labored. My DH's entire family was there at her deathbed (except my DH, who was at my labor-bed). The funeral home came and removed her body by noon. And there were 10 family members, devastated, with nothing to do. My SIL says "lets visit the birthing room". And they all come over. And my GYN says to me "your epidural is working great, you should really think about letting your FIL witness the birth. He and his wife had all these children in a time when we did not let the husband in the birthing room. It would be very soothing for him." And I look at her like she has 4 eyes.

"Are you <expletive deleted> nuts?" And she says "We can make it very modest. Trust me. It's the right thing to do." And without waiting for my anser, my GYN asks my FIL (while I'm still in shock) if he'd like to watch. And he says "why yes I would".

Okay, that's still a long story... sorry.

But the end of it is, We strapped cameras on him, and told him to get busy taking pix. My SIL got jealous so we let her in to hold my one leg up. My DH had my other leg. And my FIL tried to take video and pix at the same time. LOLOL. And when our DD was born at 6 PM, 12 hours after my FIL had held my MIL as she passed ... the GYN handed my brand newborn DD directly to my FIL - before me even.

OMG. His face. I have never regretted it. We gave her my MIL's name. After all, their spirits passed by each other that day.

He tells his story to this day. People sob. He loves me like crazy. Life is good.

Anyway, it's not weird that GA was there -unless Casey didn't want him there.



was that TMI? :blushing:

It's not my fault. This case makes me crazy. :crazy:

Bless you! That is a great story!

 

[Mountain_Kat]

First, I want to say that I am so sorry that you experienced that and I really appreciate it when abuse victims chime in about this case and comment on what they think Casey might have gone through to turn her into such a monster.

I'm glad to know you finally got away from your situation.

I also wanted to share that my father-in-law was actually in my delivery room. I'd have rather it been my father, but, ... that's not how it worked out that day.

My GYN is the one that made it all happen. 20 years ago. I think you'll find, it's not uncommon for a grand to be in the delivery room...

Long story (and it is a looooooong story) is that my MIL died at 6 AM as she was fighting to stay alive to meet our baby but ... she succumbed to terminal lung cancer whilst I labored. My DH's entire family was there at her deathbed (except my DH, who was at my labor-bed). The funeral home came and removed her body by noon. And there were 10 family members, devastated, with nothing to do. My SIL says "lets visit the birthing room". And they all come over. And my GYN says to me "your epidural is working great, you should really think about letting your FIL witness the birth. He and his wife had all these children in a time when we did not let the husband in the birthing room. It would be very soothing for him." And I look at her like she has 4 eyes.

"Are you <expletive deleted> nuts?" And she says "We can make it very modest. Trust me. It's the right thing to do." And without waiting for my anser, my GYN asks my FIL (while I'm still in shock) if he'd like to watch. And he says "why yes I would".

Okay, that's still a long story... sorry.

But the end of it is, We strapped cameras on him, and told him to get busy taking pix. My SIL got jealous so we let her in to hold my one leg up. My DH had my other leg. And my FIL tried to take video and pix at the same time. LOLOL. And when our DD was born at 6 PM, 12 hours after my FIL had held my MIL as she passed ... the GYN handed my brand newborn DD directly to my FIL - before me even.

OMG. His face. I have never regretted it. We gave her my MIL's name. After all, their spirits passed by each other that day.

He tells his story to this day. People sob. He loves me like crazy. Life is good.

Anyway, it's not weird that GA was there -unless Casey didn't want him there.



was that TMI? :blushing:

It's not my fault. This case makes me crazy. :crazy:

I kinda love you too, after hearing that story, Emma!

 

[Searchfortruth]

IIRC, Casey told TL, about Lee's attempted molestation, before he went to NY on vacation (or was it when he came back) ? My memory is failing me. I wonder when she told Jesse about this incident, what was going on in their relationship at the time, etc...

 

[RaniK]

I'm probably old-fashioned, but I certainly hope my daughter's father-in-law is not in the room when she gives birth. I know my husband won't be. Doesn't sit right with me.